AIBU to be horrified? (content warning: sex crimes)

[Aromatica]

I've read about this case where John Ernest Goodier has been charged with bestiality, child pornography, drug possession and not sticking to his sex offenders conditions.

He recently goes by the name Claire. This paper refers to him as a man but many of the others refer to him as a woman.
www.northwichguardian.co.uk/news/19682778.northwich-man-admits-sex-dog/

AIBU to be horrified that this might be reported and recorded as a woman's crime and may serve time in a woman's prison?

(Yes I did post this before but requested it was deleted, so I could post again with a poll. In the interim, the ability to add a poll has gone and I can't see any polls in AIBU. Peculiar 🤔)

Or put them with the transage tranself paedophile mentioned in the previous daily mail link. I can’t believe the judiciary goes along with pronouns for a dangerous predator who clearly should be nowhere near any children or females. The media also needs to wise up and stop calling these monsters women

YANBU
THROW HIM IN A HIGH SECURITY MALE PRISON AND THROW AWAY THE KEY!

I have no brief for the prisoner but I think the prison service should protect itself from law suits and house in the prison in isolation or some kind of protected area.

No the crime has nothing to do with gender preference, women are anyway capable of horrendous crimes

The crime has nothing to do with gender preference.

That this is someone with a history of sexual offence has everything to do with who they are shut up in a cell with.

Which these days had a lot to do with gender identification.

@Strangeways19

No the crime has nothing to do with gender preference, women are anyway capable of horrendous crimes, I don't get the whole wishing she does the time in a male prison.

Without medical & proper professional direction the trans status in the eyes of the law doesn't stand anyway.
Christ though, a dog, what state of mind would you have to be in for that to happen.
Is there a full story somewhere?

There is no such thing as "gender preference".

@Nomoreusernames1244

It also doesn't matter if this offender ends up in a female prison as far as I'm concerned - as long as they are taken out of society then all is good. Any prisoner (male or female, in any prison) who is a threat to staff or other inmates should be placed in isolation anyway

This person is not a threat to male staff or inmates, only female. They know that, and they know sex offenders of this kind won’t get an easy time in a male prison, whereas a female prison, whether it’s in isolation or not, will be significantly easier because women are socialised to “be kind”, and their physical strength will mean no staff or inmates will feel safe enough to challenge them. They would be able to overpower a female guard relatively easily. So even in isolation why should be put women simply trying to do their jobs at risk?

What if that prison officer is your sister or daughter? Would you still be happy with them having to take this prisoner their lunch, escort them from place to place, sit with them if they have to go to medical, observe them in the shower?

A person who identifies as a woman is entitled to ask for a female officer to perform any necessary body searches. Apparently some prisoners take full advantage of this in an attempt to embarrass and humiliate female officers.

What happened to the poll? I would predict that roughly 99% would think this mans behaviour is horrifying and he does deserve to go to a male prison. As should all other males, with or without penises, and regardless of their crimes. There is always a small percentage who will think these criminals deserve more respect and kindness than any woman. And this does not mean that I think that prison conditions generally should be improved. Glad to see this in AIBU and posters can always pop over to the feminist board for more information on the implications of pretending you can change sex.

I'm somewhat cynically wondering if this particular criminal will get less sympathy and 'respect' from the system because his victims weren't just children or women but a dog.

It DOES matter if he ends up in a woman's prison. How vile to suggest it doesn't. Why would you want a dangerous paedophile locked up with women?

To answer the various people who made similar comments to my previous post, my personal belief is that the important thing is that the offender is in prison, i.e. not on the streets. That way their potential to find other victims is restricted to fellow criminals.

I don't particularly want "a dangerous paedophile locked up with women" - I just want a dangerous paedophile locked up, end of. It's not like (s)he's being sent to a young offenders institute, (s)he'll be with adult prisoners.

Prisons - male or female - are not "nice" places, neither are they supposed to be. They are full of abuse, bullying, coercion and intimidation. They're more like Time than Porridge, weaker inmates will always be targeted by stronger ones. Moreover, they're full of criminals. That's why I don't really worry about a transman ending up in a male prison or transwoman ending up in a female one, if they continue to offend inside their victims will be fellow prisoners rather than innocent people.

I think it's quite offensive to imagine that female prisoners are somehow "nicer" than male ones. There are a lot of appalling female criminals, Rose West for example, doesn't strike me as deserving any additional protection from someone like Goodier than Wayne Couzens does. It's also frankly misogynistic to assume that female prisoners are inherently weaker or less capable than their male counterparts.

I accept there needs to be a debate as to the extent to which prisoner-on-prisoner crime should be tolerated, but I don't think it's as simple as arguing male-on-male and female-on-female abuses are OK but female-on-male or male-on-female aren't. The idea that a transwoman has to be kept out of a women's prison implies that it's OK for TW-male or male-TW abuse is fine (as is female-female). There's a reasonable argument that prisoners shouldn't be allowed to abuse one another AT ALL, regardless of the genders of the perpetrator and victim but I disagree it's right to allow some abuses but not others as many seem to think.

Ofgs

@MorningStarling You don’t think it matters whether a male paedophile gets sent to a women’s prison - which often have mother and baby units? Why are you not bothered about paedophiles and sex offenders being locked away with women? Is there something wrong with you?

It's also frankly misogynistic to assume that female prisoners are inherently weaker or less capable than their male counterparts.

That’s not misogyny, that’s a biological fact.

Wow.
Well, there's a poster who might be taking the rejection of #bekind a tad to far.

And speaking of Wayne Couzens and keeping in mind his crimes, if he suddenly decided to identify as a women, would you be in support of his transfer to a women’s prison @MorningStarling? Why, or why not?

I think it's quite offensive to imagine that female prisoners are somehow "nicer" than male ones

I don’t care how nice or not female prisoners are. They still have the right not to be placed at risk of sexual assault, rape, possible pregnancy etc while in prison.

This risk is completely negated by putting male sexual offenders in male prison, whatever gender they identify as.

I don't get the whole wishing she does the time in a male prison.
You don't get why a man should be in a male prison?

A third of women are in prison for failure to pay their tv licence.
Most of them are in prison for non violent crime.
60% of them are victims of domestic abuse. 53% were abused as children.

So yes, they are 'nicer' than male prisoners.

There's also the shocking statistic that 80% of women prisoners have suffered head injuries as a result of domestic and/or sexual abuse - www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57103702

@JaneJeffer no I don't get it. I don't get why people on here are making such an issue out of why this person should above all else do their time in a male prison, at the time without full knowledge of whether she has actually transitioned (which at this point now, we do know as it later has transpired that she hasn't) and as I said in my original post, without the confirmation of a specialist doctor, in law they won't be considered female (as they would if they had a certificate).
What I am getting at is that if she had a legal confirmation they would of course be in a female prison, this is the law. If she didn't then they would do their time in a male prison, and this is how it has transpired at this point.
I am simply saying that without prior knowledge of what the status of this person is, no one should just assume that violent crime is more prevalent in a female or male prison, it is very clear that it is in both. They will get protected cells anyway, whatever you think, as did Rose West, Myra Hindley Ian Brady

"A third of women are in prison for failure to pay their tv licence."

What? where the hell did you read that?!! Beano ??!

@Clymene

A third of women are in prison for failure to pay their tv licence. Most of them are in prison for non violent crime. 60% of them are victims of domestic abuse. 53% were abused as children.

So yes, they are 'nicer' than male prisoners.

These stats sound very dodgy, ie: 'most of them' and the stats - where are they from?! They sound seriously flawed

Also even if they were correct, it does not mean that female prisons are in any way nicer than male prisons. Look up Erin Pizzey, who began the women's aid refuge movement, she has something very different to say now about female violence and how underestimated it is.

@Strangeways19 nothing you say makes any sense to me. No matter how violent a woman is they stand no chance against a violent man like the dog rapist.

@Strangeways19

"A third of women are in prison for failure to pay their tv licence."

What? where the hell did you read that?!! Beano ??!

According to Gov.uk, 99% of women who appear in court because of failure to pay for their TV licences are dismissed with a fine, so I suspect that the women are not there solely for failure to pay but that there are additional charges.

Also even if they were correct, it does not mean that female prisons are in any way nicer than male prisons. Look up Erin Pizzey, who began the women's aid refuge movement, she has something very different to say now about female violence and how underestimated it is.

No, that is as incorrect as your previous posts, @Strangeways19. Ms Pizzey noted that domestic violence is complicated and nuanced and not as simple as victim - victimiser, as many people claim.

Really, your posts are nonsense and anyone who takes them seriously needs to learn to think critically.

@Strangeways19

As of March 2019, there were 34 transgender women without GRCs allocated to a woman's prison

That is, without legal confirmation. If they say they are a woman, they can ask to be sent to a female prison.

A judge has ruled that Women's prisons can house inmates who were born male but identify as female, regardless of whether they have gone through any physical transformation or have obtained a gender recognition certificate.

Source: www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57692993.amp