DH wants MIL to come to us for Christmas

[Macmoominmamma]

Hi all

Your opinions please!

For context - MIL went into nursing home Feb 2020 at age of 84. She's been incredibly independent for past 50 years but now can't cope living on her own. Diagnosed with dementia, which fluctuates. She is urine incontinent, can't go up or down stairs, doesn't walk far, can't work TV or mobile phone, despite being shown many many times. She lives 100 miles away from us and her other DS lives in same village as her.

DH asked me last night if she could come to ours for Christmas, coming 23rd Dec and leaving Boxing Day. We have 2 kids, aged 15 and 9. It is 9 year olds birthday Christmas Eve (will be 10 then). I have pointed out the distance for her to travel, that she is incontinent, has dementia, she can't walk up steps (our WCs are not on ground floor), but DH says he will take her to a hotel and they will stay there overnight and come to our home for feeding, present opening etc.
I honestly don't know how to feel about this - on the one hand, it would be nice to have her, and don't want her to spend Christmas at Nursing Home, but on the other hand I think it's a disaster waiting to happen, and just a bit miserable for the kids to have their dad away from them over Christmas Day and birthday.

DH appears to have thought this through and is pretty set on it.
AIBU to put a spanner in the works by saying no?

YANBU - yes tell him it's a no
YABU - she should come.

1. How will she get to the toilet if she cant manage the stairs - does your husband want to buy a commode for downstairs
2. how severe is her dementia? If it is severe enough she cannot live alone safely, it may be very confusing to move her to a hotel for a few nights and can worsen the symptoms of dementia
3. will she need assistance to go to the toilet and change pads, is you husband doing that if he stays at the hotel with her 4 ) Has she expressed any really strong wishes for this plan?

I would agree with previous posters for you to visit her

She's his mother, he's sorting it and staying with her and she's obviously vulnerable and frail. There's no guarantee she'll have another Christmas. Suck it up. What would you hope your kids do if this is you in 30 or 40 years' time? Or what if she were your mother?

We haven’t had FiL at ours for Christmas for the last two years, he lives alone locally and has dementia. We know that it would be confusing for him, he sleeps most of the day, can’t hear even with his hearing aids and it would be too much. He really didn’t enjoy it 2 years ago. DH and adult kids go over in the morning and take some lunch for him. He can manage a maximum of 20 minutes of being social and then wants peace and quiet. We know it’s potentially his last Christmas( he’s 93) but all the more reason to do what’s best for him.

@Macmoominmamma

Sorry not been clear...

DH and MIL will stay at a hotel together overnight and come to us during day for meals etc. Plan is he would go to pick her up on 23rd and drop her off on 26th.

He says he will put a commode in the study with a poster over the glass so noone can see in. Not ideal. He is prepared to empty commode! She is urine incontinent only - I think she is ok in the poop dept as far as I'm aware.

BIL not interested - retired but visits her rarely, maybe once every 2 months. To be fair he and SIL had MIL last year for Christmas Day (they have no kids) but DH visits MIL every 2 weeks on Saturdays. Impressive as we live 100 miles apart.

Yes I think he thinks it could be her last. It's very sad and an impossible situation I feel. But I don't honestly know if he can cope with meeting her needs.

How would MIL feel about using a commode in a strange environment? If its really likely that she will only live less than another year then I think the trip will be too much for her and not a pleasant experience.

If he can set up a comode in the study is there room for a put up bed too? He is prepared to look after her, so its a shame for her to be left alone. I wouldn't want my mum to be in nursing home away from family over Christmas.

It doesnt really sound a good set up for her

He isnt really thinking about her in all of this is he? Aside from the practicalities. No consideration of emotionally etc.

Your DH seems to live in a lovely la la land where his dear mother can come and stay with you at Christmas. You will all enjoy a fabulous holiday with love and laughter and plenty of delicious food.

In the real world, DM has dementia and is incontinent, can't go up and downstairs, walk very far etc etc.

Why on earth does he think he can manage all of the issues around this visit? Does he expect you to do it?

YANBU I can't believe that your DH is considering this especially considering the distance involved. My dad died in March after battling Alzheimer's for a few years. He was in a home last Christmas and we weren't able to see him due to restrictions and covid cases in the home but I know that my mum would never have suggested him come out for the day. He would have been confused, disorientated by the whole experience and possibly aggressive. It's not a nice thing for them to do. Even the Christmas before when he was still at home with mum he still found it disorientating coming to our house.

My ex's Nan also had dementia and I remember his mum took her out for a BH weekend once and she never did it again because it wasn't a nice experience for anyone.

I also wonder if your DH has an unrealistic expectation of the severity of her dementia given that presumably at the moment you only make occasional visits for short periods.
Another thing he may not have considered and nobody has mentioned yet - does she wander ? Lots of people with dementia do and care homes that offer dementia care usually have extra security to prevent residents from getting out. If your MIL was to wake up in the night she may get out of the hotel room as there won't be anything to prevent her. This may result in her getting outside and her absence not being realised for some time. I work for the police and elderly people with dementia going missing at night is an all too frequent occurrence. Sadly they have ended up in fatalities.

I'd be having a serious char with him about how he feels about cleaning his mother "down there". She is urine incontinent, she will need regular washing and he will have to do it. Does he really want to put him self and his mother in that position? Same for wiping after a poo. Dressing/undressing?

I understand his thinking but being a carer is tough when it is an unrelated adult, dignity is a big issue. Doing it for a parent is much more tough.

He should talk to the home. They will be able to tell him all about his mum's needs and give their opinion on how she is likely to cope.
It may be less stressful for her if you all go spend some time with her at the home instead.

I wouldn’t of thought removing this person from a nursing home is wise for their well-being, COVID mixing and her routein, surely being somewhere familiar is for the best with staff she is used to, removing her will probably confuse her.

Can’t you all visit her just before Christmas and maybe visit again between Christmas and New Year?

Oh OP and DH

He hasn't thought this through, although I understand why. It's very likely a very bad idea to take her out of her familiar space, routine and staff, and add to her confusion and disorientation. The travelling will be disorienting. Your house. A noisy busy hotel at night. A lot of change and confusion. Her dignity in needing washing and changing, which she will especially with the bathroom upstairs and lack of equipment and safe trained handling for her. If she has a fall, becomes ill and needs hospitalising she may then have issues going back to her nursing home place.

He's trying to meet his own needs and grief, my heart goes out to him, but he's doing this for him, not her, and he needs to put her first. Her safety, her feeling safe and oriented and with the confusion minimised, her dignity. He'd do a lot better to go up and stay in a hotel and do several visits to her over a couple of days in her familiar place.

I think this is one of those situations where it's so off the wall and impractical you can support it because it will never happen. I can't imagine the nursing home supporting the plan. I'd be supportive and suggest a meeting with the nursing home to make sure you're ready to meet all her needs, and with the hotel in advance too. There are so many ways it's not going to happen that I think you're safe supporting. And you can ask questions in the meetings that hopefully will bring him around to the idea that it's just not feasible

How bad is her dementia? Could this be confusing and unsettling for her?

My dad had dementia and the most we did was bring him out for a couple of hours on Christmas day, but the nursing home was only a 20 minute drive away. He would come and have dinner with us and then we'd drop him back. Anything more than that is too much, disrupting their routine is not a good idea and can really distress them.

Making his mum travel a long distance and having her stay in a hotel is going to confuse her massively. It's a terrible idea. If she gets distressed (which she will) it won't be possible to just drop her back.

Has your DH actually talked to the nursing staff in the home? I can't imagine they'd recommend this.

I understand that he has good intentions but it has disaster written all over it. Is there any way you could all visit her instead, sometime before or after Christmas? Stay nearby for a few days, maybe bring her out for short periods of time?

It would be better all round for you to rent an air bnb over the festive period nearby so you can visit her on chrimstas day, depending on the quality of the home you may be able to have lunch with her and spend the day.

I wonder how many people who voted YABU have dealt with relatives with dementia

Leaving aside you & DH, this will not be a good idea for her.
She will be in familiar surroundings in the Care Home, & all her needs will be catered for.
Perhaps a family visit to her will be a better idea.

Ultimately it has to be what is best for MIL.

I totally get your dhs feelings and why he wants to do this but he has to take his own emotions out of this and really look at what is best for her.

I think this is a bad idea and could be distressing for your MIL.
If he wants to be with her on Christmas Day then it needs to be at the nursing home imo.
When my FIL had dementia and was in a nursing home, the fact it was Christmas Day passed right by him sadly.

@toomuchlaundry

I wonder how many people who voted YABU have dealt with relatives with dementia

Very few I imagine. It's not as simple as "oh let's all have a lovely family Christmas."

She'll be very distressed I think. Why would he do that to her?

My grandma had dementia. My dad wanted her to come for Christmas. He mentioned his plans to the nursing home and they very politely and kindly urged him to let her stay in the familiar surroundings of the nursing home. They knew it was best for grandma to stick to her regular routine in her regular surroundings.

@Shmithecat2

YAB a bit U. If he thinks it's doable, let him take care of it. He may not have many more Christmases with her. There's plenty ahead for your family.

I'm sorry but this is massively naive.

What about what's best for his mum? She has dementia, she won't have a clue what going on and will be stressed and confused.

I agree they should spent time with her, but go to her. It's not right to make her travel and take her out of her comfort zone.