Why are some parents so selfish !!!

[YogaRebel]

Is it just me or do some parents constantly moan about how inconvenient their children are ? In front of them too. Triggers me.

I think often people find it easier to moan about their kids than to pull them up on their behaviour. I don't have to tell people how annoying my kids are, I tell them. I tell them when they are being annoying or badly behaved, when they are talking over people, when they are being unkind, when they need to wait. I don't behave like a martyr them bitch about them. IMO other than maybe in the early days with a new baby you really shouldn't feel like a 'slave' to your child. The level of self sacrifice should not be our measure of a good parent/woman. It often leaves to passive aggression and resentment and codependency and insecure but entitled children. Then we call them monsters. The martyr mother and her monster children, nobody really sure how to have their needs met properly. So of course they don't enjoy spending time together, the kids tend to be happier in places where the roles are clever eg. At school where the teachers are in charge. So the parent feels 'free' when the child is at school. Looks forward to the 'break' from this power struggle. And the child behaves worse and worse to get their parents attention, the parent tells their sob story of this child who is destroying their life even though they gave up work to SAH and breastfed every hour until their 3rd birthday or whatever, and the child thinks they are an awful unloveable monster who's only worth is what they can do for other people, eventually leading them to become a Martyr of a mother themselves.

Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes. I also love them madly and tell them so frequently. I am very conscious that I don't want my kids to believe that being loved is only possible if you are perfect.

@BFPDec21

Definitely.

I have an acquaintance who would forever be going on about how their child was a "little shit" or a "real arsehole" at times.

They thought it was a joke to talk about but their child is now talking and they still do it. Their child actually tells them it's not true and I find it sad a child needs to defend themselves like that at a young age.

Anything you say negatively about your child should never be in front of them.

This is the stuff that breaks my heart. And the supermarket example. I would no more call DS a "little shit" to someone in front of him than I would say "Yeah, DH is such a selfish dick" while he was there! (He's not but you get my point).

@SinisterBumFacedCat kids sitting outside in cars while their parents were in the pub was not thought well of in the 80s. I know people like to pretend it was, but it really wasn't. If MN had existed then some mums would have said they do this, and others would have been saying they were selfish and neglectful.
In the late 1980s a colleague reported a neighbour to SS for talking her young kids every night to the pub and the kids falling asleep on the pub benches. SS said although it wasn't great parenting, there was nothing they could do. I remember everyone in my workplace thought that was wrong - was gossiped about for ages.

I don’t like it when people speak negatively about children in front of them for no reason. At a funeral I was chatting to a toddler’s grandma (DH’s cousins wife) and asked what she was called and she said loudly this is Harper she’s a little shit. Why?

@scaredsadandstuck

Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes. I also love them madly and tell them so frequently. I am very conscious that I don't want my kids to believe that being loved is only possible if you are perfect.

You literally tell your kids that they’re arseholes and tell other people that in front of them? And justify that by saying that they need to know you love them when they’re not perfect?

There are other options here, ‘your behaviour is x,y,z’ to them - not to others in front of them. And still tell them you love them.

@scaredsadandstuck

Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes. I also love them madly and tell them so frequently. I am very conscious that I don't want my kids to believe that being loved is only possible if you are perfect.

I think you are wrong to do that.

[quote AllThePogs]@sweetcheekweak do you do this to your children? Is that why your comments are so defensive?[/quote]
Do what to my children?

Say they're being a shit if they're being a shit? Of course

Posters are really going overboard here. The examples given by the OP are very different to the ones others are conflating 'I never wanted children', them being abandoned at boarding school etc.

@baroqueandblue

Have you even read the examples the OP gave?

None are assassinating a child's character

Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes. I also love them madly and tell them so frequently. I am very conscious that I don't want my kids to believe that being loved is only possible if you are perfect.

And if your partner calls you an arehole and tells other people you are being an arsehole is it okay if they also tell you they love you?

@sweetcheekweak
Actually some of those examples were given before the OPs example and ‘don’t have kids they ruin your life’ is not dissimilar to ‘I never wanted children’

I agree OP and I don't really know why you would refer to a child as a 'little shit', even behind their back. I think that attitude eventually is found out by the child and they feel unloved, it is just unnecessary. My eldest is almost 15 has a detention tonight as the number of times he has been late has gone over the 15 minutes in a week, he is a high achiever and hardworking. TBH i feel bad for him as he is missing out on partaking in a school football match after school so I try to empathise with his disappointment, hug him, just be kind. He's not upset or anything but I'd never be frustrated with him over it as I think he is mazing as is my little DD. She is sometimes challenging with sensory issues but to be honest she is my DD and even if frustrated, it doesn't help and there is no point. I want them to feel cherished and loved and importantly have a relationship with them when they are adults. I know someone who is always complimenting my child on how easy she is to have as a guest but sees and expresses constant irritation towards their own child even though the child is very polite and quiet. I heard a parent blaming her child for coming out late from an after school club yesterday- moaning about standing in the rain. It is bizarre as my child was at the same group and they were late because of the person running it, how can you possibly justify moaning at your child for something beyond their control. Tbh I think it is a bit pathetic, buy an umbrella and grow up it is literally waiting 5 mins in your life.

Think it's just some people. Arseholes don't generally change just because they have children! My brother was forever kicking his kids outside no matter the weather, e.g. rain, snow etc. They only came in when it was dark, after school and at the weekends! Now his children are adults, he wonders why they don't bother with him!

[quote sweetcheekweak]@baroqueandblue

Have you even read the examples the OP gave?

None are assassinating a child's character

[/quote]
The examples the OP gave are situations where the child’s confidence and self esteem will be worn away, day by day.

I know this, as I am currently trying to support my children through it. Their dad doesn’t want to read to one child, because that child wants the same (picture) books all the time, which are ‘boring’. Their dad doesn’t have time to take them to school, or pick them up, because he is ‘too busy’ (but manages to be free to give colleagues a lift to the airport, or to fit in a personal trainer session before starting work (wfh)). Their dad cannot have them stay for more of the school holidays because he ‘needs a holiday’, yet he has never even attempted to take them away for even the shortest break.

Every day his actions signal to the dc that they are not his priority, and they notice, and it hurts them.

He would (and does) say that he is an ok parent because he loves them, and they have a warm home, and food to eat. It’s not enough. They also need their emotional needs met.

Also, if they are not mid to older teenagers where the pain in the arse comments are not a comic exchange and it is equal ribbing of each other it seems age inappropriate..

@ineedsun and @AllThePogs It's all about context, as you know.

My kids are a bit older now, so I could probably say to the 13yo that he was being an arse, if I used the right tone at the right moment. And even if I didn't, and said it in anger - in the context of an otherwise good relationship with him, I don't think I'd do lasting damage. In the process he might learn that in relationships with people you love you can be angry with them and still love them. It's not one or the other.

Obviously you shouldn't (and nor would I, or did I) say something like that to a 4 year old, or about them where they could hear me.

As @sweetcheekweak says there are a lot of different scenarios getting mixed up here. My point is that it's a very high pedestal to put parents (mothers) on that asks them never to say negative things about their children.

Depends on the extent and the context. Everyone is human and everyone gets stressed at times.

@Andtheyalllookjustthesame

It is important for parents to vent, ofc, but I also think that a lot of this reinforces the idea that kids are inherently wild and naughty and not naturally good, kind, polite, and considerate. This is nonsense. Kids have great capacity for positive behaviour and all these good attributes. They aren't wild animals to be tamed into submission, they are motivated by the same things that we adults are. Social acceptance and approval, love, compassion, kindness, creativity, fun, laugher, a thirst for knowledge, a desire to do well and to improve themselves. If my children behave like monsters, I don't think that that is because they are kids. I think it's sign that I need to teach them better skills for self discipline, emotional regulation and frustration tolerance. Children are brilliant at living up to our expectations. If we expect them to be monstrous, they will be. If we expect them to be the best of humanity then they will often rise to that expectation too. They are able of a lot more than a lot of grown ups give them credit for.

🙌🏻 This. The fatalism of the "kids are dicks" line does my head in and suspect that might've been what OP was getting at. Nothing wrong with a quiet moment of wtf at the end of a hard day/issuing a strong telling off when called for, but think the seemingly trendy discourse about parenting being "shit and boring" sounds like the start of a race to the bottom. Kids are sponges and they take it ALL in. If they hear that a parent thinks they're a dick, chances are they'll continue to behave like a dick.

"Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes."
WTF.... that's horrible! There's no need to tell people that! Just talk to the children, discipline if needed and forget it, move on. No need to tell them and the world that they're arseholes!! I'd never run down my kids to others! I know they can be difficult sometimes, but slagging them off will lead to poor self esteem.

@Toomanyradishes

Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes. I also love them madly and tell them so frequently. I am very conscious that I don't want my kids to believe that being loved is only possible if you are perfect.

And if your partner calls you an arehole and tells other people you are being an arsehole is it okay if they also tell you they love you?

In the context of a safe, loving, healthy relationship? If there is not a clear pattern of abuse and imbalance of power? If it's a heat of the moment argument? If I am in fact being an arsehole?

Right now if my husband called me an arsehole, or I him, it would be very bad. Our relationship is not in a good place. In the past, it would have been ok because we were communicating well, being respectful of each other and our marriage was overall healthy. It's all about context. I mean have you never ever been angry enough to call someone you love a name? Even if you know it's not exactly grown up behaviour?

@AsYouWishButtercup

See I’m the opposite, I think it’s ok to say parenting is hard, boring and shit, and I think it should be ok to talk about it. It never did anyone any good being a Mary Poppins “I love meningitis a mum so much” tripe where people (women) hold it in and say nothing. Especially in the early days when risk of PND is so high and we are still in a world where depression is shameful for many. Let’s encourage more honest conversations - we don’t stop being human just because we’ve had children.

Triggers me

Other people not loving parenting triggers you? Well maybe that’s your problem not theirs

Some people actually do love being a mum and not find it all such a chore and if people can moan then they can say how much they love it, it’s not tripe.

I suppose it depends on the tone and the frequency. I told the teacher yesterday my daughter had been a total pain that morning, she knew she had too. I don´t think she will be lying on her psychologist´s couch 20 years from now commenting on it. My mum called us little terrors to some neighbour from time to time, we survived. It´s the going on and on which I would find unacceptable as it would start to be corrosive to the child´s self esteem.

No one is saying that mothers should never say anything negative about their kids, but that there are lasting consequences for kids who repeatedly hear that they’re not wanted, worthless or shit or an arse.

@Beautiful3

"Sometimes my children are arseholes, and sometimes I tell them that or tell other people they are being arseholes." WTF.... that's horrible! There's no need to tell people that! Just talk to the children, discipline if needed and forget it, move on. No need to tell them and the world that they're arseholes!! I'd never run down my kids to others! I know they can be difficult sometimes, but slagging them off will lead to poor self esteem.

So you've never ever moaned to a friend or family member about your kids? That's impressive.

Also, 'telling the world' is not what I said, is it?

I have never referred to mt children as 'Arseholes' or 'little shits'. I certainly wouldn't do it in front of them. Saying you have found getting them to school quite stressful this morning to another parent or your Mum or something like that when they are at school is different but often there isn reason why they have been like that and I try to work out what that is. In the past my DS was refusing to go to school as he was punched and being bullied; his school refusal all mde sense then. My DD was being tricky on the way home the other night but it transpires she had a very very difficult time with her fractions.