Being automatically referred to as 'Mrs' on the basis of .. what?!

[Tailsyflugbun]

To expect a telephone receptionist to not assume I am married?!

@Snowiscold

Mrs is a 'courtesy title'?!?!

Well, yes. As all adult women go by Frau in Germany or Madame in France. It’s a courtesy title and normal and doesn’t indicate marital status or anything to do with a man. Your surname stays the same. I would prefer Ms myself and that’s what I go by, but Mrs is fine. Quite a few single women I know go by Mrs. No change of surname. I would strongly object to Miss, married or not.

This

On the telephone, it is hard to hear the difference between "Ms and Miss". So, to avoid you possibly being insulted that she referred to you as a child, the receptionist pronounced "Missus/Mrs" to give you the respect due to an adult human female.

It's not about marital status, it's about being repectful to adults.

I've been both and I couldn't care less what I'm called. Life is really too short.

[quote LordEmsworth]@luckylavender No I really don't think it's hilarious, I am dismayed that people assume that I must have a male owner. It's 2022, it's not "discourteous" to not assume that a woman you're speaking to must be married.[/quote]
I'm sure people don't mean to ruin your day. As has already been pointed out, in some European languages the equivalent title is given to a woman automatically at a certain age. Getting it right these days is very difficult. Many people hate the word Ms.

They can’t call all women Miss, and lots seem to object to Ms. Mrs for all is fine

So why can’t they call all women Miss, yet they can call all women Mrs?

There is no reason all women can’t be called Miss.

I don’t like being defined by my relationship to a man and would never use Miss or Mrs. i’d prefer the default to be Miss though if I had to choose.

@Tailsyflugbun

To expect a telephone receptionist to not assume I am married?!

It's awful, complain, write to the company, go to the papers or just say I'm a miss and move on?

So how do you assume that someone who doesn't know you, starts a telephone conversation? Because using a first name can be as rude to other people..

Hi, am I speaking to firstname surname?

Nothing wrong with that. Then you can ask if they prefer Miss, Mrs or firstname in future.

I always get this from car dealers and tradesmen.

I don't think they can compute that middle aged lone parents can do things themselves and I must have a husband hidden somewhere.

But - we're not in France or Germany so that's a pretty poor argument. In this country, grown-up unmarried women do sometimes use Miss, it's not only used for children; however I don't know any woman who is not married but uses "Mrs". There are more unmarried women in this country than there are married women, so a minority of women in this country use "Mrs" as a title.

I am all for getting rid of the stupid things, but the fact is that someone calling you "Mrs" is making a subconscious decision that it would be rude to assume you are not married as unmarried women are somehow lesser than married women. Those of you saying it's courteous are also saying, well it would be rude to assume that this woman is - like most adult women - not married, because that implies there's something wrong with her.

@Svara

Don't see why the default can't be Ms until told otherwise, or just use the person's name.

I hate Ms. It just sounds bloody stupid.

I am a Mrs and if someone who doesn't know me writes or speaks to me I would rather be called Miss than Ms

I remember one time I wrote"Ms" on a bank form. The woman behind the counter LAUGHED at me in a condescending manner. I don't know why. I was only 22 at the time but I was married to my husband. She didn't know any of this.

My mum got called Ms on a prescription, she went nuts she hated it! Can't please all the people all the time.

I send out all work letters to Ms Blah
If they complain and not many of them do even though they're all 60 +(because of what I do) then I explain to them that I do not know if they're married or not.

@Svara

Don't see why the default can't be Ms until told otherwise, or just use the person's name.

Exactly!

I get fed up of bring called Mrs, I am married but am Ms My name. I fill in forms for multiple organisations which ask for my title and I put Ms. However when they contact me (DS's school i'm looking at you) they invariably refer to me as Mrs, including when I have initiated an exchange of emails and signed myself off as Ms. Depending on how much it irritates me I do sometimes correct them but it always gets so awkward because people don't understand what I'm trying to tell them (er, Mrs Myname is my mother not me...?)

I'm married and go by Ms as I don't think it should matter what my martial status is.

Why do people hate ms? I never knew people were opposed to this?

Why do people hate ms? I never knew people were opposed to this?

Because it’s generally associated with hairy legged bra burning feminist lesbians who refuse to be defined by whether they are good enough for a man to marry them.

Miss- young girl or old spinster who couldn’t bag a man.

Ms- as above

Mrs- reached the high social echelons of being pretty enough to trap a man. Often defined by that man’s position and/or employment.

Dr/prof/reverend- show off who deems themselves better than everyone else and should get back in their box. Mrs is the ultimate achievement anyway for a woman, all those brains are no good if it means you can’t catch a man.

Because women’s worth is always defined by men.

I want to be called Ms.

Therefore, in my mind, both Miss and Mrs are incorrect. Therefore I might as well go the whole hog and let them get it wildly incorrect. I will therefore be introducing myself as "Doctor" from now on!

@Babymamamama

I think Mrs should be scrapped altogether. It derives from “of the master” or mister’s. Absolutely ridiculous outdated patriarchy in this day and age.

SO you are expecting everyone to sing from your songsheet, they have no choice?

@SiobhanSharpe

I think it should be like it is in France - the French automatically address all adult women as Madame - Mademoiselle is reserved solely for girls. We should either take the married/single connotation out of the equation, or enquire about how someone would like to be addressed or just use Madam. I find I'm nearly always called Siobhan by all and sundry, no matter what the setting, and it feels very over-familiar. But that's a whole different thread.

I believe German has the same use, Frau is an adult woman, Fraulein is for girls.

I don't mind Mrs which is what I am, I dislike it when I am called my first name which is over familiar when I don't know the person itms

Everyday sexism is not nothing

I have children and I'm in my forties so people just assume. I find it slightly irritating sometimes because there's so much focus (rightly) in identity now but people still assume middle aged women are all 'Mrs.' Sometimes I say 'it's miss' but most of the time I just don't bother.

I couldn't care less.

It does bother me in a global sense - that a young woman holds inherent sexist views/ that the company she works needs to address their training, etc.

How do you know it’s company policy? It may just be how she was raised. I doubt the company has an actual policy on how callers are addressed but even if they do I’d rather be called Mrs Brit than someone just assume it’s OK to use my first name, which can be even more patronizing.

Incidentally, why did you assume she was young? You’re complaining that she assumed you were married and you’ve made an assumption about her age.