Dads joining coffee group

[CaptainMyCaptainn]

So I strongly suspect I’m being UR and probably need a resounding yes to give me a head wobble.

A weekly coffee / lunch meet up in a pub for mums started a few months ago. It was advertised as mums and mums to be and it’s been a great space to meet other mums and talk about everything from boobs and PND to holidays.

Someone recently asked if there’s a similar group for dads and then all of a sudden, dads were being added to the WhatsApp group and have started to come. Today, one came on his own as he left sleeping baby at home with mum. I personally think it changes the dynamic to have men but I think I’m being UR here. Just hoping that whilst I’m UR, it’s understandable.

Just to add, there are dads who come to other baby groups I go to and it’s completely ok, and I happily chat to them. But it’s this particular one where it’s more of a support group that feels uncomfortable.

@Gizacluethen He needs to find better friends then. Because some men do support their friends. My DP has a good male friend who is very supportive and DP is supportive back.

This sounds like the sort of supportive group for dads as well as mums that I would've loved to have when I started out dadding. There are a lot of groups out there that are billed as being for parents, but in practice if you turn up as the only bloke you're generally unwelcome.

As the primary carer for my kids I've not found dads' groups particularly helpful. They are few and far between (there are none active in my city at the moment) and overwhelmingly attract part-timers doing their one day a week. You're never going to have a discussion there about which is the best local brownie group to send your DD to.

It's seems nuts to me how many people on this thread are arguing for meet-ups and support for parents to be segregated on the basis of sex. Every uni or works social, every sports club or society I've been to in my life has been mixed, so the expectation that you should divide on traditional gender lines after having kids has felt pretty jarring (especially since my SAHD status puts me on the wrong side of that divide!).

Oh I'll pitch in in support of the guy turning up without the baby too. Perhaps he was going to take on more childcare when his DP went back to work and wanted to make some friends and contacts in advance of that. If I'd been in his position and heard of a parenting group that welcomed dads, I would've gone along too...

@Raevsky It is simply not true that all other groups are mixed. I play sports in women-only groups and have taken part in women-only groups such as singing groups.
No, you may not be aware of such groups. That does not mean they do not exist.
And frankly, I do not care about random men. I want a group that works best for me.

@Monopolyiscrap If you’re replying to @Raevsky, I think you mean “And frankly, I do not care about YOU. I want a group that works best for me.”

It's seems nuts to me how many people on this thread are arguing for meet-ups and support for parents to be segregated on the basis of sex

@Raevsky did you not read PPs about breasts and vaginal stitches etc? Mixed sex general parenting groups are entirely valid and nobody has said otherwise, but this was advertised as for mums and mums to be. The OP had a reasonable expectation that she would be able to get support for mum-specific issues. Surely you don't begrudge women the space to discuss their breasts, vaginas, health, birth experience etc without a man such as yourself present?

I think it's a very good thing to have an all (genetically) female group.
Although past childbearing age, I think my daughter's would not want to discuss birth trauma and leaking breasts, sex after birth and 101 other things which come with changing bodies during pregnancy. I'm fairly sure than some women air their irritations about sickness, time off work, their partner and the lack of thought when dealing with a very exhausted mate who is lumbering around in the later stages, still doing the lions share of stuff in the house +++ It's a sounding board and woman to woman conversation. That's just my take on it. It's hardly a meeting of the KKK, just a space to share these things.
Men can have their own meetings.

*correction
Don't think my daughters would want to discuss those things in front of men who are, ostensibly, strangers.

@LoisLane66

*correction Don't think my daughters would want to discuss those things in front of men who are, ostensibly, strangers.

Assuming the meeting isn't in a private room, then is lunchtime at a pub/winebar really the best place to discuss personal things where men (other customers/staff) are likely to be present anyway?

The only people who can say who are welcome or not are the owners of the pub/bar and they may actually prefer that men are there as well.

If you really want to have a private meeting hire a room or have it at someone's home.

@Peas252

Do dads not need support too?

🙄

Maybe the dad has turned up as his wife is having a hard time at home and maybe needs some advice from other women in the group. My kids are adults now so I have no need for these groups now (not that I went to them in the first place found the all female groups a bit nasty and bitchy tbh). I hate that if a guy turns up somewhere like this it's deemed to be all about them and how they are butting in to our space blah blah blah. Maybe they have come to get some advice or help to start up their own group. No wonder that men don't speak out about their feelings. Those of you that have sons will you tell them that their feelings don't matter or not to talk and those of you with daughters will you tell them to dismiss men as their feelings don't matter when it comes to parenting?

did you not read PPs about breasts and vaginal stitches etc?
Surely if that's what your desperate yo discuss, you can take a few women to the other side of the group to talk about it. It can't be the theme that dominates the conversation every single meet up.

I had the best discussions about breastfeeding with my boss at the time. His youngest child was the sane as mine. I went back to work at 5 months and he was very supportive. It felt totally natural to discuss breastfeeding with him. I never felt he was a perv who wanted to hear about my breasts.

Good for you, but other women might feel differently.

@LoisLane66

I think it's a very good thing to have an all (genetically) female group. Although past childbearing age, I think my daughter's would not want to discuss birth trauma and leaking breasts, sex after birth and 101 other things which come with changing bodies during pregnancy. I'm fairly sure than some women air their irritations about sickness, time off work, their partner and the lack of thought when dealing with a very exhausted mate who is lumbering around in the later stages, still doing the lions share of stuff in the house +++ It's a sounding board and woman to woman conversation. That's just my take on it. It's hardly a meeting of the KKK, just a space to share these things. Men can have their own meetings.

How long are they likely to want to discuss pregnancy changes, though? These women have been meeting for months, doesn't the conversation move on? To say nothing of the fact that they are meeting in cafés and restaurants, so it's not as if you can guarantee a male-free environment anyway.

@Peas252

Do dads not need support too?

@Peas252 Not in the same way and not to the same degree, no. Because men haven’t had to go through pregnancy, childbirth, maternity leave and changes to finances, a whole host of societal pressures and demands, etc etc

[quote Monopolyiscrap]@Raevsky It is simply not true that all other groups are mixed. I play sports in women-only groups and have taken part in women-only groups such as singing groups.
No, you may not be aware of such groups. That does not mean they do not exist.
And frankly, I do not care about random men. I want a group that works best for me.[/quote]
Yep I've heard of them. There are also lots of all male groups that I've spend my whole life avoiding in favour of mixed groups.

In this context it just feel odd that now I'm doing a childcare and home making role that's overwhelmingly done by women, I'm expected to only spend time with other blokes.

But it's not true that you're expected to spend time only with other blokes, is it? You're expected to not go to groups specifically targeted at mothers. Men and all parent groups are still open to you.

@Raevsky yeah clear lie. There are mixed groups. Go to them and dads groups. And if other dads are useless parents who you can't ask for advice, then go online.

[quote Monopolyiscrap]@Raevsky yeah clear lie. There are mixed groups. Go to them and dads groups. And if other dads are useless parents who you can't ask for advice, then go online.[/quote]
It kind of proves my point really that my lament that I'm expected to go to dads' groups has had two replies that I should try going to dads' groups.

As for seeking support online, since I've just been called a liar by some random when I've shared my experiences, that's not exactly working out well either :-D

Dad's groups or mixed groups. Why are you forgetting the mixed parts? Is it no use to you if you're invited?

@Raevsky I think previous posters are just highlighting to you that you do have options available to you other than women’s-only groups.

@Raevsky the fact you keep misquoting women, makes me wonder if the issue is with you and not with the fact you are a dad.
Because I would not have any time for a woman who does that either.

And my experience is in mixed groups that dads get more attention and support unless they are arseholes.
So if you take your kids to a mixed group and expect the mums to look after your kids, you will not get a good response.

You sound as if you would be a charming and welcome addition to any women's group Raevsky, I can't imagine why you would think you'd be unwelcome, especially if you bring your current attitude with you. Women breathlessly await your presence. How are your vaginal stitches healing? Any prolapse? Varicose veins? Bring em with you and we'll compare.

@longwayoff

You sound as if you would be a charming and welcome addition to any women's group Raevsky, I can't imagine why you would think you'd be unwelcome, especially if you bring your current attitude with you. Women breathlessly await your presence. How are your vaginal stitches healing? Any prolapse? Varicose veins? Bring em with you and we'll compare.

Totally agree @longwayoff

@vivainsomnia

did you not read PPs about breasts and vaginal stitches etc? Surely if that's what your desperate yo discuss, you can take a few women to the other side of the group to talk about it. It can't be the theme that dominates the conversation every single meet up.

I had the best discussions about breastfeeding with my boss at the time. His youngest child was the sane as mine. I went back to work at 5 months and he was very supportive. It felt totally natural to discuss breastfeeding with him. I never felt he was a perv who wanted to hear about my breasts.

Wtf? It's lovely that you found a friend to discuss your tits with and there's nothing wrong with that friend being male. Please respect that other women may feel differently. Why should they take women to the side to discuss sensitive female issues when they can just join a mum group and discuss anything they like? Taking women off to the side of a group is likely to be rude anyway and I would never dream of doing this in a mixed sex group.