Wanting to tell 44 weeks and breech friend she's risking her baby?

[scottishlass43]

My friend is 44 weeks pregnant with a footling breech. She's determined to have a natural birth at home with another friend of ours who's a midwife. She's been declining all intervention till now and has no cut off point - she wants to let the baby come naturally and doesn't want scans or any monitoring. She refuses to consider a c-section.

She's older (late thirties) and has been waiting for several years for this baby. I have no idea why she'd risk it now.

AIBU wanting to tell her what I think? Am I (and other worried friends) overreacting? Does anyone know of anyone who's done this, and how it went?

you can decline induction but you aren’t given any choice about monitoring to check baby is okay,

Of course you are given a choice!

Goodness.

I wanted a VBB but in hospital with a team of specialist breech MW, a frank breech baby, previous uncomplicated birth. At just over 40 weeks I had an ELCS as he didn’t turn up of his own accord. So I can understand the want for a VBB but absolutely not a footling breech and absolutely not at 44 wks!

How will you approach it? ‘I’m really worried about you’ rather than ‘are you mad!?’ might work better (despite the latter being my thoughts and probably yours!!).

Fucking hell 1 went 40+3 and I thought I'd have to light a fire and smoke ds out of there! A month late is mental and not safe imo.

I’m sure the hospital and her own midwife have been heavily counselling her regarding the risks. If she’s in the UK then her being able to contract her midwifery friend as an independent midwife for Labour and birth is vanishingly small due to indemnity insurance issues. So is her friend just acting as a friend/doula and her care remains under the NHS, or is she planning to act outside her scope of practice and attempt to deliver this baby?

Ultimately though, this is this woman’s choice. She can do what she likes. It’s sad that her baby is taking virtually all of the risk though.

Bloody hell she is being terrifyingly irresponsible. Did I understand right that this is her first baby? If so then that's another reason why a home birth isn't great idea because she has no idea how her body will cope with labour and birth.

By now, especially in an older mother, the placenta will be sub-par. I had my youngest due just after my 40th birthday and my consultant offered me an induction from 39 weeks to maximise the chance of a good outcome. (Luckily baby arrived healthy at 37 weeks.)

Breech, again much raised risk.

That's before you consider the risks in the context of a home birth where there will be delays if surgical intervention is needed.

I would say something, I couldn't not. It doesn't sound like she will want to know though.

I do know someone who delivered a healthy baby at 44 weeks. it does happen. Doctors cannot force an induction, they can only strongly advise. That one wasn't breech or a home birth though.

You could send her this article, but it's a nuclear option and your friendship might not survive. It's a horrible read, but might jolt her into action.

It's very hard when you get a fixed idea of what birth should be like and how the body knows what it's doing etc, but she is putting her baby at real risk now.

www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/she-wanted-freebirth-no-doctors-online-groups-convinced-her-it-n1140096

If your mutual friend who's a midwife is still practicing then she won't be for much longer if she is involved in this lunacy.

The placenta is not designed to just keep going indefinitely, I can't believe some people are so gung ho about risking their unborn child's life.

Would she even listen to you?

Do you know the midwife and know she is advising her, if this is th only medical advice she has? Could she simply be terrified of being told something is wrong already so refusing intervention?

Midwives also can't refuse care. We are legally obliged to attend home births even if they're against medical advice, regardless of how traumatic the situation may end up for us as well.

@littlemissalwaystired

I understand why it's got to be that way but can I just say that it's really awful that midwives are expected just to walk into what they know could be an awful situation, deliver a dead baby or one that dies in their arms when the mother has been given advice and chosen to ignore it. How would you not be absolutely furious.

I went to 43 weeks twice, my Grandmother went to 44 weeks and my mother went to 42 weeks with twins. All perfectly healthy. It always strikes me that 36 weeks is considered normal but once you get to 41 weeks there is an enormous amount of pressure placed on pregnant women. I think the stress of this doesn’t help women to give birth spontaneously.

Although, in this case I would be concerned about the baby’s position, Ultimately it’s up to the mother.

Wow what a selfish woman.
Putting her own wants before having a safe birth.

I suspect she's wrong about the dates, probably by one menstrual period. Assuming she's under the care of an NHS team they will be monitoring her closely and press for intervention if needed - I don't believe a midwife would accept the risks of delivering a child at home in the situation you describe.

She sounds insane. What a huge risk she's taking. Am amazed she found a midwife to help her.

All I can think of is safeguarding - they can sometimes intervene if they consider a woman isn't making the best choices for her baby.

@DropYourSword

A footling breech at 44 weeks gestation!! Jesus. This is a recipe for disaster. I’ll never understand why people place more importance on their planned birth experience that the health and LIFE of their child.

If the dates are right this in spades.

My sibling was natural breech (my mother was advised against a c section as it was a teaching hospital and had about 15 doctors watch her birth!!!!)
They had a dislocated leg, tortocollis and was frankly lucky not to have cerebral palsy.

I would be speaking to the midwife friend very seriously.

Oh my goodness.

Selfish, irresponsible woman. That poor baby. I don’t think I could continue to be friends with someone like this. It’s inexcusable.

This is terrifying.

I would certainly have a conversation with her about it and ensure that she was aware of the risks. But ultimately, it’s her body and her choice, however much you disagree with her decisions.

I’m sorry, what?!

Is she still feeling movements??

All the good intentions in the world wont stop the placenta dieing very soon.

I would not want to invite birth injures onto a child especially in the days of extreme cuts to childrens services. But it's her choice. She must know she is putting her birth choice before the health if the baby so on that fact alone she wont listen now I'd bet

I’m not sure that her midwife friend is that much of a friend, if she is seriously going along with this plan

This is insane. I had a real battle with the hospital as I knew exactly the date I conceived but they insist on going by the date of your last period. I was eventually booked in to be induced at what they figured to be 41 weeks but was actually 43. Ended in emergency c-section as she was too big to even engage into my pelvis even after 24 hours of labour.

Babies are just packing on pounds in the last few weeks. My daughter was 11 pounds but had I been induced a couple of weeks earlier, she would have been smaller and I would have been more likely to have a natural (and less traumatic) birth.

I hope she gets the birth she wants but suspect she may not.

Is this for real? I mean, it does sound like something made up. Every single high-risk box ticked.
If this is real, yes, I would talk to her about this and risk losing the friendship.

I'd say something but definitely NOT using the gentle approach. Direct is best.