To think you can't be 'Pro choice' if you agree in mandate vaccinations?

[secular39]

There. I said it.

They are not being blackmailed

The reason behind this becoming mandatory is based on risk. We are being clearly informed of this

‘ You can't be pro choice when it comes to specific circumstances [abortion] and not be pro choice about [other circumstances - vaccines]’

Yes we can!

[quote littlejalapeno]@PAFMO the point is that children are not afforded the autonomy to decide what vaccines they put in their body, because the benefit to society outweighs the cost to their autonomy, so the OPs argument for choice is impossible to implement and inconsistent.[/quote]
Don't know I'm tagged there.
I've only looked at some of the Op's rather eclectic ideas on MN.

An interesting dripfeed from them following my post though.

You are free to do whatever you want. You need only face the consequences.

• Sheldon Kopp

I don’t think you can be “pro-life” if you refuse a vaccine that will save the lives of many actual already-born people.

A pregnancy affects you and your partner and NO-ONE else.

This is not true. Demographics affect all of us. Why do you think governments sometimes incentivise/ de-incentivise having children?

The definition of pro choice is NOT pro bodily autonomy in all circumstances.
I don’t think a healthy person should have the right to amputate a leg.

Pro choice means that I should not have to carry a pregnancy to term and should have the right to abortion.

There is literally no link between the two because pro choice does NOT mean people can do what they want to their bodies.

And using women and their bodies for this argument is the lowest of the low esp when abortion rights are under threat.

I am absolutely pro choice when it comes to pregnancy - strongly so. I also believe you have a choice about the vaccine - but that choice has consequences and not being allowed to work in an environment with very sick people or being paid for having to quarantine is fair imo

YABU, and I think the argument is similar to 'you can't love animals if you eat meat'.

If you want to make a case start by defining your terms; what do you mean by 'vaccine mandate'?
a) the State has the right to force everyone to have the vaccine, or
b) you will be restricted from certain occupations or activities if you have not been vaccinated.

I am pro- choice as regards abortion. These are two completely different things. I do not advocate mandatory vaccines for the whole population.

I’m not sure how I feel about the current NHS mandate as I have not looked into the science and potential lives lost through staff leaving.

Neither of these come without consequences though -
A mandate for health care staff does not mean they are strapped down, it means finding a different job

Pro choice also has an implication for others. A HCP who works at an organisation that provides abortion can have a conscientious objection to abortion. However if a woman needs or wants an abortion and the HCP is the only one trained and available they should carry it out. If a person would never assist at abortion certain jobs are out.

I assume you will have no problem if an employer refuses to employ the vaccinated over blood clot fears

I'll keep my mask on thanks rather then travel around the world like a arrogant sod thinking I'm immune because I got jabbed

erm well I doubt any employers would do that since it's a minimal risk and actually not a thing - so careful you don't pull a muscle with that over reaching!

Not sure who you are calling an arrogant sod - myself - I have had both doses and my booster, still work from home and will continue to wear a mask - so erm yeah

Absurd analogy OP. Unwanted pregnancy is not like a vaccine.

YANBU

When the consequences on your choice have a negative effect on another living human being, you've reached the border where personal freedom and social responsibility intersect.

Your argument is completely spurious, OP.

You can't be pro choice when it comes to specific circumstances and not be pro choice in certain situations. It does not work like that. Pro choice is primarily body autonomy.

So how does the pro-choice nurse deal with the unconscious patient?

Mandatory vaccinations should never happen and I'm very pro vaccine. It's scary. Everyone should have a choice.

@WhateverHappenedToFayWray

Mandatory vaccinations should never happen and I'm very pro vaccine. It's scary. Everyone should have a choice.

Everyone does have a choice.

Self absorbed colleagues? These same colleagues who were clapped for, worshipped and called heroes not too long ago?

A lot of people, and a lot of NHS staff found that daft, patronising and embarrassing, so I doubt they particularly consider it.

You dont if you want to travel and what about NHS workers losing their jobs? That doesn't sound like a choice.

@daisy46

YANBU. bodily autonomy.

This!

@WhateverHappenedToFayWray

You dont if you want to travel and what about NHS workers losing their jobs? That doesn't sound like a choice.

it's totally a choice - if other countries want people who visit to be vaccinated that's their right - ditto the NHS - you still have a CHOICE - be vaccinated or travel/work elsewhere

@littlejalapeno

It’s a completely different issue.

The impact of being forced to carry a foetus to term and risk your life in child birth with no choice, vs. Everybody taking a vaccine that protects vulnerable people and reduces the risk of dying of a disease, are completely different scenarios with completely different implications.

You’re conflating them to muddy the waters and promote outrage and confusion.

I’m so over people being precious about the vaccine because of something they read on Facebook and then equating it with the struggle for woman's rights and autonomy. We’re so lucky to have modern medicine. It’s actually insulting to anyone with a uterus and especially insulting to rape survivors and those who have had to have abortions for medical necessity.

This post is a “fuck you” to common sense!

This !

@WhateverHappenedToFayWray

You dont if you want to travel and what about NHS workers losing their jobs? That doesn't sound like a choice.

It is still a choice. A choice means there is more than one option or possibility. Is there more than one option? Yes.

It is still a choice. A choice means there is more than one option or possibility. Is there more than one option? Yes.

But what if you can't get vaccinated for medical reasons, what then?

Yabu

Of course you can be ‘pro choice’ in the sense of pregnancy choices without believing that everyone, in any situation can make any choice they like without facing any consequences whatsoever, regardless of the consequences to others.

They’re totally separate issues.