AIBU to not want my son to do rugby because of the culture?

[sausagedogsforever]

I probably am being unreasonable but, my DS aged 5 really wants to do rugby. He once had a taster session, loved it and has asked to go since (for a good year). So shows no signs of getting over the urge.

I am thinking maybe I should take him again to another taster (maybe he won't like it) but also what if he loves it?

I used to like watching rugby and I find the games much more family friendly to watch than football matches. However, I've heard terrible things about rugby players and rugby playing culture? Like gross drinking games, sexism, just all round bad behaviour and treatment of women, initiation games to fit in etc.
is this really what it's like? Does anyone have any experience?
The other issue is injury, it's likely in a sport like that, so do I really want to encourage this?
Any advice welcome. Has anyone got a rugby playing son/husband?
Am I being unreasonable?

Can you think of any sport where he won't be exposed, when he's an adult, to sexism, drinking opportunities and so on? He doesn't have to join in and you have a decade in which to influence him to stand up to this kind of expectation. There have been rugby and cricket and soccer players (Graham le Saux is the one who comes immediately to mind) who haven't gone along with laddish behaviour. Wouldn't it be great if there were more thoughtful, civilised, woman-friendly sportsmen around? Your son could be one of them.

Many of us would be thrilled to have a child who wanted to get involved in any kind of sport. It's great: he'll be fit and strong and have mates for life if he continues in rugby. It'll go down well on his CV and if he's good it could help get him into a university of his choice or even be a career.

@HalloHello

Football is way worse and I've never heard anyone complain about a 5 year old wanting to get involved in that. Football fans, the aggression, the drinking, the division between clubs is all terrible. You never ever see rugby fans ransacking the city like football fans do. Obviously a lot of generalisation there, not all fans etc but I've never seen rugby fans reported on the news for running riot.

I think at 5 years old none of that is a concern TBH. In either football or Rugby. They might show a flicker of interest in either at 5 and be doing neither in a couple of years let alone supporting a team and being a hooligan.

Much nicer than football culture. And if he really wants to do it then why not let him try. The local clubs have really good programmes from age 4+ with the teens learning to coach the little ones alongside their own training. I'd look at a programme run from a proper club over Rugby Tots type programmes as you can continue with the same provision as long as you want. It's tag rugby and drills/skills at that age

Just let him give it a go. I'm in Scotland so not sure if it is different in England but up here, the primary 1 to primary 3 training is touch only. Not tackling. They do grab a little bit and get a but excited but it is touch rugby. Primary 4 is when it becomes full contact and requires gumsheilds. That's when they start learning to full on tackle. That's also the age where a lot of kids drop out, once they get a taste for tackling and decide whether or not they actually like that.

So let him try it and then when it's time for real tackling, he will have had a couple years experience and be ready for the next stage. And he might not even want to continue after it starts getting a bit dangerous!

I'm a woman , I play rugby , my kids play rugby i think you may be confused with football lol

I played for years, my brother played for years, my dad played for years.... none of us have ever been in trouble with the law, behave deliberately offensively, or developed a drinking problem. What we do have are great groups of friends, and amazing memories of team-based activities. We kept fit (wish I was half as fit now!), got into the outdoors, and got the opportunity to play representatively, and travel.

Yes, we have all had a few injuries, and I'm sure we all got carried away with daft games, and drank a few too many. But, the support I have personally found from rugby friends, is as fierce as the competition in the games.

Also - he's 5; it's non-contact, a run around with mates, and maybe an orange squash after - not a drug fueled bender to South Africa.
I would say the benefits massively outweigh the negatives.

Also, get him a mouthguard and headguard if you're worried about loose teeth and split heads. Mind you, it's all got a bit 'enthusiastic' if 5 year olds are getting those types of knocks. Let him enjoy it, and you can re-assess as time goes on.

I play rugby, I was a full time professional player, i’m now part time semi-professional.

Rugby is a great sport, team spirirt is very strong, rivlary is very friendly, fans sit together at games, they don’t need to be apart, racism really isn’t tolerated at all, neither is sexism, homophobia etc. Players don’t verbally abuse fans, refs etc. Poor behaviour just isn’t tolerated, that includes team mates, if someone is acting like a twat they’ll be told to stop it.

Teamwork, kindness, respect etc are really really drilled into rugby players, thats why you’re unlikely to see fans or players fighting, you’re unlikely to see us trashing anywhere because we lost and we certainly don’t sing racist chants.

Most university sports teams have initiations, at my university the most well known, so the worst was the tennis club.

I’ve never had to do any initiation, we still sometimes do stupid things, like soapy up a shower floor and sliding around on it, or putting more shampoo on someones head everytime they have rinsed. But nothing outrageous or dangerous.

My 13yr old grandson plays for his local club and has done since he was 8. It's a great masculine environment for him (no dad around) and the emphasis is on respect, playing as a team and channelling their competitiveness. He's made another group of friends apart from school, which is always a bonus, and they often meet up at the club to help set up for the seniors or act as ball boys as well as play their own matches. Please don't dismiss it out of hand - we'd sooner have him hanging out there at a weekend than on a street corner somewhere. As to drinking, well, I'm sure the blokes have a good time but no worse than with any other sport.

@StrychnineInTheSandwiches

And in my experience the old adage of “football is a gentlemen’s game played by thugs, while rugby is a thugs’ game played by gentlemen,” is largely true.

People always trot this one out and I'm not sure I agree with it. I've seen plenty of boorish behaviour from rugby players.

But if a 5 year old is enthusiastic about a sport I'd certainly be encouraging them to try it out.

Yy I think the old adage is just classism tbh. They mean 'gentlemen' by class and money - not by behaviour. I've seen much more boorish behaviour from rugby players (amateur teams) than football. Thinking rugby is for 'gentlemen' is elitist and classist, and can translate into certain rugby teams and clubs being cliquey.

You’re massively overthinking this.

In his teens, if he sticks with it, you’ll be delighted that he’s got such an active hobby. Kids hanging around with nothing to do are way worse than whatever you think happens in rugby.

It’s a really family friendly game.

I loath the rugby culture as do my Ds who despite being good players, preferred other sports. I’ve never been around so many twats in my life. I think it was Orwell who said if you want to get rid of fascism in England bomb Twickenham. Having spent an afternoon there, I think he had a point.
The way the game is played these days is also too dangerous. Macho attitudes are endangering children’s health.

When my godsons played, they were taught principles of fair play, discipline & respect. Strict rules of behaviour in the club house etc. Supposed to be a game for gentlemen.

The 'rugby culture' you describe is only if he continues until he's 14/15. And even then only a minority concern depending on the club in question.

A lot will happen between 5 and 14 - his continued love for the game will last until they all hit puberty, after which height, build and speed will be the determining factors. Rugby is a great game to play for both skills and confidence before that point, let him enjoy it.

For young kids it's quite inclusive ime fwiw and open to different body types and sporting ability unlike football which gets horrible in a madly aggressively competitive way far too young. At least in my area.

A game for people who like to think of themselves as gentlemen…

I think at 5 just enrol them in anything they take an interest in and see what happens. My two did football, tag rugby, judo, golf, keyboard, anything that was going... They stuck with football and golf in the end and both still play in five aside leagues now and go and watch matches. They have so far managed to not become football hooligans so it is possible.

I was relieved they dropped the rugby though because their friends who carried on had endless injuries. Broken collar bones seemed to be the usual. Hours of hospital appointments and physio, school /work missed etc.
I'm not saying there were no football injuries but there were a lot fewer.

If you must over think it.....

Every single rugby player I know ended up in a solid middle glass job, university, stable stable stable. I’d be more worried about injuries.

And that’s IF you have to overthink it.....

Once they play contact my kids gave up which was a relief. Injuries would be my major concern at school age tbh.

I much preferred going to the rugby bar than a football one in my pre kid days in the military.

I also gather your son will not be going to Uni or joining a public sector employment zone as drinking games are just a rite of passage IMO. Have you never seen the dentist chair in a uni bar??

Only excellent experiences from our kids doing rugby. Only vile experiences from them doing football.

I know what you mean OP I've always loathed rugby culture. Toxic mixture of misogyny and snobbery. I'm sure there's a lot of my own bias in there tbf.

On balance though I think the benefits for him of doing it and enjoying getting fit probably outweigh that and there are bound to be some OK people doing it.

We had great experiences from doing football. Met a really great bunch of people and had some great times DC1 started playing at 7 years old and was still playing up until Uni for the same team.
There were a few arsehole parents on the way but that's the same for any sport.

The potential for long term head injuries is the most worrying thing about rugby. Obv this is only going to effect 0.01% of 5 year olds who express an interest in the sport, but ex-players of 40 developing dementia is bloody tragic.

I’d be worried about injury, I wouldn’t worry about the ‘culture’ at all. Even allowing for the risk of injury, the benefits of sport for young people vastly outweigh the downsides and this becomes more and more apparent as they get older and the threat of all those negative influences becomes more real. At 5 it’s CBeebies or sport, at 15 it might be gangs or sport. So let him go for it.