Having a baby isn't an automatic reason to ignore everyone

[yellowleaves123]

Didn't quite know how to title this with it making sense. I will say first up, I have two children, one is under 2 so we have done the baby phase not so long ago.

I will also say in the below situation, this clearly does not apply to people with PND.

I'm not sure why having a baby is kind of an excuse to ignore your friends - never responding to texts or not answering calls (although I don't really call people because I don't think I know a single person that likes phone calls).
I don't mean somebody calls, you don't pick up the phone, and then you're "ignoring them". Or you don't text back within 24 hours and you're "ignoring them".
I mean not reply to texts for weeks on end, then 3 weeks later "hi sorry I didn't reply, must see you soon. Life is so crazy with baby yellowleaves. How are you?" and then subsequently, do not reply for another number of weeks.

Totally get it with newborns. You aren't sleeping and you're recovering from birth. Life has been turned on its head again. But when the babies are bigger, kind of 4 months plus (if you aren't sleeping or other stuff is going on then I get it)....is having a baby really an excuse to be, frankly, kind of rude?

This seems to be a pattern with everyone around me that has a baby. When mine were babies, I don't recall not getting back to friends. Even when they were very small I still tried not to neglect my other relationships. Even if it was just "hi, sorry, life is a bit busy right now, I'm not really sleeping - teething is hitting us hard. Can we arrange to catch up in a couple of weeks once we are settled down? I'll let you know when would be a better time"

I try not to be the friend that puts on mothers. If I do see friends with newborns for example, I usually come with cake, I make the tea, if I know they'd want it then I might even bring a few precooked meals for them (some people would be really put out by this but obviously I know the friends that will appreciate it). I have before said to mum, when she has been saying she hasn't showered in a week "would you like me to look after baby for 30 mins for you so that you can freshen up".

So what is it with just not getting back to people and using that as an excuse for months on end? I'm beginning to feel really put out by some friends. Especially if I can see that they're making efforts to see mums from baby groups for example (not always the case but sometimes).

Massively unreasonable and you say you don't apply this to people with PND but how do you know they don't have it?!? Many people's mental health is shot due to covid and a new baby on top of that, bully for you that you always managed to text back in a timely fashion, others of us aren't so lucky to have the head space for it!

It took me 4 years to “refind” myself and the space to nurture friendships after having DS.

In the space of a year, I became a parent, developed severe PPA, then became a single parent working full time with a 9 month old. With a MH issue.

I literally didn’t have time to eat, and no energy for anything except survival.

Then the pandemic hit.

I am only now, now that DS is 5, finding I have enough energy for trying to salvage friendships.

Luckily most of my friends are more understanding than you... some are not, and I understand that and respect their feelings.

But sometimes you have no idea how hard someone is finding becoming a mother. I hid it really really well. Only in hindsight can people see how much I was struggling.

Yabu.

My DS is 6, and to this day I still go through phases where I just don't have the mental or emotional capacity to respond to messages. It's much easier to ignore group chats as they swiftly move on, but I try to leave people on unread rather than read on individual chats. Those close to me know this is just how I am, if it's relevant I'm incredibly introverted and find any kind of social interaction draining. I'll go through occasional spurts where I respond but then could go weeks where I go low contact with the world.

I don't think it's necessarily rude or due to being a mum, it's just mine and possibly other people's personality. I don't always get joy from exchanging messages back and forth, so I don't prioritise it. During those periods you might see me posting on Instagram, because photography brings me joy.

It's hard to articulate it, but essentially I spend all day with constant demands on my time and attention - work, DH, DS, self care etc, and sometimes I just can't deal with the additional demands on my time and attention from friends/acquaintances so I just switch off from it.

Yanbu

The older I get though the more I find i simply dont make an effort for people who dont make an effort for me.

I had an epiphany that plenty of people manage to update social media, text back the people it suits them to text, contact you when they need/want you, and ignore you much of the time. Those people are not friends.

I would rather have 1 or 2 excellent friends than swathes of useless people who pick me up and drop me as it suits them.

You're very keen to point out that you get it where there's PND, or the mother isn't sleeping, or other stuff is going on. But then you seem to be equally quick to just assume that none of that applies to your friend(s). It's entirely possible that they have PND that they aren't sharing with you (even PND that they aren't yet aware of themselves), or that they aren't sleeping, or that there's "other stuff".

Maybe turn it around and assume that if they aren't getting back to you it's because they do have something like that going on and that (for whatever reason) they don't feel comfortable sharing whatever-it-is with you. Keep in touch with friendly messages while they are sorting their headspace out.

@VaguelyInteresting I assume you have been contacting those friends and apologise for getting NC with them though?

It's hard to understand and ne compasionate when you have no idea what is happening.

Because the reality is that some people ALSO take the piss and use the fact that you want to be compasionate, understanding etc.. to walk all over you.
How do you expect people to be understandig if you dont give them the tools of being understanding? Why should they automatically assume the best intentions on people?

Also I don't buy that it's just "personality". It could be that my personality is to be an offensive bitch but I dont behave like that to the world in general because I've learned that its considered rude/socially unacceptable.

I regard lateness and failure to politely respond to normal/re levels of social contact the same way.

Actually OP I agree with you.

I would not be so judgemental. When I had my first baby I did not talk to anybody but my husband and health visitor for days. It was very tough. Recently a 45 year old we know had a baby and she was sending photos and thank you notes within hours. It really depends. Some people have family and help for certain bits others prefer to do it themselves. Some newborn or babies have issues. Otherwise, who knows may be they are making excuses to not hang out with you. 🤣

Maybe turn it around and assume that if they aren't getting back to you it's because they do have something like that going on and that (for whatever reason) they don't feel comfortable sharing whatever-it-is with you. Keep in touch with friendly messages while they are sorting their headspace out.

@TragicallyUnbeyachted, can I ask how you can decide if someone is genuinely struggling or if they are taking the piss and being rude?

What if you carry on contacting them when actually by taking so long to answer they were trying to give you the message they don't want to hear from you anymore? You know let the friendship died naturally. What if they are just taking you for a ride (Plenty of examples of long term friendship that go that way on MN)?

So how will you know?

@Regularsizedrudy

Nobody owes you their time

That’s a strange thing to say.

If friend can’t find 2 mins in 2 weeks to text back to OP but has time to post meet-up photos on social media, as she doesn’t owe OP her time, Op doesn’t owe her time or friendship.

OP your friend has sort of moved on with new mum friends, you need to focus on other friendships.

I still go through phases where I just don't have the mental or emotional capacity to respond to messages

I find that people manage to dredge up their reserves of mental and emotional capacity to respond to messages when they want or need something from me. Funny that.

@fournonblondes but this friend is not like you only talking to husband and health visitor, she is meeting meet-up friends, posting their photos on social media.

Op, don't take it personally. I also had my second in lockdown. He didn't sleep and it was brutal. The potential response times to a message with either 0.5 seconds or several weeks when I remembered I hadn't replied.

Please don't just reply with "maybe they're not that in to you" because as somebody that has been isolated themselves for a long time, that's really unkind.

So what responses are you expecting then? You’ve been told that people find it hard and you’ve denied that because you still managed. You’ve been told your way and their way are equally valid and you disagree. The only thing left is that the friendships aren’t as strong as you seem to think they are. It isn’t unkind to point out that these things happen and perhaps focussing on it isn’t a good idea.

To be honest, if a “friend” of mine was the type to be posting this kind of post about me, I wouldn’t be too keen to keep in touch either.

You put a lot of caveats in your post (PND, baby not sleeping, etc) which basically could apply to any one of your friends without you realising.
Yes, this. You mention four months as though that’s the cut-off point for being given some slack, but lots of babies start sleeping worse at that point! DD slept so awfully til 18m I’d do things like put shoes in the fridge or put 3 pairs of contact lenses in; I didn’t have the capability to send jaunty “bit busy here let’s catch up soon” social lubrication messages.

Mothers could be dealing with:

• Extreme sleep deprivation
• PND
• Birth injuries
• The massive, massive shock that is having a baby – it doesn’t wear off for a long time
• Lack of practical support – four months is also when the novelty wears off and people think you’re coping, when actually you’ve eaten all the batch cooking, there’s no cake or visitors, and the baby still doesn’t sleep
• Teething, then weaning, then crawling, then the next thing, then the next…

Personally when I’m tired and busy, social lubrication stuff like “let’s meet up when we’re less busy” texts, that keep relationships ticking over, feel like a huge mountain to climb, when staring into space/doomscrolling/sleeping/not speaking to another human is much more restorative.

I'm with you a little bit on this with a particular friend. She is constantly on insta stories doing this that and the other, stories all day as she is a "mum account" but doesn't even read my texts for days then takes weeks to reply. I've just left it now as it hurts seeing her make time for everything else except me. When she does message it's all "oh can't believe how long it's been makes me so sad" then when I say Im free on x y and z day, no response.

I'm sorry you are feeling left out and ignored op.

It sounds like your friends are very wrapped up in the whirlwind of new babies and the little time they do find to socialise, they are spending it with new Mum friends.

It will pass. I know I felt my whole life had suddenly changed beyond recognition, and I worried friends who already had a baby, would maybe look at me and think I was doing it all wrong.

I found it easier to make a couple of superficial friendships but in truth, I didn't feel the need for company at all.

I'm sure it's not you and you are a lovely friend.

I find that people manage to dredge up their reserves of mental and emotional capacity to respond to messages when they want or need something from me. Funny that.

And when you’re unwell but need to go to the shop because you are out of milk, you manage that too, don’t you? It’s the same thing. Only a shit friend would see another friend in turmoil reaching out to them for help as suspicious in some way.

Yabu. I can't speak for everyone but we had our son in lockdown last year. No family nearby, zero help, a colicky baby for 4 months. Dh working full time, me finishing my master and doing my dissertation. We are constantly exhausted. I open my phone and I have 11 messages in 6 chats. I love my friends so much but sometimes I just can't find the time to sit and reply, let alone everyday. I'm already struggling to keep on top of daily life, my mental health is struggling cause I haven't seen my family in so long and texting all the time is just draining.

Luckily I have understanding friends who know I'm not usually like this and give me some patience. You don't sound very kind or understanding in your op.

I mean I’m only really telling people now about my (strongly suspected - I was in no state to consult a medial professional because they might have stopped me from ending my life) PND, and DS is about to turn 6. Nobody knew how bad it was for me - nobody. So you can never really be sure what someone is going through.

I think there are two things at play here. Firstly, you have presumably had your second baby during lockdown? As you'll know, second babies are a much smaller adjustment than the first. So if a lot of these mums have their first kids this might explain it to an extent.

Secondly, the behaviour you describe is pretty normal among my friends. Could it be that you rely a lot on these friendships for emotional support and that the lack of quick responses is bringing down your mood and shaking your confidence a bit? With everyone's mental health in tatters after a really tough couple of years, to be honest this would be a pretty reasonable response. Focus on the friends who can support you and accept that others find it hard to reply quickly these days but that it doesn't mean they value you any less.

I agree with you, OP. I found that the people who were the more organized friends stayed that way after they’d had babies and those who were less organized remained so too. Once you have children, you have even less time for those who don’t make time for you though and your social circle shrinks. Friends who at one point would have been thought of as quirky for being late or whatever fell by the wayside as I only had so much time to give in return. Hence I surround myself with much more like-minded people than I did before. I imagine most people do this in general. The problems come when there’s a mismatch in expectations.

You're not a priority for this person.