To think people really need to stop letting strangers live with their children

[PuttingOnTheKitsch]

Yet another child was murdered at the hands of a parent's "partner". There have been many, many cases of this happening, Daniel Pelka, Peter Connelley, Kyra Ishaq, the list is endless.

Yet, there will still be women on here, letting some random man move in with them and their child within six weeks and saying "Am I not allowed to have a life!?" if anyone points out that's a bad idea.

Men are just as bad, the step-parent's board was full of blokes who would dump their children on whichever woman they were seeing, while they carried on with their lives and the step mum would come on here and seethe at the poor behaviour of the children instead of understanding how distressing it must be for a young child to have a dad who foists you off on anyone.

Nobody died from not having a live-in partner.

If we truly want things to change, rather than shaking our fists at social workers, we need to look at ourselves as a wider society and stop expecting different results from the same poor behaviour.

Who said that all men are abusers

No one

But the fact is that some )too many) people are so desperate for a relationship that they will put their desire for one above the best interests for their child/children

I would have loved another child but life isn’t always about getting everything you want

@Skyll

Same here. Mine were almost grown thankfully but I didn't break my vows he did - and it was the same for my now dp , his ex left him

If you look at the background of these cases the blended family dynamic, as well as a chaotic social background is key. Baby P's mother was from such a background. Tustin also. A partner who is jealous or controlling. The child wants its parent, but the partner does not want that and the child is "bad".

A lot of the arguments for blending a family are self serving to the adults involved.

I understand where you are coming from OP. My cousin, who I love, has two children from two different partners. Her youngest child’s father left and she had a new boyfriend within a few months, moved in with them almost immediately. Bear in mind that she was engaged to the ex, yes he was a prat but it terrifies me that she has moved her new boyfriend in so quickly. Her eldest child has had to experience 4 different father figures in her life and they are only 8. It’s like her kids are expected to just get with the program because she can’t just be single, but I’m so scared of the kids being hurt. This new guy could be really, really nice - but would I want to take that risk with my children? No.

I don't think we should take the view that everyone is a danger - there are a very small minority who are a danger. The majority of women don't move in partners they have aren't sure of - what needs to happen is support for families and those who are vunerable, improved strategies to identify warning signs. I think its too simplistic to say that no-one should bring a new partner into the home.

@Clymene
The Cinderella effect is an old theory and it seems that not everyone agrees. This makes sense, in part because I suspect that the people who got divorced in the 1980 are not the same than now.

Have a look here
theconversation.com/the-cinderella-effect-are-stepfathers-dangerous-103707
More recent research is showing that actually there is no difference between a father and a step father.

I agree with @LexMitior.
Instead of demonising women who have a new partner, we need to support vulnerable women.
We also need to give financial support (finances can be a real reason why people move in together, esp when the woman is now working a MW part time hours to fit in with schools etc…). We need better childcare etc etc….
Now THAT would be helpful.
Maiming those women somehow responsible is not.

Yanbu. To those who say "more" birth parents are abuse than step parents. It isn't about numbers, I.e quantity. Statistics can be done in a way to explore the overrepresented variable in the minority sample, e.g.step parenting (counting both short and long term relationships) . Here statistically, yes, stepparenting group do tend to abuse their step children more than people who abuse their biological children. But obviously there are also wonderful stepparents and the outcome also depends on environmental and correlated stress factors, poverty, age, employment... Best not to risk.

@Wizzbangfizz yes reading the stepparenting board here is a real eye opener. I'd recommend it to anyone considering bringing a third party into their lives. Very often the advice sought and given is not to love the sc, and distance themselves. That it is unnatural to feel love for another's child. I read posts saying "my sc makes my skin crawl, is that normal?" to which many said such feelings could be normal. Others ask "I don't want my sc to inherit from their parent, what can I do?". "I don't put my sc's photos in our family album cos they mean nothing to me, isn't that OK?" Another recent gem "my sd eats too much, even though she is told to eat only what's on her shelf in the fridge, she says she's hungry". I mean, and people see nothing wrong with these statements and cheer each other on, sorry "support each other" ... and it would or at least should ring alarm bells to most people.

If dh did a runner god forbid, I would at this stage wait for as long as it takes to meet someone, see how it goes, slowly merge lives watch how they are with dc do dc lol them etc.
However I do understand the pressures when you are trying to manage small, incredibly demanding dc.. No money.

Both this case and the other one which will be concluded next week show new partners on the scene very quickly, very volatile, immediately in with disipling the dc , giving advice.
The parent had no source of income, reliant on family, fell out with family due to the partner and the child ended up dead.

Humprey really?? That's extraordinary!!

That step parents board is really nasty on here, it makes me so glad my kids will never have one (absent fathers) the one I saw the other day was a woman who hated her step children visiting said she looks forward to them leaving and hopes they have to cancel so they don’t have to come, the thought of sending my child somewhere where they aren’t wanted makes me feel really sad , so many posters were telling her it’s normal and they feel the same

I have read that article, thank you. I'm not entirely sure its conclusions are as cut and dried as that article implies. Can you link to the more recent research you cite please @LostForIdeas?

Previous research has found stepfathers are many many times more likely to sexually abuse children. A statistic which isn't surprising when we know that predators often seek out single mothers to groom.

I also note the many many threads on here where a stepfather is treating his stepchild very poorly - shouting at them, neglecting or ignoring them or just making very sure they know they are in the home under sufferance.

There is a huge amount of societal and financial pressure for single mothers to hook up with new men, particularly when their previous partners have left them for other women. Many of them move new man in very quickly.

[quote HumpreyDowny]@Wizzbangfizz yes reading the stepparenting board here is a real eye opener. I'd recommend it to anyone considering bringing a third party into their lives. Very often the advice sought and given is not to love the sc, and distance themselves. That it is unnatural to feel love for another's child. I read posts saying "my sc makes my skin crawl, is that normal?" to which many said such feelings could be normal. Others ask "I don't want my sc to inherit from their parent, what can I do?". "I don't put my sc's photos in our family album cos they mean nothing to me, isn't that OK?" Another recent gem "my sd eats too much, even though she is told to eat only what's on her shelf in the fridge, she says she's hungry". I mean, and people see nothing wrong with these statements and cheer each other on, sorry "support each other" ... and it would or at least should ring alarm bells to most people.[/quote]
Years ago I was on here and the SP board had a small cohort who were just poisonous. They would refer to seven year old lgirls as “mini wives” and declare they’d been spousified by their fathers. Usually the behaviour of these youngsters was perfectly normal for a child whose parents had split and who were clinging to their Fathers. It would be suggested on pretty much every thread. Thankfully it’s not as bad as that now.

@ElfontheShelfisLookingatYou

Here's the skin crawling one: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4300410-I-cant-STAND-my-DSC?postsby=DappledApple&fromid=109236867

The inheritance one got deleted but will try to find the others especially the one regarding food was amazing.

[quote LostForIdeas]@Skyll you did though.
You did the day when you decided to have a child with the father of your dc…..

Or are you saying that a man who is a father is different from a man who is a partner, with one type of man automatically not as much of a risk for the child than the other??
Or is that you’ve come to the conclusion that all men are bad and potentially dangerous so you don’t want them anywhere near you?

Unless you are deciding to have a child in your own with no father involved at all, then there will always be a man involved in your child life.[/quote]
Another man. I phrased that badly.

I decided after I split not to involve another man in my children’s life as a potential step father.

They’re grown up now and I’m glad I made the decision I did.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4390339-Can-it-ever-work-if-you-dont-like-you-SC

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4244795-I-know-its-wrong-but-will-these-feelings-go

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4283572-Why-does-everything-feel-better-when-they-arent-here?postsby=MochaChocc&fromid=108635323

Instead of demonising women who have a new partner, we need to support vulnerable women.
We also need to give financial support (finances can be a real reason why people move in together, esp when the woman is now working a MW part time hours to fit in with schools etc…). We need better childcare etc etc

Agree with all this. Subsidised childcare would go a long way to help with this. Better and more efficient financial support for women who lose their main source of income.

I also think we need to reframe the massive social pressure we put on women to be in relationships as a priority above almost everything else.

Women are told more or less from childhood that they are not "whole" if they don't have a man in their lives and that a family with one parent is suboptimal. It's hardly surprising that when their marriages break down many women desperately try to seek a replacement.

It would really help if single parenting were presented in a more positive light. To be honest for many children a household headed by a strong, capable single mother is the best possible outcome for them outside of the traditional nuclear family. If we were able to see this in a more positive light you'd hope fewer women would desperately rush the first bloke they meet post marriage breakdown over the threshold.

Those threads are vile, and a very good demonstration why some step parents have their own issues. Unhappily they visit them on children, because its the child's fault. You can see just how self serving and nasty it is.

The education needs to start in school. The PHSE classes (or whatever they are called these days) need to do a lot more to empower young women to value themselves more. To get away from this desperate need to breed with the first loser that shows them affection (sex) .
.. and the very mistaken belief that 'if I have his baby he will love me' .. (he won't of course and she will simply move on to the next unsuitable waster - this time with a kid in tow) .. I work in this field . It's relentlessly depressing . Some kids have had 5 or 6 'step dads' before they e got to school..

I don't disagree with the earlier poster who mentioned marriage got accused of being judgemental . I do t think it's the moral side of marriage that's important. It's about what marriage symbolises. The time it takes to get to that point. The commitment that both make to each other . It's also a legal contract. Giving each parent a degree of legal protection.
It represents thought , consideration and forethought. Not the indiscriminate coupling that brings yet another poor unplanned child into the world to be raised by inadequate and uninterested parents ..

[quote HumpreyDowny]www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4390339-Can-it-ever-work-if-you-dont-like-you-SC

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4244795-I-know-its-wrong-but-will-these-feelings-go

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/4283572-Why-does-everything-feel-better-when-they-arent-here?postsby=MochaChocc&fromid=108635323[/quote]
I waded through the first one. Yet another case of the father foisting all childcare onto the stepmother, then having yet another child while the stepmother is meant to feel grateful for him doing no childcare because he's "supporting the family", when really he's using the stepmother as free childcare and to increase his contact time and reduce maintenance. What a prince!

Also in that thread is a stepmother boasting that they've disliked their stepdaughter for years but it's all been worth it as she's at uni now and they have many years of happy marriage ahead. It's an old thread, so I won't break it to her that children tend to stay in their parents' lives forever, especially once they themselves have children. Again, I wonder about the dad in this situation. I can't imaging loving something who disliked my children.

I remember a woman at work who used to openly and loudly begrudge every penny her husband spent on his first family. I just can't imagine being married to someone who resented me spending money on my children, but plenty of men have no issue with that. Grim.

No wonder there are so many unhappy children out there. Adults will delude themselves by saying "They're happy if I'm happy" as if children don't just go along with things knowing they are far down the priority list and powerless to do much else.

@malificent7

Yes and no. I moved in with my fiance last year ( not dds dad) after 5 years together but he is the kindest, gentlest man ever. If he wasnt he would not be around dd.

If you've known him for five years, then he isn't a stranger by any stretch of the imagination. It's strangers which this thread is concerned about.

@OhRexy

There are ways of starting new relationships more safely but it's very hard to do that as a single parent unless there is another parent having regular contact or you have family and friends to offer babysitting.

What does a single parent do when they have their children with them all the time.
I know most will say don't have a relationship then but that would be considered a lonely life for most people.

I think the answer is spending a long time getting to know someone before anything starts but that often doesn't happen.

At the very least parents should be doing Claire's and Sarah's Law disclosures on any potential new partner. No-one would be getting near my home or meeting my children without this.

How someone talks about their past relationships is a huge clue.
If anyone trots out the lines about the ex being nuts/toxic etc then that's a red flag. It might be true but I'm never taking that chance. And even if they were, what caused this?

Do they have secure housing and a job? People get used all the time for a warm bed and financial support. I won't end up in a situation where I'm solving a housing issue. Even a few days turns into not being able to get them out again.

Do they have kids themselves? If so, how often do they see them. Are they paying maintenance? What's the relationship like with the ex?

It's a really tough call and I won't be vilifying parents for trying to have a life too but a lot of thought and care is needed.

These are brilliant points. I'm relieved to see the posts here. I feel I've clearly got a history of poor judgement in terms of partners. My dc are as secure now as I can make them and why would I jeopardise that by bringing someone new to the table. Actually it's a relief to see that some people have just made this decision and got on with life. There's still a societal fantasy that a knight in shining armour will arrive.

Better and more efficient financial support for women who lose their main source of income.

I agree with a lot that you posted but what do you mean by this? Mothers losing their employment? Or women breaking up with men who provided for them financially? If the latter, then absolutely, a key mitigation has to be educating women not to have their "main source of income" being a man providing it for them.

@BertramLacey

You can't just put yourself first and have another partner and another baby.

Last time I checked, our own PM had six children by three different women. The problem starts right at the top.

If he becomes a yardstick for decent parenting then all children are doomed. He won't even acknowledge publicly how many of them he has.

Divorce / broken families can be an awful thing. I come from a place where most of my friends’ parents are still married. When I moved to NY & lived with loads of different girls from various countries, they were shocked that my parents were still together. Most of them had difficult home-lives...
However, I do know divorce happens. And for good reason, in many cases. But afterwards... My cousins were not only f’d up by their own bad dad, but the guy my aunt shacked up with next. Her kids & his, totally f’d up. Very sad.