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AIBU?

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Original poster

Not all men..

479 replies

Jenna19871 · 05/02/2022 23:18

Spoke to DH about this tonight and he said ‘it’s not all men though is it?’

He’s right. It’s not all men. But I have experienced so much shit that wouldn’t be accepted nowadays (not tragic shit but just not acceptable)

At 19 my drink was drugged with rohypnol in the local night club, thankfully I didn’t drink it as it tasted ‘sour’. It was caught on CCTV. The man was banned for 2 weeks. 2 weeks!!!

I’ve taken the tube and had men put their hands on my butt/legs etc with me trying to move away. I didn’t shout, I should have!

None of these are awful stories but it just goes to show that when people say it’s not all men...but it is most women.

OP posts:
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5
Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 20:11

How many of those murdered were also men? How many of those assaulted were also men?

Who’s doing the murdering? Who’s doing the assaulting?

You can whine as much as you like, this is a man problem and you know it.

Ohmy2022 · 13/02/2022 20:11

@OneTC

I never really @ people on here but *@Ohmy2022* you make me feel embarrassed to be a bloke
What have I said to make feel embarrassed
cuno · 13/02/2022 20:12

@Youarefakenews
Jump up and down? Women often freeze in fear! And when we do tell people we are often not believed, have our experiences minimised, told it could have been worse, and so on, with no action or help.

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 20:13

[quote Pumperthepumper]@Youarefakenews

Is that what you would do when your boss’s erection was pressed against your arse? You never said.[/quote]
It would depend entirely on if anyone could see it happen? The first thing I (and most normal people) would do is immediately move away.

But seeing as you are labouring the point, what would YOU do?

cuno · 13/02/2022 20:14

How many of those murdered were also men? How many of those assaulted were also men?
What's your point? It's not 93% women murdering men is it?!

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 20:14

@Youarefakenews

You can’t move away. You’re frozen in fear.

And nobody is coming to help you. All those Good Men pretending they don’t see a problem here. And then blaming you for not making more fuss and damaging their Good Man, Nice Man image. Shame on you.

Exdonkeylover · 13/02/2022 20:14

Well start at the bottom with education and at the top with criminal offences and punishment.

cuno · 13/02/2022 20:15

@Youarefakenews

Why are you tying yourself in knots to avoid answering the question? Just take the question as face value and answer it! Is it because you know it'll make you look silly?

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 20:15

@Pumperthepumper

The reality is that most Women don't let anyone know during the assault.

Absolutely, categorically false.

Really? Going by the claims in this thread, unwanted touching is going on all around us all the time in clubs and bars. Yet I cannot think of ever seeing somebody jump up and tell the room it is happening.
Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 20:16

@Youarefakenews

But you said you wouldn’t do anything anyway, so what difference does it make?

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 20:17

[quote Pumperthepumper]@Youarefakenews

You can’t move away. You’re frozen in fear.

And nobody is coming to help you. All those Good Men pretending they don’t see a problem here. And then blaming you for not making more fuss and damaging their Good Man, Nice Man image. Shame on you.[/quote]
So your frozen to the spot. The chances are these Good men have no idea anything untoward is happening.

As I suggested earlier to get an insight into what people actually see while going about their daily lives. Try the lying in the High Street experiment I outlined above.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 20:18

@Youarefakenews

If you feel you are being touched innaproproiately jump up and down and let someone know. The reality is that most Women don't let anyone know during the assault.

I mean... you heard it here "ladies", we just aren't making enough fuss.

But when we come onto the Internet and say we need men to help us aka make a fuss we are told that we are making too much fuss and doing it at the wrong time so it doesn't count.

So tale as old as time, we can't win.

Going by the claims in this thread, unwanted touching is going on all around us all the time in clubs and bars. Yet I cannot think of ever seeing somebody jump up and tell the room it is happening.

So you genuinely don't believe that unwanted touching of women is going on all the time in clubs and bars?! You genuinely don't believe that?!

Your wife must be frequently embarrassed about your approach to the critical issue of harassment and violence against women and girls.

Exdonkeylover · 13/02/2022 20:18

Well 70% or 90%, i take your point, but in relation to the question, because either way, it's a male dominated issue in respect to men commiting serious offences.

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 20:19

@Youarefakenews

But the Good Men do know it’s happening, because women are telling them. And Good Men are saying ‘if you had made more fuss I would have helped, luckily my female partner is here to help you’.

cuno · 13/02/2022 20:19

@Youarefakenews
I've been frozen to the spot while being raped. Do you not understand how trauma responses work?

SpinsForGin · 13/02/2022 20:20

How many of those murdered were also men? How many of those assaulted were also men?

But men are still committing these crimes. It's still a men problem.

Two men a week aren't being killed by their female partners in their own home are they??

Exdonkeylover · 13/02/2022 20:22

I can see where you're coming from, but the initial point raised is that men commit these offences, why don't other men step in.

myrtleWilson · 13/02/2022 20:22

Any intervention if you were ever inclined to do so which I highly doubt @Youarefakenews doesn't have to be "Hey, man, take your hands off this damsel or you shall be challenged to a duel at dawn". It could be something as simple as saying " Oh Joanne - how wonderful to bump into you - its been ages - Jessica was just mentioning you the other day". If "Joanne" is happy with the hand on her arse she'll say something like "I'm sorry you must be mistaken - I'm not Joanne, must have a doppelgänger". If "Joanne" isn't happy with hand on arse she'll probably say "Dave, oh my god - how wonderful. Yes I saw Jess the other day - had a good old catch up" Then you fake talk creating a new "bubble" which allows "Joanne" to shift position, you can take up a new position blocking arse man and all is good...

Perhaps even you may be able to manage that distraction/intervention?

cuno · 13/02/2022 20:24

@Exdonkeylover

Well 70% or 90%, i take your point, but in relation to the question, because either way, it's a male dominated issue in respect to men commiting serious offences.
7% of murderers are women and 30% of murderers are women is a big fucking difference and you know it. Even now you infactually state an extra 3%. Still a difference between 7% and 10%. Please stop consistently lying and implying there are far more women taking part in violent crime and murders than there are, because those false stats and figures get used against us to show we're almost just as bad!

Yes of course it's a society issue, and if you read the full thread you would see there is no debate about that!

MarieIVanArkleStinks · 13/02/2022 20:24

You're so lacking in awareness that you want women to list the ways in which men make them feel uncomfortable, harassed and objectified? It's almost as if you enjoy hearing individual accounts.

Bingo, @youvegottenminuteslynn, you've very likely hit the nail on the head.

There are a good many of these on this site. And they invariably pop up on threads like this, or threads where women are bravely sharing their stories (some of them tragically awful) of abuse at the hands of men.

They home in like bees to a honey jar. It's pitifully transparent.

ldontWanna · 13/02/2022 20:25

@Youarefakenews you're not a good man. You're not even an average man.

You're a scavenger. Using predators to fill your needs...to give you respectability, to make you look/feel better. And then you wash your hands off the whole thing because "I didn't do anything wrong". No ,you might not get the prey, but you're more than happy to pick off the spoils of another, crowing above the decayed carcass that is women and girls safety and dignity.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 20:25

The first thing I (and most normal people) would do is immediately move away. But seeing as you are labouring the point, what would YOU do?

As a woman, because I'm statistically likely to be physically weaker than almost all adult males, my instincts would take over and risk assess. This means I would either fight, flight or freeze. All are equally valid and equally likely outcomes.

Due to the imbalance of strength I might not be able to 'immediately move away' as you suggest. My brain may therefore decide its best to try to distract the person with conversation (while my brain is still risk assessing and trying to think of ways out) in order to move away without relying being able to overpower the person; something you on the other hand could likely do as you're a man.

Due to previous trauma of being raped, my body may freeze out of pure and utter terror (please don't belittle this as I worry you will - it's a common trauma response) forcing me to experience essentially a public sexual assault.

You saying 'normal people' would simply 'immediately move away' is an example of your privilege as a man. You have the ability to do that in most situations. We have the ability to do that in many, many fewer situations than you. Hopefully you can at least get that?

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 20:30

@myrtleWilson

Any intervention if you were ever inclined to do so which I highly doubt *@Youarefakenews* doesn't have to be "Hey, man, take your hands off this damsel or you shall be challenged to a duel at dawn". It could be something as simple as saying " Oh Joanne - how wonderful to bump into you - its been ages - Jessica was just mentioning you the other day". If "Joanne" is happy with the hand on her arse she'll say something like "I'm sorry you must be mistaken - I'm not Joanne, must have a doppelgänger". If "Joanne" isn't happy with hand on arse she'll probably say "Dave, oh my god - how wonderful. Yes I saw Jess the other day - had a good old catch up" Then you fake talk creating a new "bubble" which allows "Joanne" to shift position, you can take up a new position blocking arse man and all is good...

Perhaps even you may be able to manage that distraction/intervention?

This.

The amount of times I (a woman) have spotted a woman I think may be uncomfortable, but have no solid proof she is, and have instinctively gone over and said "oh my god it's been ages!" or when it's more obvious harassment especially outside clubs / pubs, a "Olivia, John asked if you're coming back inside now?" etc.

I enjoyed a bloke obviously wanting to do this, but not wanting to further frighten a woman being harassed and him panicking and shouting over to her "your mate's looking for you" and pointing at me and giving me 'please play along!' eyes so I could pick up from there and make sure she was ok. That's what an ally looks like.

Not someone who says "but what if that puts me in the firing line" when discussing reporting sexual harassment of colleagues.

OneTC · 13/02/2022 22:26

I've stepped in, for men, for women, you walk past something and you hear someone in distress and that's going to stick with you. I am not big, not good at violence

OneTC · 13/02/2022 22:28

I've stepped in, for men, for women, you walk past something and you hear someone in distress and that's going to stick with you. I am not big, not good at violence

//Hit post too early

That was in reference to people saying they don't step in on the street to couples or men and women fighting for fear of it turning on them