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Original poster

Vaccine arguments are pulling us apart

390 replies

SmithCW · 28/12/2021 12:03

Hi everyone,

This is really hard for me to talk about as I know how judgemental some people are over anything COVID related. So, both me and my husband aren't vaccinated against COVID. At first it was because we weren't old enough (mid 20s) but when it became available for us we, like many of our peers, were hesitant to take the leap. The vaccine felt too new and we knew we would be TTC within the next few months and wanted to make sure it would be safe. My husband felt strongly that he didn't need it (98% survival rate for his age).

Over time there's so much more evidence about the side effects and whatnot and that coupled with the extreme pressures from society I've wanted to get vaccinated for the last few months. Problem is - he doesn't and really doesn't want me to either. His family (my in laws) have flipped and gone massive anti-vaxx in all the crazy extreme ways (they want us to promise we'd never get it) and although my husband isn't like that I can't help but feel he is heavily influenced by his family but he thinks I'm heavily influenced by mine (all had the vaccine and are desperate for me to).

It's hard to put this into words or to make people understand but I now feel CONSTANTLY anxious over this - it's like a dark cloud that follows me around. I feel like a black sheep in society and I HATE IT. But I'm also not ready to risk my marriage over it? I am so scared this will tear us apart and we are only newlyweds. We got married in Aug and have been TTC since. I just don't know what's right here. His family (especially his mum) are so full on about it that I genuinely think they'd cut me out for being vaccinated but I've been with him for 8 years and his parents are like parents to me - I'm so so scared of upsetting them. It's also sooooo hard when your husband is begging for you not to have it. He says he probably will get it eventually but not for a few years when he feels extremely confident that it won't have any future effects on our children and that we can't possibly know it won't for sure as it's not been around long enough.

I know he sounds OTT but he is honestly the most chilled guy - this is so unlike him. I have this fear that if I go and get it he: a) might just leave me. B) if I were to miscarry/ anything wrong with our child he'd blame me C) I'd tear him away from his family. They would bring this up at EVERY family gathering for years to come.

I know a lot of you will just say "your body your choice" and "good riddance" if he'd leave me but in reality that's a very, very different situation. I suppose I'm looking for some GENUINE advice here. I feel like it's breaking me apart and I can't cope anymore but I love him. I'm not stupid or naive here but I want a way to navigate and handle this in the right way.

Sorry for the long post and I hope I don't cause too much controversy- that's not my aim.

OP posts:
orderagain · 28/12/2021 22:56

OP look at the Royal College of Obstetrics and Gynaecology website. There have a massive amount of resources, all written and complied by medical experts in the field. It will give you all the information you and your OH require to make informed choices.

www.rcog.org.uk/en/guidelines-research-services/coronavirus-covid-19-pregnancy-and-womens-health/covid-19-vaccines-and-pregnancy/covid-19-vaccines-pregnancy-and-breastfeeding/

Dasher789 · 28/12/2021 23:29

@TeddybearBaby

I get it! It’s causing a massive rift in my family too and a falling out that went on for a months.

I can imagine you don’t even know how you feel any more when other peoples opinions are so strong and overwhelming.

I won’t tell you what to do but I will say that you’re not wrong in whatever you decide.

Sounds like your husband is coming from a place of fear which can make people act in crazy ways.

The vaccine argument reminds me of brexit. It’s really dividing us all, so sad.

I completely agree with this. Do what you feel is best for you op.
justasking111 · 28/12/2021 23:54

People who had the early small pox vaccine had bad reactions in a few cases, but it has saved lives worldwide

Luminousnose · 28/12/2021 23:56

I work with a young woman who recently had her first baby. Baby was conceived between mum’s first and second Covid vaccinations (both Pfizer). Everything is well with both mother and child.

justasking111 · 28/12/2021 23:58

South America once again has a poliomyelitis problem something we don't even think about.

Donenow1 · 29/12/2021 06:43

I know of someone who told his Daughter of 16 that he was "very disappointed in her for getting the vaccine. He is my best friend's ex and the Father of said child. He has completely fallen into the rabbit hole of anti vax and conspiracy theories. If he catches Covid I shall be telling my lovely friend NOT to help him in any way. I'm sorry love but I'm hearing alarm bells ringing loudly here. Your body, your vaccination.

Everydayimhuffling · 29/12/2021 08:03

There's currently a high hospitalisation and mortality rate for unvaccinated pregnant women, so you might want to think about that as part of your decision.

RampantIvy · 29/12/2021 08:06

Even a simpleton should be able to work out that that is a smaller number than the number of people who have died either from or with the virus itself.

Really I don't know why MN is allowing people to draw equivalence between the two. While not factually incorrect to say people have died of the vaccine, people who bring it up are either wilfully misrepresenting the truth or are so spectacularly stupid that they should be ignored.

I totally agree @thing47

All these people who don't understand statistics should retake GCSE maths.

Anycrispsleft · 29/12/2021 08:18

OP people who are speculating as to whether your relationship is controlling or abusive are not doing it to be insulting. We're doing it because we have had similar experiences in life - difficult home life, trouble with being assertive, early long term relationship, I've all of those - and we have had bad experiences as a result. Maybe it will be different for you. But just make sure you get the peace you need to make these decisions on your own account. Try and make sure that if everything did go sideways, you would have somewhere to go. And start speaking up for yourself. Maybe your DH doesn't see how controlling he's being.

newusername2009 · 29/12/2021 08:33

But don’t forget that if they get seriously ill / die as a direct impact of the vaccine and do so within 3 weeks of jab they are counted as unvaccinated. You need to get full info!

HangingOver · 29/12/2021 08:44

The absolute arrogance of the dimwits who bang on about their research is astounding. Listen to the actual experts, you are embarrassing yourself going on about doing your own research

This with bells on.

If they're so convinced they know more than the experts why don't they spend hours "researching" instead of listening to a dentist or lawyer. Do they also do their own structural surveys and cut their own hair? Why is this one particular issue the one that had made people decide that the people who spend their lives studying this stuff are wrong?

RedRobyn2021 · 29/12/2021 09:13

As others have said, I would be really worried about getting pregnant and him and his family trying to pressure you into their choices regarding the birth. Believe me, this is a difficult area and by the sounds of things they will have strong opinions about that too.

Also, when you have the baby, the choices you make (not just vaccinating, although that is important) but how you feed the baby, raise them, your choices and authority as a mother.

I would be pausing trying to conceive until you've sorted this out. Actions really do speak louder than words OP, just because your husband says "oh I wouldn't do that" doesn't mean that's true, look at his behaviour. I wouldn't want to bring a baby into this.

Anxiety will not be helping with your efforts to conceive either.

thepeopleversuswork · 29/12/2021 09:31

Even a simpleton should be able to work out that that is a smaller number than the number of people who have died either from or with the virus itself.

Really I don't know why MN is allowing people to draw equivalence between the two. While not factually incorrect to say people have died of the vaccine, people who bring it up are either wilfully misrepresenting the truth or are so spectacularly stupid that they should be ignored.

I'm coming around to this way of thinking. For a long time I thought it was better to allow these views to be heard because posters would effectively show them up as the nonsense they are but there are still people such as this poster who can't grasp the fact that a huge huge number of people have died from COVID and an incredibly small number from the vaccines. I think MN ought to think about deleting posts such as this one.

It really is quite disturbing that people still don't understand this.

JanisMoplin · 29/12/2021 09:55

@thepeopleversuswork

Even a simpleton should be able to work out that that is a smaller number than the number of people who have died either from or with the virus itself.

Really I don't know why MN is allowing people to draw equivalence between the two. While not factually incorrect to say people have died of the vaccine, people who bring it up are either wilfully misrepresenting the truth or are so spectacularly stupid that they should be ignored.

I'm coming around to this way of thinking. For a long time I thought it was better to allow these views to be heard because posters would effectively show them up as the nonsense they are but there are still people such as this poster who can't grasp the fact that a huge huge number of people have died from COVID and an incredibly small number from the vaccines. I think MN ought to think about deleting posts such as this one.

It really is quite disturbing that people still don't understand this.

I am getting tired of the "Let's not judge", " Both decisions are equally valid" and "You do you" brigade myself. One decision is supported by the Royal College of Gynaecologists. The other is supported by randoms on Facebook. The two are not and never will be equal.

Pregnant women are being misled by this false equivalence and putting themselves and their babies in danger. This is a parenting site.

ManicPixie · 29/12/2021 10:05

Don’t start a family with an anti-vaxxer. He’ll definitely be weird about it with your kids no matter what he says. His mother sounds like a nightmare too. Get away from them.

thepeopleversuswork · 29/12/2021 10:09

@JanisMoplin

I am getting tired of the "Let's not judge", " Both decisions are equally valid" and "You do you" brigade myself

I agree. Some of the views around vaccines on this thread and others are terrifyingly stupid. Stupid enough to make me think people like this don't even have the intellectual capacity for the bodily autonomy they bang on about at every turn. With power over your body and the bodies of others comes responsibility. I blame this dreadful "my body my choice" mantra for a lot of this. Lots of barely literate people who don't know this has been appropriated from the abortion movement are throwing this out with wild abandon every time they are called on the stupidity of their antivaxx positions.

MNHQ out of interest would you not think that claiming false equivalence between vaccine deaths and COVID deaths warrants a misinformation flag of some kind?

Crayfishforyou · 29/12/2021 10:21

If you want to get vaccinated, go do it. Your DH’s family are morons.
I was ill for over 18 months with covid the first time. I still get symptoms and struggle.
The second time I got covid I was fully vaccinated and was ill for two weeks.
Please think about your future with someone who is being this controlling over your choices and your body.

ravenmum · 29/12/2021 12:36

There are people with decades of experience and with a better grasp of stats who have already done that research
I've heard news reports telling me the number of people who've had side effects from vaccinations, what the side effects were, how the statistics should be understood. Then someone says that they know people who have fallen ill after getting the vaccine so they are not getting it. So have the scientists who've compiled those detailed reports missed things that are so obvious they can be spotted by any old Jo Bloggs? Are all scientists actually James Bond villains plotting to take over the world in a very roundabout way? Or has an uninformed person got the wrong end of the stick? What's the most likely?

I've reported posts like this to MN before and got the answer that we are supposed to correct misinformation ourselves. They will delete some of the verifiably incorrect statements that could lead to people making life-threatening decisions, but not all, as a few well-written posts will surely deal with that issue.

Seemssounfair · 29/12/2021 13:07

@SmithCW

This. It's so worrying... the speed at which he wants to make sure she is knocked up. What's the damn hurry if you are in your mid-twenties?

^^

I asked for advice on how to navigate the conflict this is causing in my marriage not your opinion on when YOU think is acceptable time for me to want to get pregnant.

You sound confident in your choices and able to stand up for yourself in this post.

Ask yourself why you cant do that with, the one person you should be able to safely and freely have your own voice with, your partner? Or are you only confident because these are his opinions too? Opinions his family also agree on?

thing47 · 29/12/2021 16:08

@HangingOver

The absolute arrogance of the dimwits who bang on about their research is astounding. Listen to the actual experts, you are embarrassing yourself going on about doing your own research

This with bells on.

If they're so convinced they know more than the experts why don't they spend hours "researching" instead of listening to a dentist or lawyer. Do they also do their own structural surveys and cut their own hair? Why is this one particular issue the one that had made people decide that the people who spend their lives studying this stuff are wrong?

Apologies for returning to this issue, but I had a bit more to add Smile

DD2 (who lives with me) has a recent first-class Masters in this field – quite literally, as the title of her MSc was 'Control of Infectious Diseases'. This was obtained at a world-leading university. The original research she conducted for her dissertation was on mRNA sequencing (though admittedly not to do with Covid).

I can assure you that she has access to research, papers and studies which the general public just does not have. I can hardly understand a word of her work, on account of it being highly complex. The experts advising us re. Covid and vaccines have similar qualifications to this, PLUS 20-30 years' work experience on top. Anyone who thinks they are just as well-informed as these scientists because they have done a bit of reading are delusional.

Liz1tummypain · 29/12/2021 18:37

I don't see why you have to follow his instructions. It is your choice. So make the choice for yourself. All the best.

Lennon80 · 29/12/2021 19:42

A pregnant woman contracted covid and died on Boxing Day leaving her two month old with no mother - get the jab don’t tell him your health records are private and this doesn’t affect him. His family sound like fruit loops!

RampantIvy · 30/12/2021 00:31

@thing47 DD is studying biomedical sciences at a well regarded university. She achieved 98% in a recent immunology exam. She is needle phobic, but couldn't wait to get vaccinated because she understands the science behind vaccinations. She reads pubmed publications that she has assessments on, and pours scorn on some of the ridiculous comments she sees on social media.

PeeAche · 30/12/2021 00:42

You poor thing. Your DH has lost the plot - this vaccine is the most trialled vaccine in all the world!

You can get your vaccine in secret. Your arm won't be noticeably "jabbed".

If you conceive, your midwife is going to have a whole list of vaccines for you - including 3 Covid jabs. And lots more for baby after birth.

The way you are feeling is a normal reaction to pulling against an enmeshed family. Google enmeshment and see how much of it rings true. I'm with PP that perhaps you should put the brakes on the TTC for a wee bit.xxx

Cornishclio · 30/12/2021 00:57

90% of the people in intensive care with Covid are unvaccinated. Does that not mean anything to you? Your husband and his DPs sound unhinged and I would seriously reconsider staying with a man who says he would leave you if you get vaccinated to protect yours, any future baby you may have and others from this awful virus. They are putting such immense pressure on you about this that I cannot help but think what else they will bully you over if you have children with this man. This is a decision for you alone. Do your research then decide what is best for you. Your PILs don't get a say and you need to start standing up for yourself if you want to have a baby as you need to put him or her first not your PILs or even your DH.