To not get the e-mail sign off with pronoun's?

[hehimshehertheythem]

He/him and she/her at the end of an email. Margaret I know you're a woman and Jeff I know you're a man. Why are you teaching me to suck eggs. I don't get it?

I have not once never see a they/them as a sign off, so what is the actual point?

I for one will not be taking part in this madness. But would like to understand the thought behind the people that do? If there is any thought that is.

I know someone who put "we/us" for their pronouns as a form of protest, resulting in someone almost getting a disciplinary as it looked like he was implicating himself in misconduct that the "we/us" person had engaged in. The person was so afraid of committing the heinous crime of misgendering that he almost lost his job. Pathetic.

Strange thread. I work for an global company many many different nationalities. In some cultures some names are unisex so if you've never spoken to the person it would be Impossible to tell (not that it matters). Some names like Lewis and Louise sound the same in certain accents so I
My name which is similar and have been called Mr Grant before and therefore have added (Mrs) to my signature. Can't see a problem with it. We don't all have to start being gender neutral to be equal imo.

@mrsdaltongrant

Strange thread. I work for an global company many many different nationalities. In some cultures some names are unisex so if you've never spoken to the person it would be Impossible to tell (not that it matters). Some names like Lewis and Louise sound the same in certain accents so I My name which is similar and have been called Mr Grant before and therefore have added (Mrs) to my signature. Can't see a problem with it. We don't all have to start being gender neutral to be equal imo.

@mrsdaltongrant You might want to read this to see how women are disadvantaged over men in the workforce when men learn it's a woman. Anonymity works best for women in the workplace. www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/what-happened-when-a-man-signed-work-emails-using-a-female-name-for-a-week_n_58c2ce53e4b054a0ea6a4066

@Migrainesbythedozen thank you, I know sexism exists. Just like I know racism exists.
I'm happy to be known as a woman and not hide in the shadows. If i have a issue with someone not responding to me in a certain way and it turns out to be because of my gender I will address it. Ive only ever had issues with people not responding because I'm not GM, MD and a simple messages from a person of that level advising them whether need to reply and all sorted. Assume all these people having issues with pronouns are giving their children all gender neutral names so it's impossible to tell either way. You know forward thinking and all that.

@Migrainesbythedozen

For me, the actual truth is, not the one you think is true (you know the suggestion I am naive, being laughed at by the community I support, made to do it and disempowered by men (earlier poster), is my friends and colleagues who have transitioned or identify as a gender different to which they were born want to be recognised as the gender they are today - I understand this is a difficult concept especially where some people have not yet transitioned or decided not - which I believe is the issue most posters are referring to.

You don’t agree that that where people identify as a different gender that others within life or the workplace should support them in feeling accepted by using their preferred pronouns when speaking to them to another person or creating an environment they feel able to be themselves by adding pronouns.

Aside to the equality argument, you also feel that people who identify as a different gender are delusional (not sure what you feel about people who are religious…)

Do you know how hard it must be for someone who has transitioned to then be completely disregarded by people like you completely dismissing who they are? That’s not an ideology.

And yes it does matter what people refer to them as when they’re not there. If you keep referring to Linda as Mike, Linda will never feel accepted and won’t be able to be herself. It’s privileged posters who say well I just go to work and never worn a mask. For people in the LGBT+ community who identify as a different gender, by not having environments where they can be themselves they may never take that mask off. For some the workplace is the only place they can be themselves.

For a lot of posters on here, I really do hope that should a loved one share with you that they want to identify as a different gender that you show them some support and compassion.

@DipYourPenisInMyBeaker
You are making the mistake of thinking that only one 'side' of this toxic debate could ever need support. I am terrified of the gender ideology and the impact it is having on my, my children and all women. Yet you think that only people who identify as a different gender deserve support and compassion. Why?

Using pronouns you support an ideology that says men magically become women because they say they are Abd that the Category women is therefore meaningless

Say you did thibk you were being treated differently because you were a woman - how could you possibly prove it when Danielle next to you (born dave, presents male, pronouns she/her) never gets treated differently- after all they’re a woman right? They said they were

@Theeyeballsinthesky

Using pronouns you support an ideology that says men magically become women because they say they are Abd that the Category women is therefore meaningless

Say you did thibk you were being treated differently because you were a woman - how could you possibly prove it when Danielle next to you (born dave, presents male, pronouns she/her) never gets treated differently- after all they’re a woman right? They said they were

Exactly but the only important thing here is being compassionate and supportive to Dave/ Danielle. It speaks volumes about how much compassion and support some people think women are due.

@DipYourPenisInMyBeaker 'women' isn't an outfit to put on, it's adult human females. Dave can call himself Danielle, can wear whatever he likes, undertake plastic surgery, can write the pronoun 'she', but Danielle is male and other males must enable him to use male loos.

What do you think happens to women when men use their spaces ? (Knowing that transwomen commit sexually motivated crimes at the same rate as men?)

Do you know how hard it must be for someone who has transitioned to then be completely disregarded by people like you completely dismissing who they are? That’s not an ideology.

I don't believe in "transitioning" or any part of gender identity ideology. People cannot change sex. Sex matters. You are the sex you were born and playing along with the idea that you aren't has a negative impact for women and girls. So yes it is an ideology.

Aside to the equality argument, you also feel that people who identify as a different gender are delusional (not sure what you feel about people who are religious…)

Why would they necessarily feel any different? Both are faith based beliefs.

And for completeness, the use of pronouns is not about sexuality or sexual orientation, it’s about gender identity and asking people to see you as you see yourself. What’s so hard in that?

/// I think for the person who screeches to insist we use their pronouns this is indeed true. Apart from the many reasons why, (unless I cave into having to use them because I feel under pressure and haven't the head space that day to handle the bullshit fallout of non compliance) detailed in this thread and many others for why I have a problem with pronouns, there is also this peripheral reason -

If I work with you I hope we can collaborate together to get Our Job Done. That's all work relationships are to me. With a few exceptions of colleagues who have become friends over the years I have no desire to know much more about you at all, I don't care how you identify, it's all good. But we're here to do a job. I don't need to see inside your soul to do that. Any further fuss or discussion is a distraction and bordering on attention seeking behaviour. And I say that as mum to a teenage DD

Hear hear @tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz