Labour are shite. Discuss

[Effibreast]

Stock answer to defend the tories is 'Labour are shite, Keir Starmer is rubbish, there's no opposition'.

“If anyone bothered to do research, they'd see that the party was attempting to change”

I’m not going to vote on a ‘maybe’. Maybe they are trying to change. Maybe they’ll be different. Maybe they’ll not be a bunch of misogynists. Maybe they’ll get done financial ability. Maybe they’ll recognise basic reality.

Do or not do. There is no ‘try‘.

Labour don't believe women should have any rights that don't include men. David Lammy said women are dinosaurs hoarding rights
Labour look down on the working classes and ignore issues that impact them. They are a middle class student party. I do think KS wouldn't be bad with the right people behind him but the party has been hijacked by student protesters
I can see why people are afraid of the left although I never thought I'd say that. They almost allowed PIE in and now they want to close down debate and are authoritarian

Guess you are all voting tory then ? So when we won't be able to protest about anything in view of new legislation going through parliament currently you'll be happy to put your names to that ? Labour aren't in power at the moment, no manifesto policies about self ID, but the tories are actively dismantling democracy and that's ok ?

I despise the Tories

Unfortunately I don't think with the current shit show of a government will be enough to bring in Labour next term.

Labour have forgotten their working class roots, they seem to detest the very people they're suppose to appeal to.

We're fucked.

@RepentBirthingPersonFucker who's laughing at the working classes now ? Who shut down whole industries, left the north to rot ? Where's the evidence that LP looks down on the wc and equally what have the tories done to level up ?

I agree with everything else but theresa may was neither decent nor honest. She was responsible for the hostile environment for starters. She drew these crazy red lines and came up with the brexit means brexit nonsense in spite of being a remainer purely to retain power. She's got no morals or integrity. I do feel sorry for how she was treated by the media and her own party but she is not a good person.

Nor was John Major - he didn't get the top job without stabbing a few people in the back on his way up.

Also (keep in mind this was 1987 before winter fuel allowance, and when pensions were much lower)

So-called “exceptional severe weather” benefits jumped to £12m last year, compared with £1.7m in 1985, after widespread disquiet about hardship suffered by the old. Ministers relaxed controls to allow social security staff more discretion in giving help.

But under a new scheme devised by John Major, the social security minister, these payments are being cut to virtually nothing this year for the elderly, and abolished altogether for younger people on supplementary benefit, who make up half the number who used to qualify.

briandeer.com/social/john-major.htm

What a lovely man - letting pensioners freeze

Evidence re w/c being despised by labour ? Just a cliched trope. That's the problem. Every thread ends up being the same old stuff.

What legislation are you referring to re: powers of protest?

Who shut down whole industries, left the north to rot ?

I'm confused with this, your thread started out as a criticism of the current tory government but if you want to talk about mining, steel works etc you need to go back much further than the current gvt. For example Labour under Wilson closed more mines than thatcher.

Just because someone doesn't want to vote Labour doesn't mean they have to vote Tory. I'm a previous Labour voter, but I'll now have nothing to do with their woke misogyny. And they despise the working class and the WC know this hence the stalemate.

Until Labour realises who their core voter base is and learns to listen to and respect their views they'll get nowhere.

I'd vote for a pig if it was wearing a red rosette. But lately I've reluctantly started to conclude that my main reason for doing so is because the Tories are shite.

@Effibreast

Evidence re w/c being despised by labour ? Just a cliched trope. That's the problem. Every thread ends up being the same old stuff.

OP, what’s your response to the many posts saying Labour despise women and Lisa Nandy was unable to say what a woman is when asked during the Labour leadership contest.

That’s 51% of the population Labour doesn’t give a shit about.

And I’m not voting Labour despite doing so all my life but neither am I voting Tory. I will probably spoil my ballot.

UsernameInTheTown
Until Labour re learn what constitutes a woman they can fuck off. As can your 'discuss'.
Yep.

^^ here here

To counter the bs that labour are crap I suggested that Lisa Nandy as minister for levelling up is far superior to Gove.

I'm assuming you've not spent any time with Lisa Nandy? Gove has no clue about working people's lives but he's competent; from direct experience Nandy is only capable of paroting what she thinks is most popular.

That Starmer may be dull and sensible but is as honest and decent as Theresa May of John Major.

TM was arguably the worst PM this country has ever seen, you aren't really selling him.

I can't see me ever voting Tory and I certainly wouldn't defend the current cabinet but 'Labour- not as shit as you think' is not a slogan to win elections.

Id vote for a pig if it was wearing a red rosette.

It's much like that where I live. As a consequence Labour neglect the city and engage in some very questionable behaviour because they know they will remain in power regardless, and the tories neglect the city because there is nothing to play for.

@DrDinosaur

If they’re stupid enough to believe men can become women they’re too stupid to be trusted with running the country.

Yep. Also no idea what they stand for these days really, doesn't seem to be the working class, but also not for the vulnerable or the rich. Seem to slip into the background. Of course more integrity and no doubt would be better than the shitshow we have, but they need to remember what they're about.

@SexyNeckbeard you don't know ? Look it up.
@Forion woke misogyny ? Bit of an oxymoron. If you are using the term woke pejoratively doubt you ever voted labour.
@PronounssheRa 80% of pit jobs lost under thatcher. Communities left to rot without doubt.

Thangam Debbonaire. What a fantastic name.

Labour are shite. That's pretty much the end of discussion right there, but there are lots of reasons why.

1. They can't elect an electable leader. Either they don't have any electable leaders or their voters are idiots.
2. They're massive hypocrites. For everything the Tories do wrong, there is something on the Labour side that is just as bad. Tories have second jobs, people elected as Labour MPs have to be expelled for being convicted of harassment. The fact they expel MPs doesn't wipe the slate clean - their selection procedure must be appalling for them to have been elected in the first place.
3. Tony Blair did more damage to the country than any PM before or since. It's hard to forget shit like that.
4. Leadership again. Sir Kier Starmer does not come across well AT ALL. Labour is supposed to be for ordinary people, not knights of the realm or hotshot lawyers.
5. Jess Phillips, Dianne Abbott - the Labour MPs you recognize come across as deeply unpleasant people. The deputy leader repeatedly calls her opponents scum. They don't seem like reasonable people. At least the Tories are polite to you and just shaft you behind your back. Labour look like they want to kick the shit out of you.
6. Iraq war.
7. Antisemitism.
8. Labour scrapped student loans and introduced tuition fees.
9. What are their actual policies? I mean, Corbyn was hard left, but what does Starmer actually propose to do? He is always wise after the event but never puts forward constructive, workable plans. You might say "they're opposition innit" but if they want to be elected they simply have to demonstrate how they would run the country better - how can we have all the services we need properly funded without tax hikes or borrowing.
10. The constant focus on distractions and irrelevancies. Barnard Castle, lockdown party, who paid for redecorating - none of these things matter in the grand scheme of things. Constantly harping on about them just shows that Labour are unable to pick valid faults in the things that really matter.
11. Today at PMQs Starmer was trying to imply that the Tories laugh at Covid patients dying. Either he's deliberately being rather sick and twisted, or he is so incompetent he doesn't realise how bad he looked.

To those who ask why "Labour are shite" is an acceptable answer to "how do you still support the Tories" there are two key points. One, you don't have to support the Tories to think they are the best of a terrible bunch. If the Tories are like someone shitting on your doorstep, Labour are like someone with diarrhoea doing it. I don't want either but ones easier to deal with. Two, it makes zero sense to argue people should vote Labour because the Tories are awful when not accepting that Tories persist in voting Tory because Labour are terrible.

Did you know there are more than 2 political parties?

‘Discuss’

🖕🏻

@Effibreast you've not heard that Labour believe in men turning into women and demanding lesbians have sex with them?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4360464-Labours-batshit-opinions-on-womens-rights

Things Labour MPs have said around the issue of womens rights in just the last few months. They don't need a manifesto for us to understand where their priorities are.

@PronounssheRa

Id vote for a pig if it was wearing a red rosette.

It's much like that where I live. As a consequence Labour neglect the city and engage in some very questionable behaviour because they know they will remain in power regardless, and the tories neglect the city because there is nothing to play for.

Which is a function of our shit electoral system

Oh and @Effibreast I come from Newcastle, I'm in my 50s. I absorbed socialism along with my baby food and Labour aren't the party I recognise any longer. They are indeed a shower o' shite.