Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Am I over reacting or is this kid out of line calling my DD trans?

187 replies

Overreactingmom · 02/12/2021 13:14

DD is 10. Overall she is a lovely kid who gets on well at school but of course she is in year 6 so fall outs are inevitable at this age but had no serious issues, she is happy to go to school and she has no additional needs etc just so as not to drip feed.

There is a boy at school who is very popular in the year group, he is confident, sporty and from a huge family.

He has been making comments about my daughters hair for months now, calling her ginger etc and just generally making fun, always appearance related. We hadn’t really acted as she seemed to be holding her own and telling him to mind his own etc.

Last week she went into school wearing trousers rather than a skirt, cue this kid (and others) commenting that she looks like a boy, why is she wearing trousers, you look like ‘X child’ (who is on the spectrum and has always been the only girl to wear trousers in their year group which is fine ofc but they’re using this child as an insult!) and laughing about it generally. Spoke to school, she was pretty upset and teacher was fab, thought it was sorted.

Yesterday the same boy said to her (about her new school shoes) ‘why are you wearing them, you look like a boy! Are you trans?’ She also admitted he has been saying she’s going to grow up to ‘be a boy’ because of wearing trousers.

Now she’s not particularly upset over the more recent comments. But I am fuming. Aibu?

For the record - I wouldn’t care how she chose to identify as an adult but she is 10 years old and just a happy little ‘tomboy’ who wants to be warm and comfy in this freezing weather!

It’s 2021 ffs not the 50’s why can’t my daughter wear what she feels comfortable in without being picked on? I dread secondary school next year!

OP posts:
VickyEadieofThigh · 02/12/2021 15:43

@LimpLettice

Yet another problem with all this ridiculous misogyny and silly regressive stereotypes all over schools. Bloody Mermaids and Stonewall et al perpetuating all this rubbish, encouraging little kids to get into little boxes and define everything. It's bloody freezing, why aren't they all bundled up in warm trousers?!

Get on the school, OP. Funnily enough, if she was identifying as a boy, they would be on it like Billy oh already. Maybe that's your angle. She's not 'trans' but if she was, this would probably be a hate crime.

This.

I went to primary school in the 60s, a time when until recently I would have stated girls' and boys' clothes, toys and interests were much more stereotyped. I don't recall any girl being called a boy if she had short hair or wore trousers, however.

Now - we live in such a woke world that primary children appear to believe that clothes and hair make you something 'different' and are not just style choices.

This school needs telling and they need to stamp on this NOW. They also need to undo whatever fucking nonsense these kids have been taught about 'trans' issues.

TravellingSpoon · 02/12/2021 15:45

Send a letter to the HT - this is a discriminatory incident and should be logged by the school.

MistandMud · 02/12/2021 15:50

Can I just chip in to ask that people don't campaign for banning skirts and making all children wear trousers? Quite a few girls much prefer skirts for period-related reasons, or because their changing shape makes it bloody difficult to find trousers that fit both their body and the school's latest rules.

Thanks.

nomoneytreehere · 02/12/2021 15:54

Op you know this is wrong. Just go into school and defend your little girl. So what if she is trans. None of his business.

eyeslikebutterflies · 02/12/2021 16:09

@MrsBison 95% of there girls in my DD's school wear trousers. Pretty much 100% of the women in their lives do. Why? Because it's 2021. Literally NO ONE thinks girls "should" wear skirts. This boy is just a bully looking for a weakness to exploit.

So she wears a skirt? He'll switch to finding fault with something else. Maybe the skirt is too long or too short, or she's too fat or too skinny, he's already had a go about her hair colour, maybe today she looks just 'weird' or her bag is wrong.... and all your approach would have taught the little girl is that SHE needs to try and make the bully happy by changing her appearance. What a damaging, damaging thing to teach her.

OP, by using 'trans' as an insult this boy is not just bullying: he is also demonstrating a type of prejudice that's akin to homophobia. As such, the school will have policies in place and should come down on this very hard. It's no longer 'just' bullying (and frankly he needs some help if he can't cope with a girl who wears a skirt, but that's a whole other issue).

akaisnsouaj · 02/12/2021 16:18

"Aye and if she's ever sexually assaulted remind her she should have made her life easier and worn a maxi skirt and a parka.

If she's ever the victim of domestic abuse ensure her it would be easier just to cater to his whim and please him.

If she's ever mugged, buy her a Nokia 3510 so as to not attract thieves with nice things.

Bollocks, educate a son before you chastise a daughter. She can wear what she wants, she can act how she wants, always.

While you're at it OP, buy a box of Garnier Nutrisse and cover that ginger right up! How dare she!"

@Arethechildreninbedyet couldn't have put it better myself!

scottishnames · 02/12/2021 16:26

Mrs Bison

So ignorant . You and the bully child. Historically, women have worn trousers for as long as men - for maybe 3000 years or more.
There's a lot of evidence about this, but here to begin with is a bit of simple introduction:
time.com/4363815/history-women-pants-hillary-clinton/
qz.com/quartzy/1597688/a-brief-history-of-women-in-pants/

contrary13 · 02/12/2021 16:31

When my daughter was in Yr 7 (roughly 14 years ago now, so before GID became more spoken about/aware of), she had short hair - and wore trousers to school. Entirely her choice, most girls in the school community wore trousers, not a problem in or of itself. But yes; my daughter did look like a boy, because of her hair style, which she'd chosen herself for easy management first thing in the morning, and which she'd felt so grown up about having.

Within 3 months of the school year starting, she was being bullied - in school and online through MSN Messenger (remember that?) by two boys in 90% of her classes. She was, apparently, a lesbian (although the word "dyke" was the term these boys used) because only gay women have short hair/wear trousers. The school initially seemed fantastic, promised to deal with it, spoke to my daughter (and made her feel like she was the problem; she's a girl, why was she deliberately making herself a target, and so on). I was in there every other day, my daughter felt as though I were punishing her because I refused to let her use the Internet (although most of the messages were sent during school hours, as I discovered upon hacking into her account), she started to self-harm and genuinely began to question her sexuality. Girls whom she'd previously been best friends with started to refuse to change in the changing rooms if she was in their lesson, she was ostracised basically... and the school kept telling me "we're dealing with it Mrs 13"

After a few weeks of their refusal to deal with the homophobic abuse going on in their school, despite evidence that it was happening on their computers, during those hours they had a duty of care for my daughter... I called the police. Cyber bullying amd homophobic abuse were the recent changes to the law back then, the boys who were instigating it were over the age of 10 (so knew right from wrong as far as the law's concerned), and my daughter's education was being disrupted through absolutely no fault of her own,

The police were fantastic. Sympathetic to my confused daughter, understood my maternal fury, disgusted by the school's imability to understand that crimes were being commited within their walls. Several meetings with the headteachers later, with stern police officers backing me up later, the boys were issued with restraining orders, their (allegedly oblivious) parents had the fear of God put into them because they were informed that I could have their sons arrested and charged with two separate crimes, and my daughter felt confident in remaining at the school - because she knew I would happily go to bat for her.

She grew her hair out, has actual panic attacks every time she feels it needs a trim, and has severe MH problems which may well have been triggered by this period in her life. She's also extremely confident in her sexuality, knows that she's heterosexual... but also that it wouldn't matter one iota if she weren't (my grandmother was a lesbian and set up home with her life-partner of 60 years during the early '50s). I truly dread to think what would have happened if she were 10/11/12 now, with the way in which children are seemingly being pressured to choose their gender identities/sexualities before the majority of them genuinely understand the concept and end up changing their minds seemingly on a whim/depending upon their peer groups.

So, @Overreactingmom, I don't think you're over reacting at all. Your daughter's confidence/self-esteem is what is being whittled away at - which could lead to issues later on in her life. And, frankly, the issue isn't with her at all, but with the boy(s) whose ignorance is clearly showing. Complain to anyone you can, show her that you have her back/love her regardless of her identity or sexuality, and support her.

Flowers
SpudleyLass · 02/12/2021 16:32

How bizarre that wearing trousers is now what makes girls a target.

Your poor DD - but she sounds brilliant at standing up for herself.

I was bullied a lot at school tool - called a boy more times than I care to admit - but funnily enough, it was never because I was wearing trousers. The vast majority of girls in my primary school and secondary school wore trousers, not skirts.

Absolutely do not encourage your daughter to ''take the easy route'' - which it wouldn't be for all sorts of reasons.

CaptSkippy · 02/12/2021 16:35

Wow, are we back here again? In many schools in the 80s girls were forbidden from wearing trousers. They would come to school and change into a skirt or they would get send home.

We seem to be regressing.

crowsfeet57 · 02/12/2021 16:45

Lets switch the scenario slightly. What if the OPs son wore a skirt to school and people took the Mickey? Surely youd agree in this scenario, that the son could just wear trousers to resolve the issue right?

Of course not. The right thing to do is to tell the people 'taking the mickey' that their behaviour is unacceptable. Back in the dark ages I got teased for having ginger hair, perhaps my mother should, have dyed it, although tbh I also got teased about my surname maybe she should have had me adopted!

You never bow down to bullies.

AmyDudley · 02/12/2021 16:46

MrsBison

<strong>Why give people the ammo though?</strong>

<strong>Just encourage your daughter to wear a skirt. Problem solved.</strong>

The OP's DD was also bullied by this boy for having red hair - should she dye her hair as well?

I find it bizarre that a child should find the idea of a girl wearing trousers unusual - I was wearing trousers to school in the 1960s, its hardly a new and radical idea.
I would go back to the school, say that the bullying has escalated, and also mention that he is using the other girl who wears trousers as an insult so is probably bullying her too. He sounds like a nasty child and they need o up the sanctions since obviously the steps they took last time haven't worked. His parents need to be involved. Ask the school to tell you what measures they are taking to sort the problem, and get it in writing so you have a record of what is going on.

scottishnames · 02/12/2021 16:48

CaptSkippy
I agree. I can remember the 80s.
Surely, in a rational world, all we need to say is what we said then: that women should wear what makes them feel comfortable and suitably dressed for their (preferred/agreed to) circumstances.
Any problems about how that might be percieved are the fault of the onlookers NOT of the wearer.
Anything less denies respect and autonomy to the wearer. Would a man put up with that? Yes, there are male fahion victims, but on the whole I doubt it.

BiBabbles · 02/12/2021 16:51

YANBU. Such a rough situation OP. I hope as the school did well before, they can do so again. If there are options, I might consider trying to find out how to make sure she's at a different school for secondary.

Why give people the ammo though?

The OP's daughter has also been teased for being ginger - do you recommend they dye her hair too?

What to do that becomes ammo too? I was bullied bloody for having dyed hair as a kid, but my mother said she coloured it help me make friends so I learned a bunch of fucked up messages.

SapphireSeptember · 02/12/2021 16:52

There's always one... Hmm
Since when were trousers solely a male item of clothing? Women in the west have been wearing them since the late 1800s!
kingandallen.co.uk/journal/2016/a-brief-history-of-trousers/#:~:text=By%20the%201880s%2C%20women%20in,allowed%20greater%20freedom%20of%20movement.
OP and her DD should not give in to this sexist, stereotypical bullshit. What year is it again? Oh yes, 2021. What you wear has no bearing on your sex.

SapphireSeptember · 02/12/2021 16:55

Oh yeah, and for context, primary school I was always in skirts, secondary in trousers, I became an adult and went back to wearing skirts! Now I only wear trousers at work because I have to. In my last job I wore trousers when I was in the cafe, but when that closed and I worked in a different department I switched to skirts.
I was also bullied at school for wearing glasses (couldn't help that) and being a Goth (which I could, but like fuck was I going to give in to the bullies.)

Gumbomambo · 02/12/2021 16:56

Contrary13 bloody hell! What a shite school and what a pair of vile little shits. I’m so sorry for your DD and what she went through. Well done for having her back and a resounding YES from me to this advice. OP show your daughter you will support her no matter what, show her what a strong unapologetic woman looks like. Good luck to you and your DD.

Overreactingmom · 02/12/2021 16:58

Thank you for all of the replies - I’m glad it’s not just me blowing it out of proportion.

I will 100% not be telling her to wear a skirt instead, not only do I agree with PPs that this is the wrong message entirely, it was bloody -1 walking to school this morning

@Happy1982ish I described her as a tomboy not because of the trousers but because this is how she describes herself - she isn’t into things that are typically seen as ‘girly’…

@Fomofo I just meant that maybe he’s a bit more confident and outspoken than my DD coming from a family with lots of siblings (was just trying to give a full picture as possible - he is one of 6, I used to teach his brother and sister and they are actually very lovely children).

We had a chat this morning before school about how calling someone trans shouldn’t be used as an insult and that even though she’s not particularly upset by the comment another child could be deeply hurt by his name calling if they were feeling unsure of them self.

I had emailed school this morning before I posted it but was worrying maybe I was overthinking it all, harder to judge when it’s your own child etc so i’m glad to see others would do the same and contact school right away.

I guess watch this space to see how they’re going to deal with it

OP posts:
Chocolatewheatos · 02/12/2021 17:05

He sounds awful. The school need to take this bullying more seriously and talk to his family about the things he's saying.

TrashyPanda · 02/12/2021 17:09

[quote MrsBison]@SpeckledHen266

I generally dont go out by myself after 8pm tbh.[/quote]
Not all women have that luxury.

I have been mugged and seriously assaulted - the police officer who arrived said “who the hell did that to you?” - I was literally covered in blood down to my knees. The police decided it was quicker to take me hospital in the back of their Police van than to wait for an ambulance.

And I was with my male partner at the time.

Shit happens.

Im old enough to remember the original “reclaim the night” marches. Women working in solidarity with each other to effect change. Not accepting that they should be dictated to by men.

TrashyPanda · 02/12/2021 17:10

Contrary13 - huge hugs to your DD

Happy1982ish · 02/12/2021 17:12

Bullying that’s been going on for months
Dad doesn’t seem especially bothered about recent comments
How come you are acting now and not months ago?

ChiefStockingStuffer · 02/12/2021 17:39

Please formally complain ... in writing with at least two people included in the email (teacher, Head) so it can't be buried. And tell them you want it reported to the LEA as well since it's bullying based on homophobia. That is required to be reported by schools

sheenapunk · 02/12/2021 18:02

The French are about to start jailing school bullies and fining them up to 150k.

Overreactingmom · 02/12/2021 19:11

@Happy1982ish if you read the first post again -

We hadn’t really acted as she seemed to be holding her own and telling him to mind his own etc is what I said in my first post. Of course during this time we also spoke to DD about ways she could handle this.

I then went on to say we contacted school and her teacher was fab and I thought it was sorted. When it began to escalate we did act. We had spoken to school via email and phone calls as contact with staff in person is V limited.

As it has escalated again I have contacted school via email today and will likely have a phone call from her teacher to discuss steps that will be taken going forward.

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread