To think a lot of lonely people have brought it on themselves?

[LovelyYellowLabrador]

Just been watching a channel 4 thing on YouTube about lonely people
Most of them were like-no one calls…. They don’t see anyone all day
They maybe have had a marriage where their partner was the only other person they spent time with so when threat person has passed away they have no one else

Just think people need to think more about what they are doing
They expect their adult children to call them all the time and visit
Yet don’t stop to pause to think have I been a good parent am I draining or overly negative

Or they could think right no one’s called me, who am I going to call
How am I going to make and keep some friends

I think sometimes people can try to hard as well. A relative of mine had a new neighbour who kept popping round with a bottle of wine and bringing presents for the children. This relative works full time and drinks very little alcohol and didn't want to spend an hour 2-3 times a week chatting to this neighbour who she had very little in common with rather than chatting to her children and husband and also disliked her children expecting a present every time they saw this neighbour. They ended up falling out but could have been friends if the neighbour had been less intrusive.
I think it's easier to make friends in areas which lots of people move to.

I'm not how I feel about the no vacancy people. I mean at least you know not to waste your time there and time is a precious thing for most of us.

I do think a lot of people who claim to be open to new friendships aren't really, they just feel you have to say so, kind of like all those women who claim they'd consider an unattractive man with a good personality, you know most people don't.

@2Rebecca

I think able bodied lonely people are responsible for relieving their loneliness by going out and joining groups/ meeting people etc. OK they may not want to do that but they have to appreciate that other people don't always want to trek round to their house and you have to meet people half way. You also need hobbies and enthusiasms. If you are frail and housebound then you are more dependant on other people visiting but most lonely people are capable of leaving their house and meeting people. They just choose not to. Also being alone and being lonely are different. Some people are happier in their own company than others. If you develop dementia that can make you more lonely as you lack the imagination and motivation to do stuff, you can also forget that you had a visitor a couple of hours ago.

How are your frail and housebound people going to make friends in the first place though? Seeing that so many people moan about having to go to other people houses, they dint like peole visiting either so it has to be out and about (pub/activity) etc…

Eg I’m close to being housebound. I can’t go out and have a ‘hobby’ as such so the few people I’ve been meeting, I do that at home (mine or theirs).
But that’s apparently suffocating.

Seriously I think the British are extremely socially awkward. They have so many rules that it automatically reject potential friends just because they can’t do X and Y. They don’t want to meet up at home (cost of always going out anyone?). They don’t want 1-1 ‘because it’s suffocating’.
Basically they are happy with friends from afar.

It’s disheartening tbh. Even more so when you read the many threads of people asking how in earth they can start making friends again after moving etc…. It shouldn’t be that hard.

@2Rebecca

I think able bodied lonely people are responsible for relieving their loneliness by going out and joining groups/ meeting people etc. OK they may not want to do that but they have to appreciate that other people don't always want to trek round to their house and you have to meet people half way. You also need hobbies and enthusiasms. If you are frail and housebound then you are more dependant on other people visiting but most lonely people are capable of leaving their house and meeting people. They just choose not to. Also being alone and being lonely are different. Some people are happier in their own company than others. If you develop dementia that can make you more lonely as you lack the imagination and motivation to do stuff, you can also forget that you had a visitor a couple of hours ago.

What about those with diagnoses that impact on their ability to be social? It’s more than just the physically disabled who struggle.

Friendships are much harder when you are older and when your children are grown up.

You can have work friends but don’t see outside work as we have homes to run, partners, elderly parents and your own interests/hobbies.

I have a few local friends i meet for a coffee/chat but not enough as I find myself lonely and have a good Husband and 2 grown up children who still live at home (only finished uni last year), I work part time and enjoy that as have a good work/life balance.

Having friends was easier when the children were young as you can have the social interaction with other Mums and you meet lots of people when your children are at clubs etc (waiting around when they were at swimming lessons, hockey club) now they drive and you are not needed.

Life is good but lockdowns haven’t helped and making new friends is not easy.

I wonder what happened to the OP - too busy socialising to come back?

I'm on the fence here... I was reading a wedding thread a few days ago full of people complaining if their DC didn't get an invite they wouldn't attend. Also saying they'd rather spend a childfree night with their DH than attend a friend's wedding (which is a hopefully once in a lifetime event), or they'd attend a friend's wedding and sneak off early evening to the hotel room with their DH. It's easy to see how people who treat friends major life events as inconveniences will ostracize themselves, or refuse to attend as it disrupts 'family time' will become 'that couple'.

On the other hand my late DGD was very lonely when my DGM died, through no fault of his own. He loved people and socialising with everyone. However he became too ill to attend his social clubs, his friends had mostly passed away and his neighbours were useless. I visited as often as I could, but it's people like that I truly feel sorry for

@LittleMissUnreasonable interesting point, however a lot of weddings can be a huge pain in the a*se, no matter who is getting married and however sociable you happen to be! And that's often down to cost and logistics.

This whole debate is pointless. There's horrid people with no friends, or with dozens of friends

Best not to make sweeping generalisations about people who are clearly struggling, before karma bites you in the arse.

I don’t think sharing experiences or offering suggestions is pointless. I do think that dismissing the OP’s post because it doesn’t address, in detail, someone’s personal situation is more pointless. Hopefully, sharing information might just lead to greater empathy and understanding.

Most topics bring a variety of opinions, some will make lots of us cringe, some will have us nodding in approval, some might even bring fresh ideas. If even one person is helped on a thread, surely its worthwhile?

@Seymour5

I don’t think sharing experiences or offering suggestions is pointless. I do think that dismissing the OP’s post because it doesn’t address, in detail, someone’s personal situation is more pointless. Hopefully, sharing information might just lead to greater empathy and understanding.

Most topics bring a variety of opinions, some will make lots of us cringe, some will have us nodding in approval, some might even bring fresh ideas. If even one person is helped on a thread, surely its worthwhile?

No, because it's just making some posters feel bad. There's no fascinating insight here.

Just like people who have a go at single mothers, or poor people. Yes, some of them, it could be argued is 'their fault' but what does that actually achieve?- could be any of us one day, so best not to make generalisations. Anecdotes, fine whatever.

Generalisations are going to be upsetting to people in that situation. But rich talking about dickish lonely people - there's a lot of dickish people who aren't🤷🏻‍♀️

" Also saying they'd rather spend a childfree night with their DH than attend a friend's wedding hmm (which is a hopefully once in a lifetime event), or they'd attend a friend's wedding and sneak off early evening to the hotel room with their DH. It's easy to see how people who treat friends major life events as inconveniences will ostracize themselves, or refuse to attend as it disrupts 'family time' will become 'that couple'."

I've seen quite a few threads along the lines of 'what do you like about having children' and people answer 'having an excuse not to socialise'. So....

@WhatNoRaisins

Only wanting to meet 1:1 can be a sign of a needy person yes. If the other person does have other friends but won't mix us together I'd worry I was just a pity friend.

There are loads of people who won't mix different friendship group. I actually think the problem is those people. They are people pleasers who present different faces to different groups and they know the mask will fall off if everyone meets.

But weddings are a whole other issue and not necessarily an indication of how seriously you take a friendship? We wouldn't be able to go to a childfree one as no one to leave DD with, and I can imagine if someone had only limited access to overnight childcare (eg 1-2 nights a year) you'd be careful how you used it.

We had 15 under-5s at our wedding but because we valued our friends being there with us we made it as easy as possible for them to attend - had afternoon wedding with afternoon tea reception and no evening reception so everyone could travel on the day and didn't incur childcare costs. We provided kid activities for during the service.

@2Rebecca

I think able bodied lonely people are responsible for relieving their loneliness by going out and joining groups/ meeting people etc. OK they may not want to do that but they have to appreciate that other people don't always want to trek round to their house and you have to meet people half way. You also need hobbies and enthusiasms. If you are frail and housebound then you are more dependant on other people visiting but most lonely people are capable of leaving their house and meeting people. They just choose not to. Also being alone and being lonely are different. Some people are happier in their own company than others. If you develop dementia that can make you more lonely as you lack the imagination and motivation to do stuff, you can also forget that you had a visitor a couple of hours ago.

There have to be groups that you're interested in though. You can't really fake it and you can't just pick up a hobby that doesn't interest you. Many groups and clubs are still online only at the moment.

True, but I don't understand how some people reach adulthood without having an interest or hobby. I have loads and most of my groups are meeting up again in person and I'm in Scotland.

Not all interests and hobbies are done though a group though. And some groups have little to no social side….

@Gwenhwyfar, really??

People don’t want to mix friendship groups because they present differently in each group. Nothing to do with the fact that they have interests so different that those people are likely to NOT be compatible?

I mean I used to go diving and caving. Still have friends that are doing that (can’t due to my health).
I also really enjoy reading and book club. I tend to be quite nerdy in j’y readings too.
Do you think those two groups of people will be likely to have shared interest there?

Today 18:12 Gwenhwyfar

" Also saying they'd rather spend a childfree night with their DH than attend a friend's wedding hmm (which is a hopefully once in a lifetime event), or they'd attend a friend's wedding and sneak off early evening to the hotel room with their DH. It's easy to see how people who treat friends major life events as inconveniences will ostracize themselves, or refuse to attend as it disrupts 'family time' will become 'that couple'."

I've seen quite a few threads along the lines of 'what do you like about having children' and people answer 'having an excuse not to socialise'. So....“

Some people just aren’t social animals. I’m not, my husband isn’t, nothing wrong with that. We have maybe a dozen really good, old friends dotted around the world between us. Rarely see them but it doesn’t matter.
We love each other’s company, the company of our children and grandchild but will both be okay when one of us dies because we also enjoy our own company too.

People who aren’t very sociable tend not to end up feeling lonely when they become “alone”.

Agree has to be a hobby you enjoy. I used work in a club ladies played bridge. I enjoy walking I do coffee with her another week. Really hard to make friends as we age. I think living near the sea would be great. You could walk alone if nearby

@2Rebecca It depends on where you live though? There isn’t much at all round here (NW England, not a city). There’s lots for kids (football, rugby, swimming, scouts, guides, bands) but not much for adults. I go to a martial arts club that teaches both adults and children but I can’t think of much else.

It also depends on your own lifestyle, as I mentioned upthread I work shifts alternate weeks early/late and also EOW. It makes it really hard to commit and form connections as I’m simply not there enough. I couldn’t join a book club as I couldn’t go regularly and would always be behind. Same with anything that runs weekly, I think I’d just end up feeling more excluded and trying to play catch up.

People who aren’t very sociable tend not to end up feeling lonely when they become “alone”

That's a sweeping generalization. You say now that if one of you dies you'll be ok because you like being alone/are used to being alone.

I thought I was like that but absolutely nothing prepares you for when you really are alone, parents dead, no partner, no siblings. You're suddenly alone in the world and there's no one to talk to. There's no one to share joy or pain with. No one to tell any achievements to who would be proud of you. And no one to listen when you're worried sick about a health problem.
And having to make every damn decision by yourself. And the grind of cooking for one.

I think these "go out and join a hobby group and make an effort with people" are missing the point that it's the hours of bone-aching loneliness at home which are the problem. And also not wanting to burden others with anything, it means you have to deal with absolutely everything yourself for fear of getting dumped as a friend for daring to be negative once in a while.

I went to the WI and was pleasantly surprised. Most of the members were younger than me and very friendly and welcoming. There is a speaker /demonstration every month. Lovely cake and tea. I’m told one of the other groups on the other side of town is mostly younger people. So although many of these groups are hide bound, there are others which are very different.

It's also much less easy for people to go into residential care now - much more emphasis on staying in your own [possibly big, expensive to heat] home with carers coming in and meals on wheels. That potentially means a lot of time on your own if you don't have people visiting.

Whereas my 90+ yo great uncle, when he could no longer manage the stairs to his flat, the Housing Association found him a place in residential care where he had his own bedroom/living room/bathroom/kitchenette. He could walk down the corridor for lunch and tea with other people, and use a communal lounge if he wanted to, but also had privacy and could make his own drinks and breakfast.

Whereas my 90+ yo great uncle, when he could no longer manage the stairs to his flat, the Housing Association found him a place in residential care where he had his own bedroom/living room/bathroom/kitchenette. He could walk down the corridor for lunch and tea with other people, and use a communal lounge if he wanted to, but also had privacy and could make his own drinks and breakfast

That would suit me down to the ground, particularly if I could take the cat!