Confused by the ‘great fathers’

[Electricbug321]

AIBU to be confused and frustrated that describe their DP as a great/brilliant/fantastic father in their OP, but then describe behaviour that is anything but good parenting. At best the men in those posts are only doing the fun stuff or are ‘hands on’ but only around for a few minutes a day.

Is the bar really so low for men?

Perhaps making shared parental leave mandatory would help.

Yes yes and yes.

@Carinattheliqorstore1

Perhaps making shared parental leave mandatory would help. DH had 3 months at home with DS while I was working: and it helped make him an “equal” parent. (I suppose also having to look after DS on his own while I was in hospital for a month when DD was 6 months old also helped.

DH was a bit pissed off when my mum said I was lucky he was such a “helpful” dad: he pointed out that he was just doing his share of parenting

Possibly however there are many many men who refuse to cope and the woman ends up running ragged trying to do a full time job night feeds clean the house etc etc all because he is "trying his best" and "can't cope"

@Theunamedcat sadly, I think you could be right for some men.

The phrase which makes me die inside is "amazing dad", because it's always followed by a comprehensive list of ways in which said "amazing dad" is a completely shit parent.

Please remember that some of those women have either been brought up by obviously abusvie fathers (so their bar is very low), and /or they’ve been manipulated to believe that their partner IS a great dad:

“These two are the light of my life”, “Let Daddy read you a story tonight, precious princess” etc…..as he beats up their mummy either physically or mentally.

See gaslighting etc. It’s obviously wrong when you’re seeing it from the outside but can horrendously confusing when you’re in the midst of it.

@Carinattheliqorstore1

Perhaps making shared parental leave mandatory would help. DH had 3 months at home with DS while I was working: and it helped make him an “equal” parent. (I suppose also having to look after DS on his own while I was in hospital for a month when DD was 6 months old also helped.

DH was a bit pissed off when my mum said I was lucky he was such a “helpful” dad: he pointed out that he was just doing his share of parenting

I'm not sure about that. I couldn't have returned to work earlier than I did due to birth injury, but couldn't have afforded for us both to be on statutory mat pay. Plus DS was a bottle refuser, after 12 months he managed well on food and water, but before that wouldn't have coped without me for 9-10 hours a day.

@WorraLiberty

I agree *@Gettingthereslowly2020*

It's nearly always "DP works very long hours, 6 days a week".

They can't see that they've given them the luxury of being able to work all these hours, because often it's bloody easier than doing an 8 hour shift and then dealing with kids, dinner, homework, after school clubs etc after work, like many women have to do because the bloke's working 'long hours'

This!!’ Its no misogynistic and archaic to only place value on the thing that generates money. I’d rather do 50 hours a week than be a SAHM to a baby or toddler

I agree that this happens in wider society. Men get so much fucking praise for doing anything with their children. Women doing exactly the same thing do not. In fact, we get judgement and crap.

I’d rather do 50 hours a week than be a SAHM to a baby or toddler

Yep. And this is why I returned to full time work when I didn't have to!

A lot of this depends on who’s working.

If parent A is working 40-60 hours a week, and parent B isn’t working at all or is working part time then it’s not reasonable to expect all parenting and chores to be shared 50-50.

Parent B is doing paid work pt AND ft running of the home, kids, mental load. Yay! I don't think anyone is suggesting that someone with fewer hours in paid employment should sit on their arse on principle. But the domestic side is not seen as 'work' or as contributing, it just happens. And this thread isn't really about that anyway, it's about the insanely minimal expectations society in general has of male parents that allow them to do minimal domestic or parenting tasks or do them badly and get lauded for it while a woman gets crucified for forgetting the £1 for the pta fundraiser or giving dcs fishfingwrs twice a week. And as for nrp dads, it's perfectly OK apparently to see their kids 4 days a month.. That's 'normal' and good enough. If a mum was to do that there'd be cats bum mouths all over the shop about the poor abandoned kids and how could a MOTHER do that.

@Carinattheliqorstore1

Perhaps making shared parental leave mandatory would help. DH had 3 months at home with DS while I was working: and it helped make him an “equal” parent. (I suppose also having to look after DS on his own while I was in hospital for a month when DD was 6 months old also helped.

DH was a bit pissed off when my mum said I was lucky he was such a “helpful” dad: he pointed out that he was just doing his share of parenting

I don't know if that's the answer. I've only just managed to cut ds2's feeds down to morning and night at 12 months old. He really needed that middle of the day feed until recently. Maybe if they re-jigged the leave so the dads time was in addition to the 12 months maternity leave.

The bar for a good dad is so low it's a tavern in Hades. Anything a man does with his children and he's amazing. If he fucks it up, oh at least he tried! Whereas mums are judged if things are not absolutely perfect.

I remember 2 concurrently running threads where child care was discussed. One: 'So as I work as X, of course I will take all the sick days and time off.' Second: 'I have to take all the sick days and time off, not possible with DH's job, he works as X'.
Yes, X was the same thing. Amazingly flexible when done by a woman, as it seems.

If parent A is working 40-60 hours a week, and parent B isn’t working at all or is working part time then it’s not reasonable to expect all parenting and chores to be shared 50-50.

Ah this is another interesting thing. While I still carry most of the mental load, buy kids' clothes and other supplies, do laundry, make xmas magical and 1000 other things. About half the pick ups and drop offs, sick days, homeschooling. But DH is clearly more involved and does more at home and with kids than 99% of men. Great, you say?
However, now add that I've always earned considerably more and have a much higher ranking job.
Can you imagine if I was a man doing all that? OMG, supporting the family, and still such an involved parent! I even iron my own shirts!

As a mother, I'm of course inadequate as food in my kids' lunchboxes are not carefully crafted into cute animals and I apparently put my career above their needs, preferring to spend my time in the office instead of giving it all up to be a full time mother, as I've been told countless times both in real life and MN..

@Potplant

It’s hard to admit to yourself that the you picked a dud.

This.

@Elfonthesofa. it boils my piss the amount of times that a child is taken into care because mum has reached breaking point with whatever crisis she's having after years, dad has never really been involved but has had the child for all of a fortnight and "can't cope/manage"

It would be interesting to know what percentage of children go to grandparents/wider family or into care when single mums are having difficulties coping as opposed to being looked after by their dads. It's a depressing statistic that 95% of children with a mother who is sent to prison are forced to leave their homes. There's been some research to show that most go into foster care or stay with grandparents/wider family rather than with their fathers.

@Same360

A lot of this depends on who’s working.

If parent A is working 40-60 hours a week, and parent B isn’t working at all or is working part time then it’s not reasonable to expect all parenting and chores to be shared 50-50.

It’s still not reasonable if the working parent is treated like a god for taking his children to the park. And told repeatedly how amazing he is. And how wonderful his children are.

Whereas it’s just expected of the mother. No one is looking to put her on the queen’s honours list and they don’t wax lyrical about those same children. No. She gets judgemental looks if they do anything.

Even worse, the children objectively do behave better for her. Still she gets all the complaints and no praise for her or the children.

How does this mental load concept work then?

Does Mrs hr have to share my mental load too?

@Hrpuffnstuff1

How does this mental load concept work then?

Does Mrs hr have to share my mental load too?

english.emmaclit.com/2017/05/20/you-shouldve-asked/

How much of your mental load is related to your home and children? The home you live in and the children you helped make? Your wife works part time yes? But as well as that is she also responsible for all school runs / childcare / booking activities / haircuts / playdates / birthday invites and presents / endless school requests for costumes / money / inset days / trip forms / washing of uniform ready for the week /Remembering that they need games kit on Tuesday but not Thursday this week because thats an activity so they need a gold plated unicorn instead that day / remberung theres a match not training on Saturday so you need to leave at X and pick up johnny on the way / and the shop needs to e oredered and delivered on Thursday because Child has a party so you won't be there on Friday and the plumber hasn't rung back.... Any of that fall in your lap MrHR?

Yes, the usual thread that goes;

I'm on my knees with sleep deprivation / exhausion - what can I do to make things easier?

DP can't help at all cause he has an ultra important job which requires not a ounce of sleep is missed / I also do all housework too cos DP needs his rest after working a long day - but still, can anyone advise what I can do to make things easier???

Ah yes, get your twat of a DP to actually parent, having a job doesn't absolve him of this & stop being a martyr FFS.

Also que some commenters that agree she should do everything cos he works & being home with a baby / young child is easy, sure they just nap & you can watch Netflix all day.

FFS!

I sent that “mental load” comic to my ex shortly before we broke up.

… he asked me to “sum it up” for him.

It drives me crazy.

There seems to be a deep rooted feeling in many women that they're somehow obliged to say something good about their partner even when he's an absolute arsehole. The fact he hasn't killed and eaten his own young seems to qualify when there's nothing else.

No good father treats the mother of his children like dirt.

@Hrpuffnstuff1. Does Mrs hr have to share my mental load too?

Do you deal with nursery or school stuff, remember school events, plan holiday childcare, organise emergency childcare for sick children, organise presents for parties, buy your children's birthday and Christmas gifts, buy gifts and cards for teachers, liaise with other parents on the school Whatsapp, organise playdates, sort out doctor and dentists' appointments, meal plan, shop, manage household chores, pack nursery and school backpacks, remember reading books, supervise homework, plan and book holidays, check that you haven't run out of household essentials, and so on?

Are you 'default' in your household so you do all of these things without anyone else having to remind you?

If so, then you should absolutely be asking your partner to step up and share your mental load. Because those are things you do for both of you to keep your joint household running smoothly.