Page 15 | Not all men..

Jenna19871 · 2022-02-05T23:18:34+00:00

Spoke to DH about this tonight and he said ‘it’s not all men though is it?’ He’s right. It’s not all men. But I have experienced so much shit that wouldn’t be accepted nowadays (not tragic shit but just not acceptable) At 19 my drink was drugged with rohypnol in the local night club, thankfully I didn’t drink it as it tasted ‘sour’. It was caught on CCTV. The man was banned for 2 weeks. 2 weeks!!! I’ve taken the tube and had men put their hands on my butt/legs etc with me trying to move away. I didn’t shout, I should have! None of these are awful stories but it just goes to show that when people say it’s not all men...but it is most women.

ldontWanna · 13/02/2022 19:31

I'm a nice guy, but only if it's easy and it doesn't inconvenience me in any way.

That's why "nice" guys like and promote NAMALT they use it as a cover to show off their niceness and claim they're better,they're worthy, they're not like the other guys. After all they're not perpetrators of murder,rape or physical assault, so they must be nice. It isn't hard to be nice when the bar is so low.

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:31

How do I let that bigger stronger Good man know I am uncomfortable?

No, the Good Man isn’t stronger or bigger. It’s the man with his hand moving towards your crotch who is stronger and bigger than you. You’re intimidated and afraid. Do you want the Good Man to say ‘I’m a Good Man, and not all men are like that one who’s assaulting you’?

cuno · 13/02/2022 19:32

@Youarefakenews

So let me get this straight. Your justification for not stepping in is because she might want it? She might want a man's hand on her arse, she might want her boss's crotch pressed up on her, and she might want her colleague to photoshop her face into porn?

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 19:33

[quote youvegottenminuteslynn]@Youarefakenews

What do you suggest I as a fellow employee do about it, without putting myself in the firing line and lose job security?

I suggest that if you believe yourself to be a 'good guy' you stand up and be counted and report a colleague being harassed and objectified even if (shock horror) it may mean you're in the firing line!!!!

Do you really only do 'good' things if there is no chance that doing so may have negative consequences for you personally? Wow.

Again what do you suggest I do about it? I am a fellow employee, didn't put the picture up, think it looks the work of a pathetic little boy and will say so

See above. You need to realise also that these kind of examples aren't just pathetic, they are frightening for us. Because we are being objectified in a professional environment. Being turned into sex objects rather than colleagues. And guys like you who claim to be 'good guys' don't see this as worth reporting and even if they do think it should be reported, they aren't willing to do so if it may cause fall out for them (as illustrated in the earlier part of your post).[/quote]
Yes let me go home to my Wife and children and say, don't worry dear I've been fired but it's OK we can live off the glowing affection of the Woman I stuck up for against the Boss.

As for the picture scenario, if Pumper wishes to report it, then she of course should do and I would support her, But why should I be the one to make the report?

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:34

But why should I be the one to make the report?

Because you’re a Good Man. Supposedly.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 19:35

[quote cuno]@Youarefakenews

So let me get this straight. Your justification for not stepping in is because she might want it? She might want a man's hand on her arse, she might want her boss's crotch pressed up on her, and she might want her colleague to photoshop her face into porn?[/quote]
And don't forget even if that isn't the case, he still won't step in if it means he might be 'in the firing line' himself whether professionally or physically.

So his excuses are 1. The woman might like it and 2. He won't step in if doing so isn't in his own best interests personally.

Jesus wept. Depressing isn't it.

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:36

It’s also such a massive self-own. It would be laughable if it wasn’t how the vast majority of men see women.

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 19:37

[quote cuno]@Youarefakenews

So let me get this straight. Your justification for not stepping in is because she might want it? She might want a man's hand on her arse, she might want her boss's crotch pressed up on her, and she might want her colleague to photoshop her face into porn?[/quote]
Incorrect, my justification for not stepping in is that in the very short time in the bar I don't know the circumstances between you. You may be man and wife for all I know.

I am not the one being touched by the bosses crotch, I know nothing about it. What do you expect me to do?

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 19:38

@Youarefakenews

You're not the good man you believe you are if this thread is representative of how you think.

Honestly, you're really not. I know that's probably a bit shit to hear but it's true.

Although because it's us silly 'ladies' saying so I'm sure you'll be angry rather than sad or reflective about it so no harm done to you eh? Just the way you like it.

cuno · 13/02/2022 19:38

But if men as a group did step in such as reporting sexism and misogyny at work, then it wouldn't be remotely socially acceptable to do any of these things and it would happen far less often.

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:39

@Youarefakenews

You are the one being touched up by your male boss. I made that very clear. You’re just trying to distance yourself from it because you don’t like the idea.

OneTC · 13/02/2022 19:40

I never really @ people on here but @Ohmy2022 you make me feel embarrassed to be a bloke

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 19:41

@Pumperthepumper

How do I let that bigger stronger Good man know I am uncomfortable?

No, the Good Man isn’t stronger or bigger. It’s the man with his hand moving towards your crotch who is stronger and bigger than you. You’re intimidated and afraid. Do you want the Good Man to say ‘I’m a Good Man, and not all men are like that one who’s assaulting you’?

How do you tell at that bar that I am uncomfortable? How do you know that the big guy is not my boyfriend?

Appreciate we all make judgement calls on what we witness and can only act on information we know to be true.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 19:42

I am not the one being touched by the bosses crotch, I know nothing about it. What do you expect me to do?

Ask the women afterwards if she was ok? Tell her that you're happy to report what you saw as a witness? Report it yourself to HR?

You said earlier you would do nothing because doing something would put you in the firing line. So you're not an ally to women, you're a white knight who only 'helps' us when it gets you glory and praise rather than potentially negative consequences.

The fact you actually typed "I am not the one being touched by the bosses crotch" is embarrassing for you. You asked for examples of where you should step in. You were given one. Your response is essentially not my dick touching someone, not me being touched by someone... so not my problem.

If you're not directly the victim you don't want to help the victim. Own it. It's your prerogative. But you don't get to hold that belief and also the belief that you're one of the 'good guys'.

cuno · 13/02/2022 19:43

Incorrect, my justification for not stepping in is that in the very short time in the bar I don't know the circumstances between you. You may be man and wife for all I know.
And so what? If a man stepped in if they thought my partner was a stranger sexually assaulting me, I wouldn't be the least bit offended and actually quite happy to see it! At worst you might offend someone (but I can assure you most couples wouldn't care). If you don't say or do anything then at worst you are turning a blind eye to sexual assault and enabling a culture that allows this to happen so often?

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:43

@Youarefakenews

Because I’m telling you you’re not. You’re intimidated and afraid. What do you want Good Man to do? Why is this so difficult for you to answer?

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 19:44

[quote Pumperthepumper]@Youarefakenews

You are the one being touched up by your male boss. I made that very clear. You’re just trying to distance yourself from it because you don’t like the idea.[/quote]
OK I misunderstood. I have my boss rubbing his crotch up against me. Just like you, I don't like it. What should anyone else in the office do about it? They haven't seen it.

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:45

@Youarefakenews

Again, for the fourth? time: what do you want them to do? What do you want Good Man to do?

cuno · 13/02/2022 19:45

OK I misunderstood. I have my boss rubbing his crotch up against me. Just like you, I don't like it. What should anyone else in the office do about it? They haven't seen it.

Who said they haven't seen it??

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 19:45

@cuno

But if men as a group did step in such as reporting sexism and misogyny at work, then it wouldn't be remotely socially acceptable to do any of these things and it would happen far less often.

Exactly this.

Can you not see this @Youarefakenews?

If every male in the office reported every instance of sexual harassment they saw in the office then the company would be far more likely to change the company culture and discipline / fire people for being inappropriate.

Instead loads of them, you included by your own admission, wouldn't step up and do so in case it put them 'in the firing line'.

Bit pathetic really isn't it.

Ohmy2022 · 13/02/2022 19:45

@Pumperthepumper

I see you deliberately missed this out

And I'm not responsible the action of bad men . But that hasn't stopped me intervening

If your going quote me quote the whole thing.

@cuno

I was only mildly offended by the person who said it always men .fair enough the poster wrote "in her experience its not all men but it's always men" maybe i was wrong to jump on this thread about my experience. Everything else was right . You cant argue against the fact some men do commit some atrocities. And I havent tried to. I've not defended the wrong doings of other men. I've not called anyone names. I've not popped off at any one either
I'm not deliberately trying rile any up . Although it appears I have done and do sincerely apologise for that

@Youarefakenews

The boss in this situation is a complete . What do you suggest I as a fellow employee do about it, without putting myself in the firing line and lose job security?

I would rather lose my job knowing that I tried to do something.

I cant stand with on this

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 19:45

@cuno

Incorrect, my justification for not stepping in is that in the very short time in the bar I don't know the circumstances between you. You may be man and wife for all I know. And so what? If a man stepped in if they thought my partner was a stranger sexually assaulting me, I wouldn't be the least bit offended and actually quite happy to see it! At worst you might offend someone (but I can assure you most couples wouldn't care). If you don't say or do anything then at worst you are turning a blind eye to sexual assault and enabling a culture that allows this to happen so often?

You are completely incorrect. Ask anyone who has interfered in a couples interactions, especially where alcohol is involved and they will tell you what a stupid move that is. It invariably ends up in both parties turning on you.

Pumperthepumper · 13/02/2022 19:46

If you're not directly the victim you don't want to help the victim. Own it. It's your prerogative. But you don't get to hold that belief and also the belief that you're one of the 'good guys'.

This is so well put. @Youarefakenews @Ohmy2022 and @Random65 - assuming you’re all three individual men peddling the same shit - I hope you see this.

Youarefakenews · 13/02/2022 19:48

@youvegottenminuteslynn

I am not the one being touched by the bosses crotch, I know nothing about it. What do you expect me to do?

Ask the women afterwards if she was ok? Tell her that you're happy to report what you saw as a witness? Report it yourself to HR?

You said earlier you would do nothing because doing something would put you in the firing line. So you're not an ally to women, you're a white knight who only 'helps' us when it gets you glory and praise rather than potentially negative consequences.

The fact you actually typed "I am not the one being touched by the bosses crotch" is embarrassing for you. You asked for examples of where you should step in. You were given one. Your response is essentially not my dick touching someone, not me being touched by someone... so not my problem.

If you're not directly the victim you don't want to help the victim. Own it. It's your prerogative. But you don't get to hold that belief and also the belief that you're one of the 'good guys'.

Read what I wrote again. In this scenario I have no knowledge and incident has happened.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 13/02/2022 19:48

@Youarefakenews

Ask anyone who has interfered in a couples interactions, especially where alcohol is involved and they will tell you what a stupid move that is. It invariably ends up in both parties turning on you.

Ask "anyone"? My other half would be pleased someone was checking I was ok.

PP said their other half wouldn't be annoyed either.

Don't judge others by how you would react to something. I think it's clear that you'd be doing a 'I'm not like that, how dare you accuse me' type rant if someone asked your wife if she was alright as they weren't sure whether you were a stranger bothering her or not.