AIBU to be horrified? (content warning: sex crimes)

[Aromatica]

I've read about this case where John Ernest Goodier has been charged with bestiality, child pornography, drug possession and not sticking to his sex offenders conditions.

He recently goes by the name Claire. This paper refers to him as a man but many of the others refer to him as a woman.
www.northwichguardian.co.uk/news/19682778.northwich-man-admits-sex-dog/

AIBU to be horrified that this might be reported and recorded as a woman's crime and may serve time in a woman's prison?

(Yes I did post this before but requested it was deleted, so I could post again with a poll. In the interim, the ability to add a poll has gone and I can't see any polls in AIBU. Peculiar 🤔)

I am shocked that anyone thinks it s OK for a man, especially a known sex offender to be locked up with women! I am struggling to believe that the risks of that aren't glaringly obvious.

I am not anti trans in anyway but if you identify as male when you commit the crime then you should be sentenced as a male.

No penis belongs in a woman's prison.

I think if it comes out they'd already approached their GP/therapist about identifying as female prior to this there should maybe be slightly different considerations (although I'm still torn)

These get out of jail clauses...

Do you know that judges often let males off rather than jail these men, because they don't want to put them in with women.

Would having told his GP in advance, he was thinking that he might identify as a dog help get him off this charge?

The Daily Male article I saw had resolved the issue of pronouns by simply referring to the person as "The Pervert".
Works for me.

And these crimes need to be properly recorded by the correct sex of the perpetrator for accurate statistical records.

No males should be in a female prison whatever their pronouns.

It DOES matter if he ends up in a woman's prison. How vile to suggest it doesn't. Why would you want a dangerous paedophile locked up with women?

Especially as women's prisons sometimes have baby units with them.

MorningStarling Should we only isolate a convicted paedophile after that person harms a baby in the prison, or should we ensure that the risk posed to women and babies is 0 by not placing that person in a women's prison in the first place?

Why are we respecting the preferred pronouns of a convicted rapist at all? In what way is using one's penis to rape somebody 'living as a woman'?

I'm absolutely fine with people being trans and using the spaces that reflect that provided they're being used correctly.

Can you be sure you'd be 'absolutely fine' if you were a woman who'd been assaulted by a male? Your perception of another persons sex and instinctive reaction would likely be unaffected by their own internal sense of 'gender identity'. And regardless of your own feelings, do you understand that's how it works for many women. Whose feelings do you prioritise?

Unfortunately now the rights of male sex offenders are a higher priority than the rights of women and girls to be protected from them

A recent judicial review ruled that transwomen, including those with no GRC, and including those who have been convicted of sexual offences against women can be housed in the female prison estate, despite women in those prisons having experienced sexual assault and harassment due to this policy. www-bbc-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57692993.amp?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQKKAFQArABIIACAw%3D%3D#aoh=16402635612441&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s

So the claim by some posters that there are no issues with housing transwomen in the female prison estate is false. Women are being put at risk in prison as a result of this policy.

For anyone interested, the website Keep Prisons Single Sex is excellent for more information.

In the interim, the ability to add a poll has gone and I can't see any polls in AIBU.
Can you ask MNHQ to add a poll for you?

The thread in Chat was deleted because it started getting out of hand with personal attacks and people making overtly transphobic comments (like calling trans people 'freaks').

I'm as gender critical as they come and do not believe this person is a woman any more than I believe the sky is green. Nor do I believe he should be tried as a woman or serve time in the female estate. But the thread in Chat crossed a whole load of lines, it is disingenuous in the extreme to say it was deleted "because people weren't speaking nicely enough".

@Lockheart

The thread in Chat was deleted because it started getting out of hand with personal attacks and people making overtly transphobic comments (like calling trans people 'freaks').

I'm as gender critical as they come and do not believe this person is a woman any more than I believe the sky is green. Nor do I believe he should be tried as a woman or serve time in the female estate. But the thread in Chat crossed a whole load of lines, it is disingenuous in the extreme to say it was deleted "because people weren't speaking nicely enough".

As an adult, I don't need MN deleting threads in case they offend though? Or do they delete because advertisers would be cross?

As an adult, I don't need MN deleting threads in case they offend though? Or do they delete because advertisers would be cross?

MNs talk guidelines say they will delete (among other things) personal attacks, racism, homophobia, transphobia etc.

If that does not suit I suggest that you find a different forum.

This board can be so bizarre sometimes. Parents get lambasted for shouting at their kids yet a sex offender with a penchant for fucking dogs is afforded respect and understanding.

Completely bizarre.

Fucking disgusting. I mean the crime and potentially putting the pervert in a cell with a woman

@MorningStarling

Yes, YABU "to be horrified that this might be reported and recorded as a woman's crime and may serve time in a woman's prison?"

What difference does it make whether it's a man or a woman that allows themselves "to be penetrated by a dog" - either way it's fucking disgusting and the offender should be locked up. I honestly don't understand the fuss over whether a crime is attributed to a male or a female - a rape victim is still a rape victim, a sexual assault victim is still a sexual assault victim, the gender of the attacker doesn't change that.

It also doesn't matter if this offender ends up in a female prison as far as I'm concerned - as long as they are taken out of society then all is good. Any prisoner (male or female, in any prison) who is a threat to staff or other inmates should be placed in isolation anyway.

This is staggeringly ignorant.

Yes it matters. For extremely obvious reasons.

If we aren't accurately recording crime statistics, why bother recording them at all?Maybe you genuinely don't understand why we do that. It's because, without understanding who commits crime and who is victimised, we cannot safeguard and design effective prevention. How do we safeguard women and children (and animals) against the men (and it is overwhelmingly men, 98% of offenders are men) who commit these crimes if we can no longer tell who is committing the crimes? Who does that serve? Only the offenders.

As for not caring whether violent men are locked up with vulnerable women. I despair of someone with so little humanity. Tell Karen White's victims that it didn't matter.

He's a disgusting, vile, filthy pervert to do that to an animal. I hope he's sent to a male prison and that he's on the receiving end of something equally depraved

Completely agree with @Outlyingtrout. What the hell is the point in collecting data if the data is flawed? It’s a useless exercise.

These statistics are utilised in law making. We will get to a point where a flag will be raised as to why women’s offending has risen so sharply and how this demographic can be helped. Except it isn’t actually women is it. Most women who are locked up are in there for smaller, less violent offending such as fraud, drug related theft etc. Yes there is a portion of women who are violent. Yes we can also be sex offenders. But my god it’s a small ration. Or at least it was.

I thought the word "freak" was used in relation to the activity with the dog.

The thread in Chat was deleted because it started getting out of hand with personal attacks and people making overtly transphobic comments (like calling trans people 'freaks').

The thread was deleted before I got to the end but the freak comment I saw was to refer to this individual in these terms: "What a twisted freak he is."

I'm not sure your account is that honest.

This is the result of letting wokeness take precedent over common sense.

He's a man who likes to dress up as a woman. Let's be very clear here.

YOu ANBU it's outrageous that this crime would be reported as if a women committed it and that the person might have even do their time in a female prison. On top of the disgusting behavior it just reinforces concerns about self ID.

@nauticant

The thread in Chat was deleted because it started getting out of hand with personal attacks and people making overtly transphobic comments (like calling trans people 'freaks').

The thread was deleted before I got to the end but the freak comment I saw was to refer to this individual in these terms: "What a twisted freak he is."

I'm not sure your account is that honest.

That's not the post I reported (and which was deleted).

@MorningStarling

Yes, YABU "to be horrified that this might be reported and recorded as a woman's crime and may serve time in a woman's prison?"

What difference does it make whether it's a man or a woman that allows themselves "to be penetrated by a dog" - either way it's fucking disgusting and the offender should be locked up. I honestly don't understand the fuss over whether a crime is attributed to a male or a female - a rape victim is still a rape victim, a sexual assault victim is still a sexual assault victim, the gender of the attacker doesn't change that.

It also doesn't matter if this offender ends up in a female prison as far as I'm concerned - as long as they are taken out of society then all is good. Any prisoner (male or female, in any prison) who is a threat to staff or other inmates should be placed in isolation anyway.

YABU NOT to be horrified by it. We have single sex prisons and other spaces for women because we know they are at risk from men. When you put a male (however he may identify) sex offender in a woman's prison you make women vulnerable.

Most women in prison are there for non violent crimes. We know that transwomen continue to commit violent and sexual crimes at the same rate as 'cis' males. When male crimes are recorded as female crimes it skews the statistics; if females seem to be commiting violent crime at a similar rate to males then you remove the justification for women to have single sex safe spaces.

Complete waste of time & energy trying to explain it to some as they see women as deserving of whats to come, we’re just collateral damage, you won’t change these progressive's mind, they are firmly wedded to their screwed up beliefs.

It really feels like most people posting have no clue how prisons work or what they are actually like.

Women can and are also assaulted by other women, don't apply non prison statistics to prison. From that perspective, having a penis doesn't mean that a person (I am not talking about this particular disgusting waste of air) is any more or less likely to assault someone than someone without a penis.

A person sentenced to prison is risk assessed and if considered a risk of harm to someone else, would not be put in a position of being able to access said others. For example they could be isolated.

This risk assessment will take into consideration their history i.e. of sex offences.

It is unlikely that a pre operative trans person would be expected to share a cell with someone else.

This vile human beings 'transition' does seem suspect, I agree. But people are letting their disgust for this person spread to other trans people as if they are all the same and speaking about prison circumstances that are completely made up. It's just fuelling more trans hate.