DP has taken 9 month old DD outside without a coat on

[astroboy45]

Posting on MN because I'd just like to hear the opinions of others.

DP always gets DD in the morning so I'm able to sleep in until 8:30/9ish. I wasn't really feeling that tired so I came out of the bedroom to see no one was in the living room and had assumed they went for a walk or went to the shops or something. When DP gets back and pushes the pushchair in the living room, I see both of DDs coats on the table. I said 'what coat did you put on her' and he just looked at me like he'd been caught out and didn't say anything. As he's taking DD out of the buggy, I can see she's just in her sleepsuit. I said, 'you took the baby outside without a coat on??' Bearing in mind he has a nice warm coat on himself AND a hat. Yet DD has been taken outside with just a vest and a sleepsuit? He also picked one of the lighter covers to put on her which was barely on her. When he gave her to me, her hands, face and neck were freezing. I'm not exaggerating, she was honestly so cold.

My issue is, things like this isn't a one off. Last month I went to my mum's house and stayed over for one night just to have a break as I was exhausted. When I came back something told me to ask DP if he'd left DD alone at any point. One time I was at an appointment and called to check they were okay, DP said 'yeah she's fine she's sleeping, I'm just going downstairs to take the bin out.' I obviously told him he shouldn't leave her but that's just always stuck in my mind. Anyways! I asked him if he'd left her alone and he said he went across the road to Sainsbury's when she was asleep in the night. I said 'why the hell did you leave her? We didn't need formula, nappy or wipes so what was so important that you needed to get??' He told me he went to get Ben & Jerry's ice cream😕

I just don't understand. You always see people being told they're being precious and whatnot but this guy is so lax when it comes to DD that it's honestly a joke. It's like he's not a real person and doesn't consider ANY dangerous when it comes to DD. Taking her outside without a coat on in the middle of Winter, leaving her by herself to go and get ice cream. It just sounds like some sort of prank. I also had a post not long ago about him and his mum turning DDs rear facing car seat to front face when that's not even something that can be done???

I seriously need help. We're expecting again and I just don't know how to get him to understand that careless behaviour doesn't work when you have kids. He always used to be extra careful with DD and now it's as if he thinks she's 15 years old and doesn't need to be properly cared for or something. Am I the one being precious/hormonal or what?? Arghhh help me MN lol

I'm shocked at the amount of people saying it's mild out. Yes, it's mild for February, that doesn't mean a 9 month old BABY doesn't need a coat. She didn't even have a jumper on! When we go out we are walking and creating heat, a baby is sat still in a buggy which feels significantly colder. I would be upset if it were my baby.

This is probably more common than you think. I had a c section and was in hospital for three days. My husband took my first child to nursery every morning (which he hasn't done before). For some reason he decided it was okay to send my son in the morning with his bag of clothes and just wearing a nappy. He later explained to me it was a warm three days...

@HowlingKale

SleepyRich is the risk of a traffic accident not uppermost in your mind because of your job attending catastrophic incidents? To me the risk of a baby choking or even just crying out and feeling alone for too long outweighs the very small albeit potentially deadly risk that I'll be in a traffic accident with them in the pram.

There certainly a risk in bias due to what we see on the job, and RTCs are awful it's so easy to forget how fragile we are when in a metal box.

We do goto what feels like a similar measure of suspected chokings though, unfortunately it's that the baby is found deceased by the parents at the next check, choking is often silent so you wouldn't really be aware unless you were watching them in the room. That's why I feel there's a disparity in that there wouldn't be much judgement in putting a 9 month old to bed and then going downstairs to watch TV, sleeping in a separate room, or walking across the road for 5 minutes in that if something spontaneously life threatening were to occur (thank fully very rare) the outcome would be the same in all the instances unless you are sat watching them.

Don't get me wrong i'm not advocating that it is totally fine to goto the shops in this instance, just regards the disparity in statements regard the risk. I think it's more of a cultural practice, i.e. in Scandinavian countries I've heard it's considered quite normal to leave young babies outside a cafe to sleep whilst parents are inside having a coffee. Obviously that's not going to be condoned here in the UK.

@Dutchesss

I'm shocked at the amount of people saying it's mild out. Yes, it's mild for February, that doesn't mean a 9 month old BABY doesn't need a coat. She didn't even have a jumper on! When we go out we are walking and creating heat, a baby is sat still in a buggy which feels significantly colder. I would be upset if it were my baby.

Agreed.

The bins wouldn't bother me but I'd be really angry about the other issues.

@astroboy45

What actually is the point of him OP?

I'm seriously starting to ask myself the same thing😒

The trouble is, you only know about what you know about.

What about what you don't know?

@MikeWozniaksMohawk

I remember your post about the car seat. That combined with disappearing off to sainsburys, I’d be reading him the riot act. Either he acts responsibly or you leave. With the baby. And he will never be left alone with either of his kids. He needs to shape up and now.

But he would be.

With his irresponsible mother

I would speak to your HV and see if there's a community nursery nurse on their team who could do a home visit with you and talk to him about childcare/safety basics.
He definitely needs information on - car seat safety, dressing baby appropriately for the weather and the law around leaving babies home alone.
I imagine he also needs to be robustly informed about supervision needs (he can't go for a nap if he's doing solo childcare), food safety (cutting up grapes, not giving her lollies or boiled sweets) and probably bath safety too (he can't leave her alone in the bath even for a second, even if she's in a bath seat).

Explain to the health visitor what the issues have been so far, and make a list of anything else you can foresee being a problem.

@busyeatingbiscuits

I would speak to your HV and see if there's a community nursery nurse on their team who could do a home visit with you and talk to him about childcare/safety basics. He definitely needs information on - car seat safety, dressing baby appropriately for the weather and the law around leaving babies home alone. I imagine he also needs to be robustly informed about supervision needs (he can't go for a nap if he's doing solo childcare), food safety (cutting up grapes, not giving her lollies or boiled sweets) and probably bath safety too (he can't leave her alone in the bath even for a second, even if she's in a bath seat).

Explain to the health visitor what the issues have been so far, and make a list of anything else you can foresee being a problem.

Wait! There are far worse actions than lack of coat here. Time to embarrass this person op. Ask them if they need a picture book about what to wear outside in the winter. Ask them what they think happens in high speed car crash? I would be having many sarcastic conversations with this person.

If he has any expensive hobbies I’d be suggesting that money is diverted into paying for competent childminding help so that you can get a break. Or maybe he could take on a second job to pay for that?

After the car crash and fire safety videos I’d suggest a couple of episodes of Some Mothers Do ‘Ave ‘Em because he sounds about as attractive as Frank Spencer.

Even when it came to the car seat situation, when I pointed out how dangerous it was and how DD actually could have been killed. He said his sister was sitting in the back with her so she would have been fine..?

I hope you told him that doesn't even make any fucking sense. Does he also neglect to use a seatbelt whenever he's riding in a car with his sister? Seeing as she's got some kind of superpower that stops people from dying in car crashes, I mean.

He's negligent and it's scary.
If you leave him he'll get alone time with your children. He'll neglect them without you knowing.

Does he work? I only ask because it seems he's always there to do mornings.
Do you work?

I've seen references to the car seat thread - is this the mommy's boy who'll put his baby in danger if she says so?

I've asked him to do antenatal class with me or parenting classes and he says he doesn't need them. I'm actually starting a 6 week antenatal class again tomorrow and will be speaking to him saying that he needs to join me. I honestly believe he will wait until something happens to DD due to his lack of care to start buckling up his ideas.

I think you have to tell him that parenting classes simply are not negotiable: recent history has shown that he is literally incapable of keeping his children safe, so unless he goes to parenting classes and starts demonstrating that he knows how to act like a normal, responsible human being, he won't be living with his children.

babies are robust

I know what you're trying to say here (i.e. don't wrap them in cotton wool), but the fact remains that the foetal skull remains a foetal skull for a long time, and it is delicate. The rear fontanelle doesn't close up fully till around the 18 month mark.

An infant's physiology means that it is susceptible to extremes of temperature.

It's really Parenting 101 to (a) not want to risk killing your baby; and (b) not wanting to cause your baby discomfort or potential harm.

The car seat nonsense and the lack of warm clothes for a baby while daddy gets to wear a coat and hat is a massive Fuck You not just to the OP but to the baby herself, and I can quite understand the OP's frustration, upset and anger.

@Jvg33

This is probably more common than you think. I had a c section and was in hospital for three days. My husband took my first child to nursery every morning (which he hasn't done before). For some reason he decided it was okay to send my son in the morning with his bag of clothes and just wearing a nappy. He later explained to me it was a warm three days...

He brought the child to nursery wearing a nappy and nothing else?

He sounds scarily neglectful and lacking in any common sense. Ditto his equally stupid but controlling mother.

I remember your thread about the car seat. He honestly sounds worse every time you post about him.

I don't know how things would stand it you left him, you would have to be very sure that he would only get supervised access, but would you be able to stipulate that it should be in a contact centre and not with his mother or sister? I can see the problems others are talking about with this, and I am sure you have thought about them too. Maybe advice from your health visitor might help here?

You definitely have to work out what your options are here, and then absolutely read him the riot act.

Don't let him whine about never having handled babies before and not having experience etc. There was a first time for all of us and we managed to keep our babies safe using common sense, which seems to be in dangerously short supply for this man.

I am left wondering whether he actually has a brain at all!

Is he Special?

Cant get over an adult putting on their own coat because it's cold and not thinking their baby might need extra layers too...

He sounds like an idiot with no sense of embarrassment or remorse for the various times he's made your baby at risk or uncomfortable.

I'm wearing a hoodie and coat on a quick coat walk today in a relatively mild part of the UK. I would be freezing in just a top. For those saying it's not something bad / not that cold... OP says her baby was freezing to touch.

Suggest an accompanied trip to the gp to get him assessed!!!

Since he doesn't see the need for coats..maybe his should go missing! Id tear his head off for any of those things, just a few months ago 4 toddlers died in a house fire home alone..hes not fit to mind his own daughter, I wouldn't be leaving her with him again or the newborn when born...

Why have you got pregnant with him again, he sounds useless at best, neglectful at worst. I have a baby similar age I'd go mental if my husband took him out in the middle of winter in just a babygrow, as for going to the shop and leaving the baby in the house, christ what's he thinking?? Even my 4 year old knows our 10 month old needs to be wrapped up to go out and not left in the house alone!

I honestly can't get my head around having another baby with him though???

@WindInTheWillows7

Can you just talk to him about this in a non-confrontational way? Make it clear you don't want to harangue him or have an argument, but that you have some genuine concerns that you need to talk about. He's your partner, presumably he loves you and would want to know if something was wrong in the family that he can do something about. I really think couples need to be able to have difficult conversations without being scared of hurting the other person or causing an argument. Do it "out of context", ie. not as a reaction to something in the moment, but say "I have some things that are worrying me, and I'd really like to talk them through with you properly sometime. I think it's important we are on the same page about these things before the baby arrives". Tell him candidly what your concerns are. Suggest you come up with some clear, shared rules when it comes to the children, so there aren't grey areas - not leaving them alone, etc. I find that if you approach problems diplomatically, don't attack the other person (like, "you need to sort yourself out!") but instead make it clear that you are addressing this issue for the sake of a safe and harmonious family life, not because you want to bring them down, people are pretty responsive.

@WindInTheWillows7 thank you for this. Another great point and a sort of different viewpoint. I think this is the way I will handle it as my other insults haven't been clear enough. Clearly I need to have a calm sit down conversation like an adult to get my point across

@Nanny0gg this is it. I don't even want to think about all the things that may have happened when I haven't been here🤦‍♀️

@DePfeffoff

I've asked him to do antenatal class with me or parenting classes and he says he doesn't need them. I'm actually starting a 6 week antenatal class again tomorrow and will be speaking to him saying that he needs to join me. I honestly believe he will wait until something happens to DD due to his lack of care to start buckling up his ideas.

I think you have to tell him that parenting classes simply are not negotiable: recent history has shown that he is literally incapable of keeping his children safe, so unless he goes to parenting classes and starts demonstrating that he knows how to act like a normal, responsible human being, he won't be living with his children.

@DePfeffoff you're definitely right on that front. He will be coming along to the antenatal classes with me. Plus they're virtual and is at a time when he has a day off so there's literally no excuse

Yes. Men do this often. They are shit at this stuff.

BIL will put a nice cosy hat and coat on himself and pop his toddler to play in a puddle of water wearing just a tshirt and nappy and not see anything wrong with this picture.

After swimming on a cold day DH will wash and dry every inch of himself before it occurs to him to perhaps help his naked shivering child.

But the one that really got me was watching a dad with a baby in a heat wave arrive at the park, and the Dad carefully put on his sunblock, sunhat, and sunglasses, and then took the (bald) baby off for what was clearly to be a long walk (in back carry thing) and within minutes the baby was crying, presumably from the headache I’m sure was forming.

It’s very upsetting.