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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is this maternal enmeshment or AIBU?

223 replies

disco82 · 26/01/2022 14:03

Have noticed lots of odd things in the relationship between my bf and his mother, that I have tried to ignore. But am beginning to question if they are unhealthily enmeshed or AIBU? Examples:

  1. He has never moved away from home and is late 30s. Has only now put down an offer on a flat but it is down the road from mum.
  2. She has never met me in 18 months, and I have never been allowed in their house. He says it's because she is embarrassed of how run down it is. However, one night when she was away, he took me over and the house was absolutely fine. Also she works with clients in the house. We have bumped into her a few times in the town so she does know I'm a gf.
  3. Every time he is with me (and she knows), she texts him asking if he will be home for dinner or will be home that night. He says she is just checking he is ok. But I feel insulted she needs to check this when he is with me?
  4. She still cooks meals for him and does his laundry. He can do these things himself as he does it when he is with me.
  5. He is expected to pay for all house repairs and look after the house and garden.
  6. I live alone but he only spends 2 nights a week at mine and the rest at his mums, even though I have invited him to spend more.
  7. He once cut short our time together as he wanted to go home to say goodbye to his mum who was going away for the weekend. He didn't think this was an odd thing to do, but to me it felt like something you do for a partner.
  8. I have no family in this country and couldn't go home to my parents for Xmas due to Covid rules. On 2 Xmas-es she said I couldn't spend it with them as she didn't know me well enough and Xmas wasn't the right time to get to know me. The first Xmas I accepted this as we had only been dating 6 months, second Xmas I was quite shocked. So he decided to spend Xmas with me instead, but still had to go over to hers for most of the afternoon, even though she had her other family with her, and I was alone.
  9. He runs every decision past her, even ones he doesn't talk to me about.
  10. He tells her all the details about what we do together/where we go - they have a ritual of going for a walk every evening together.
  11. He admitted to me that she wouldn't be that pleased if he got married/had kids but couldn't explain why.
  12. There are no photos of him or his brothers anywhere in the house, and he has no idea where they may be. Not sure it means anything but thought it odd given how close they are.
  13. She and his dad got divorced 25 years ago but she has never had a partner since - not sure if it is relevant, but i thought maybe that is why they are so close. He also has 2 other brothers and they too have never left home and are in their 30s, but they are not so close to her, and don't contribute to the household expenses like he does.
OP posts:
alexio · 30/01/2022 00:05

Run!
This was what my husband and his mother were like when we first met. Fast forward a few years, married with kids and she is a manipulative, narcissistic nightmare.
Trying to control her son at almost 30, gives me a whole lot of abuse and try's to dictate what happens with our kids.

Trust me. It's just not worth the hassle.

KatherineJaneway · 30/01/2022 06:31

I am sorry it went so badly at the end, but it is clear he is far too damaged to have a healthy relationship. His mum has a lot to answer for.

tympanic · 30/01/2022 07:23

Well done, OP. You’ve definitely dodged a bullet there. But please, if he comes back and says all the right things, claims to understand and to be setting boundaries do NOT take him back. He’s gone. He’s had decades to realise how messed up his outlook is. He’s just not fit for relationships beyond the disturbing one he has with his mother. I hope he can accept that now and not waste anyone else’s time with his nonsense.

AcrossthePond55 · 30/01/2022 17:13

The 2nd meeting may have felt like a kick in the teeth, but it's truly an affirmation that you've done the absolute right thing.

Onwards and upwards.

Flippanty · 30/01/2022 19:20

At least this confirms things for you OP, this was never going to work out! You’ve done really well to bite the bullet and end things with him, I know that must be hard but this would really only get worse when kids did come along and you started to grow more and more resentful.

moomee12 · 30/01/2022 19:42

Bullet absolutely dodged op.

Jesus, I can't believe she's a therapist.

I'm glad you've seen sense. We see my DM and MIL once a fortnight ish. That's plenty. I don't think our relationship would survive more than that.

RussiasGreatestLoveMachine · 30/01/2022 20:32

What a selfish women she is. Denying him a right to a life partner, effectively.

I hope it’s worth it when she is gone and he’s all alone.

5128gap · 30/01/2022 21:13

I think his mum is getting a hard time on here. All you really know for certain is that she messages him when he's with you. The rest is either conjecture, perfectly reasonable, or down to choices he is making. He lives in her house willingly, chooses to share his life with her and takes some responsibility for the house he lives in with her, as he should. You have no idea really how she feels about you, or him having children. I think the comments on here about her having him in her clutches and being manipulative are just examples of the stereotypical, and often false, idea that women can't let go of their sons. Who seemingly as incapable of thinking for themselves. In reality it's equally possible that he just doesn't want to commit to you, and is using his mum as an excuse.

disco82 · 30/01/2022 22:21

@5128gap

I think his mum is getting a hard time on here. All you really know for certain is that she messages him when he's with you. The rest is either conjecture, perfectly reasonable, or down to choices he is making. He lives in her house willingly, chooses to share his life with her and takes some responsibility for the house he lives in with her, as he should. You have no idea really how she feels about you, or him having children. I think the comments on here about her having him in her clutches and being manipulative are just examples of the stereotypical, and often false, idea that women can't let go of their sons. Who seemingly as incapable of thinking for themselves. In reality it's equally possible that he just doesn't want to commit to you, and is using his mum as an excuse.
He's been single his whole life save two 4-5 month relationships. And I know this as fact as his friends have confirmed it as well. He had no reason to stay as long or deal with all this if he didn't want to commit. Certainly no reason to suggest cohabiting. And one of his closest male mates told me that the mother disapproved of him because my bf spent loads of time with this guy socialising (away from home) and was considering moving away - mate is very adventurous. And with him my bf had a fire in his belly to be more independent. The mate was Irish and said the mother told my bf he must be IRA so should be careful and made her disapproval known. He absolutely isn't. Both men were in their 30s at the time. So clearly it's not just women the mother dislikes, basically anyone she sees as a threat to her.

The first time we bumped into his mother, she saw us and carried on walking with no acknowledgement, to the end I was shocked when he called out 'mum' to her. I thought she was a stranger. She was incredibly unsmiling and cold with me, and it was the same when I bumped into her again at over a year in. She wouldn't even make eye contact with me. Him sneaking me in when she wasn't around, was indicative of how she didn't want me around. He was very on edge that she didn't find out. None of that fear was made up.

He told me of his childhood and how there wasn't any love, affection or praise after his father left. And what he described sounded very much like he was expected to help his mum out with all the practical tasks, as a husband. Given the frequency of calls and requests every time we are together, and that all three adult sons have never left home (at 34, 36, 38) nor had long term relationships - it doesn't take a psychologist to recognise that something unhealthy has happened in that household.

Sure, as an adult he has choices and can't blame everything on his childhood but having obviously filled a 'husband' role to her, he obviously has no idea that anything is wrong. To him it's normal to feel responsible for your mother all your life, rather than the other way around. I can't help him but of course I feel compassion that he has no idea what a healthy parental relationship should be like.

OP posts:
MizzFizz · 31/01/2022 14:28

Gosh OP, that pub meeting sounded awful! I'm glad you now have some extra clarity and closure that this would never work with marriage/kids. Your instincts were correct all along...

5128gap · 31/01/2022 15:16

Well that's quite a lot more background. To be perfectly honest, given this, I wouldn't be considering getting into a committed relationship with him until he's done some work to change the dynamic with his mother. Unless he does this you're looking at a lifetime of directing anger at her. Pointlessly, because she's not going to change. Any improvement to this situation will only come about by your BF establishing boundaries, and he will need to want to do that for himself, not because you want him to. You will also need to be careful that he doesn't transfer his dependence to you. Personally I'd put things on hold while he establishes some independence, and then review.

Alicesweewonders · 31/01/2022 15:27

Oh dear, is his name Norman

ESGdance · 31/01/2022 16:20

The other thing that happens with these mother enmeshed men is that they are actually subconsciously angry with the mother and they repress it.

BUT

Keeping a lid on that bubbling contempt and resentment that can’t be communicated to the dominant mother is them meted out passive aggressively on the partner. The anger has to go somewhere.

RussiasGreatestLoveMachine · 31/01/2022 17:36

Personally I'd put things on hold while he establishes some independence, and then review.

Put things on hold?

Why on earth would a 36 woman do that?

She should do exactly as she has done - dump him and get on with her life.

There are millions of men out there - why wait around indefinitely for a sub-standard one to possibly change? Confused

billy1966 · 31/01/2022 18:27

He sounds so awful.

He wanted a relationship 100% on his terms.

His mother is determined to have him as her carer come hell or high water.

This would NEVER have worked.

How could any woman find such a creepy relationship attractive.

Well done for getting out.Flowers

5128gap · 31/01/2022 18:30

@RussiasGreatestLoveMachine

Personally I'd put things on hold while he establishes some independence, and then review.

Put things on hold?

Why on earth would a 36 woman do that?

She should do exactly as she has done - dump him and get on with her life.

There are millions of men out there - why wait around indefinitely for a sub-standard one to possibly change? Confused

Agree 100%. My fault for not clocking she had dumped him. Even better.
m1shap3 · 07/03/2022 06:36

How are you getting on OP?

NameGoesHere · 07/03/2022 06:48

Run!!!

disco82 · 04/06/2022 18:29

Update: Hello, OP here. I had such good advice on this thread so I wanted to provide an update. Not a happy ending sadly. After breaking up as per my last update, he came back a week later to say he had thought about it and agreed things needed to change. That the only solution was for him to move out of his mums and that would automatically set new boundaries between them. And he'd spoken to his mum about not messaging him unnecessarily or wanting a conversation when he was with me. He had completed on his own flat a year ago so this all seemed like a good idea.

He never moved out of mums. He decided he needed to gut the entire flat and re-build it, except he wanted to do it all himself. He isn't a tradesman or has any experience, does a gruelling 10-12 hour shift job and thought no one else would do as thorough a job as him... He's had builder mates offer to help him for free, to speed it up, and he's even refused them. He's made barely any progress, it's been 15 months since he got the keys, and he has no plan for how much longer it will take. When he has free days he spends most of it sleeping rather than on the flat, so no urgency. What's worse is he's paying a mortgage on a flat he doesn't live in and can't rent out, and also paying rent to his mum for living at home. All on a low wage. It makes no financial sense! Transpires that the rent he pays at home actually goes to his mum's mortgage and when he asked her how she would manage when he moves out (and stops paying rent), she said his brothers would have to pick up his share. His brothers couldn't afford the extra - one doesn't work, the other in a very low paid job. And she has no other financial contingency apart from him. It became obvious that she is very financially dependent on him despite still working in a decently paid job (almost got an MBE to give a sense of how successful she is) and the house having quadrupled in value since she bought it 40 years ago....Selling up and downsizing to afford the bills is not a consideration either.

I realised that he is never going to leave home. The flat is a tiny ex council 1 bedroom (that had already been refurbed when he bought it). He came up with every excuse under the sun to drag out the renovation. Honestly it will likely be another year before he moves in. Also realised that if his focus is on paying off his mum's mortgage rather than spending it on his flat or saving for our future - there is no future. And at 36, I need more than a guy I see 1-2 times a week because he's with his mum the rest of the week. And isn't putting his own life on hold to support a healthy, working mother. What made it worse was she was STILL contacting him when he was with me to fix and sort things at home despite the other brothers being around. So I broke up with him a week ago and this time for good. He is more enmeshed than I ever realised and there's no place for another woman in their relationship. I feel oddly relieved to be out of this mess with no doubts anymore. Onwards and upwards!

OP posts:
SomewhereEast · 04/06/2022 18:59

Yikes. I come from a culture (Irish) where sons were traditionally glued to their mothers & even I think this is deeply weird.

honeybeetheoneandonly · 04/06/2022 23:22

Good for you. That doesn't sound like a very healthy relationship. Glad you managed to stop wasting your time. All the best for the future.

Sliceofpi · 04/06/2022 23:31

Sounds like you have done the right thing . Best wishes for the future

Branleuse · 04/06/2022 23:37

Im not sure what its called, but I am not sure how you could find him sexy. Their set up of 3 adult bachelor sons and their weird overbearing mother sounds bonkers. Hes pretty much told you she will always come first. Are you sure its not actually his wife and hes got an older wife

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