Tinder Swindler - victims should accept some accountability

[sometimespeopletakethepiss]

I can completely understand how these ladies could have fell for this guy BUT what I don't understand is the lack of accountability for their poor judgement.

In my life I would never, ever lend money to anyone unless it is money I could afford to lose - and if I did I feel like I'd have to own it as my own poor judgement.

AIBU to think the ladies should repay the money themselves or declare bankruptcy, not setup a 'go fund me' page and take it as a lesson learned?

Because the women lied to the banks.... they comitted fraud themselves in the eyes of the law. They said to the banks they had spent the money themselves in multiple destinations. How very interesting you don't want to discuss that part though.

They did indeed lie to the banks. The difference between their lies and his though were he convinced them his enemies had attacked his bodyguard and we're going to kill him if they didn't get him that money. Or do we bypass coercion, manipulation and blackmail because them dumb bimbos are at fault more than him?

They do deserve blame for their behaviour , and for people saying how clever he was and look how many women fell for it, I’m sure there were loads of women who didn’t fall for his nonsense. A billionaire with enemies that want to kill him who has one overweight bodyguard and goes on Tinder!!

@shaneTwane

Because the women lied to the banks.... they comitted fraud themselves in the eyes of the law. They said to the banks they had spent the money themselves in multiple destinations. How very interesting you don't want to discuss that part though.

They did indeed lie to the banks. The difference between their lies and his though were he convinced them his enemies had attacked his bodyguard and we're going to kill him if they didn't get him that money. Or do we bypass coercion, manipulation and blackmail because them dumb bimbos are at fault more than him?

I don't believe one single person here has said that the women were in any way as bad as "Simon".

However, they were indeed incredibly stupid to fall for the idea that a billionaire from a family of diamond traders had nobody to rely on when his life was supposedly in danger from his 'enemies', other than girlfriends he'd only known for a few months.

That doesn't justify his behaviour in any way, but had the women been less desperate for the 'billionaire lifestyle', they would not have fallen for this obvious nonsense.

@shaneTwane yes but that's when it quickly got to a drastic stage. BEFORE it got to that stage. What did the women find out about Simon? What did they like about him? Because I didn't observe this from the main 2 women. Are you suggesting the 2 women were as innocent as Ayleen? If so I think you need to re watch The tindler swindler.

Cecile states herself she will still continue with Tinder. Sorry but I would be put off for life....Cecile has met plenty of guys in her life but like another poster said they most likely didn't come with the wealth how can you bypass this to fit your own narrative?

@Theluggage15

They do deserve blame for their behaviour , and for people saying how clever he was and look how many women fell for it, I’m sure there were loads of women who didn’t fall for his nonsense. A billionaire with enemies that want to kill him who has one overweight bodyguard and goes on Tinder!!

That's what I thought. Billionaires that are a target wouldn't be on tinder to start off with plus when he was still active when with Cecile.

@Greenlight4

I'd recommend the sweet Bobby podcast as an example of the drip dip of trust

Ooh I loved that podcast

The first thing I thought when watching it was "there's no such thing as a good deal".

They thought they'd struck gold with someone filthy rich. They absolutely wouldn't have fallen for him had he been a nurse or typical office worker.

All of these ladies wanted the high life and fell hook, line and sinker.

I feel for them in some respects, but they're grown adults and need to take responsibility for being reckless and silly. I can understand a loan or two but it was getting crazy! It took them an awfully long time to wonder what was going on.

Hopefully they learn to not just go after rich guys. There's no such thing as a good deal, after all

Having said that, the bank should also have wondered why there were suddenly so many loans and have put a stop to them before they reached £250k

@EatSleepRantRepeat

I can't believe there are so many people willing to excuse criminal behaviour. What benefit is there to society to blame the victims like this - this isn't a one off, it's a pattern of targeted behaviour and sophisticated fraud.

I'm sure if 1000s of pounds were stolen from your bank account through a cyber security breach that you would expect it back, not for the bank to start picking over every link you've clicked on in the last 12 months. Scam relationships can be just as sophisticated and actually harder to spot because they're coercive.

Very ingenuous. A cyber attack on one's bank account does not equate to stupid lack of personal responsibility. The banks need to stop repaying money to people who lose money through no fault of the bank. I know the twee phrase 'victim blaming' is one of those meant to close down further discussion but the banks have a duty to investigate the circumstances surrounding any claim.

Just started watching.

First girl friend taken 25k cash and gives him her American Express card. WTF !

Stupid or what !

I'm not blind to the idea that I have vulnerabilities, but I don't really think that there's a type of romance scammer who caters to mine.

Posing as having an instawanker billionaire lifestyle would bore me rigid. I wouldn't swipe right, and if I did, I'd be bored by the lifestyle and the resulting chat - he just seemed a dule personality void until he got angry.

I don't think you get romance scammers targeting women who like to read and backpack. Another reason to be pleased that I'm not a people person.

I don't think you get romance scammers targeting women who like to read and backpack.

Why not?

@DrSbaitso

I don't think you get romance scammers targeting women who like to read and backpack.

Why not?

Because they have a brain

Because they have a brain

How do you know none of the victims of this romance scam, or any other, enjoyed reading or backpacking?

It’s not always about “having a brain”. Romance scammers don’t always appear as yacht owning billionaires. They can seem very very normal, sweet guys.

They make perfect partners initially. Then they forget their wallet and borrow a tenner. They’ll pay back a fiver and owe you the rest, so there’s intent shown. To show they’re decent. To make them trust you about it. Then there will be another day when there’s a reason to borrow. But some comes back.

It can happen by stealth. To intelligent but naive people. People like me.

I am not brainless. I’ve got a good degree and pretty intelligent. But I WAS young, in love and naive. Make no mistake I was a VICTIM. I was in no way to blame for someone else’s actions. My mistake was to trust. But it was my first love and who would want to believe that arseholes like that are out there?

It’s almost thirty years later now. I could look at my twenty year old self and cry. She was a victim. No ifs or buts.

By the way I have an extensive library and have done the odd hike. So bang goes your theory.

@Tiredalwaystired

It’s not always about “having a brain”. Romance scammers don’t always appear as yacht owning billionaires. They can seem very very normal, sweet guys.

They make perfect partners initially. Then they forget their wallet and borrow a tenner. They’ll pay back a fiver and owe you the rest, so there’s intent shown. To show they’re decent. To make them trust you about it. Then there will be another day when there’s a reason to borrow. But some comes back.

It can happen by stealth. To intelligent but naive people. People like me.

I am not brainless. I’ve got a good degree and pretty intelligent. But I WAS young, in love and naive. Make no mistake I was a VICTIM. I was in no way to blame for someone else’s actions. My mistake was to trust. But it was my first love and who would want to believe that arseholes like that are out there?

It’s almost thirty years later now. I could look at my twenty year old self and cry. She was a victim. No ifs or buts.

It’s not always about “having a brain”.

It's very rarely about people being merely thick, although obviously we all like to tell ourselves that we're too clever/non shallow/literary/well travelled/whatever ever to fall for a romance scammer/abusive relationship/investment fraud/whatever.

Ironically, simplifying it down to "only thick people" shows a pretty massive lack of understanding as to how these things work.

Of course it's foolish. That's one reason they work; people are often too ashamed to let it be known that they did something so foolish. But these are sophisticated con artists. They're not relying on you merely being thick. They're spinning a complex web and, as you say, they're not all posing as jillionaires. Again, to think that shows a total lack of understanding. Why on earth wouldn't a reader or a backpacker be taken in in the right circumstances? Depending on what you like to read and how/where you like to backpack, you might have your head even further in the clouds than usual. This is the "accountants can't enjoy art" line of reasoning.

Intelligent people frequently do foolish things. (What's intelligence, anyway?) Everyone does foolish things sometimes. It's rarely to this level of consequence but it's itself foolish to imagine that you could never do something daft if the situation were primed for it.

They were nice women and I did feel sorry for them but ultimately it came down to gold digging— they thought he was rich and wanted some of that. I would have smelt a rat instantly they asked me for money— if you are that rich you have access to various sources — and you really wouldn’t ask someone you barely knew . If something looks too good to be true, it usually is.

@Ihatesalad, do you know that saying, ignore everything before the 'but'? That's when you see the real meaning of what's being said.

One thing I wanted to mention too is a cultural thing- two of the women were Scandinavian and living in Copenhagen I can tell you there is a great deal of trust here, for instance we rent a really nice house— we were not referenced- I kept waiting for the agent to ask for references and it never came— same with when I sorted house insurance— they insured me from day 1 and just sent a bill about a month later— no ‘give me your card details now’ etc. I still have little sympathy but do suspect that the average Scandi has far more trust than the average female Brit !

I agree op, unless they were particularly vulnerable eg learning disability it is up to us to do due diligence. I have done old and I googled dates, made sure they were who they said they were - dp admitted he did the same thing for me when we first met. We do not share finances even 2 years on, and certainly don't lend money

I think they thought it was the start of Fifty Shades of Grey

I feel we live in a world now where situations are always someone else to blame and whilst this guy was an evil man, ultimately you have to protect yourself and make wise decisions to avoid these scenarios and I just don't feel like any accountability whatsoever was accepted by the victims

Wise words, OP - unfashionable perhaps, but wise all the same

@popcorn925

I think they thought it was the start of Fifty Shades of Grey

That started with him buying her a car.

It was absolute shite, don't get me wrong, but it didn't start like this. And romance scams long precede it.

If romance scams did prey on the dimwitted, though, Ana would have been bankrupt by chapter two.

@Ihatesalad

One thing I wanted to mention too is a cultural thing- two of the women were Scandinavian and living in Copenhagen I can tell you there is a great deal of trust here, for instance we rent a really nice house— we were not referenced- I kept waiting for the agent to ask for references and it never came— same with when I sorted house insurance— they insured me from day 1 and just sent a bill about a month later— no ‘give me your card details now’ etc. I still have little sympathy but do suspect that the average Scandi has far more trust than the average female Brit !

That reminds me of my experience hiring a car in NZ.

I'd recently hired a car in the UK, and received the full spiel pushing the additional insurance because they COULD and WOULD pursue me for each and every tiny scratch.

In New Zealand, they were flat baffled as to why I was taking so many photos of the car. I took it back with a 1cm chip out of the paintwork that we didn't get charged for.

I know which I prefer!