To hate how being quiet is seen as a problem

[Ireallydontcare55]

People who are very chatty, outgoing etc are usually seen as favourable and something to strive towards, I find. There are people who prefer quieter personalities but I feel like it’s in the minority.

I’m labelled as quiet/shy/reserved by virtually everybody, which is fine in itself but it’s often seen as something to have to improve and almost to cure.

My partner is fairly chatty and good at talking to people. I met an older female colleague of his the other week for literally a minute, and we made some very brief and insignificant small talk.

Apparently she then said to him, “She’s just so much quieter than you, you’re so different.”

I had seen her very briefly in passing, she hadn’t herself said anything of interest yet she apparently knows what I’m like.

I’ve had so many people refer to me behind my back as nervous. I do have a slightly nervous disposition but there’s nothing I can do about it, I try my best.

A male colleague has told me several times at work to ‘not be nervous’ despite me repeatedly telling him that I am not, and that I’m doing fine. Despite it surely coming from a good place, it’s just not helping me at all having it constantly commented on. I would never tell him to just stop being whatever.

I find that I’ve started to not bother trying to meet new people and just shut myself off from those I already know, it just seems easier.

I just feel picked on, constantly commented on and I hate being seen as having something wrong with me, what can I do ?

" If you’re ND and need accommodations you have to tell people. If you don’t want anybody to know then resign yourself to trying to fit in."

The whole point of selective mutism is that it is an inability to initiate communication with certain people and in certain settings. You literally cannot explain. To me a blanket assumption that people generally don't WANT to be rude (assuming you haven't just done something to merit it) is a reasonable policy.

People with SM, especially children, are generally desperate to be able to speak and want to be included. So ignoring them on the basis that they don't "want" to interact isn't very supportive either.

@SusannahHolmes

" If you’re ND and need accommodations you have to tell people. If you don’t want anybody to know then resign yourself to trying to fit in."

The whole point of selective mutism is that it is an inability to initiate communication with certain people and in certain settings. You literally cannot explain. To me a blanket assumption that people generally don't WANT to be rude (assuming you haven't just done something to merit it) is a reasonable policy.

People with SM, especially children, are generally desperate to be able to speak and want to be included. So ignoring them on the basis that they don't "want" to interact isn't very supportive either.

Maybe we’re not talking about the same thing. I attempt to connect with people - if it doesn’t work I stop unless I know more. I don’t assume they’re ‘rude’, I don’t avoid them, I work with them as expected. But I don’t go out of my way to be ‘inclusive’ unless I’m specifically told. As that has sometimes been interpreted as overbearing. There’s a always at risk of doing the wrong thing, or offending someone by relying on assumption. Autism for example two people could have opposing needs. I have had colleagues who categorically do NOT want to be involved in any socialising etc, and colleagues who wanted to but worried about being judged or not being able to contribute. I don’t know much about SM apart from googling but it’s the same. The person with the condition has to know what they need

@user1471554720

Do you ever tell the people who say you are quiet, that it is rude to make personal remarks.

I say to these people that I would never comment on people. I tell them that I find some people loud and annoying but I would not say it. Paddington stare. This cuts off a lot of would be bullies, who are thinking of making a laugh of my quietness

Adding this to my quiet person artillery! Perfect for the MIL.

Quiet people are an easy target for some people to hone in on as they are perceived as less likely to stand up for themselves. Personally I find that an awful lot of people just talk and talk and say nothing of particular interest. Listening is a much better skill!

In one of my DS’s classes he was teased about being quiet by the teacher and by his classmates - I actually feel the teacher’s behaviour green-lighted the same behaviour in his peers. He dreaded going to that class. It had been his favourite and best subject too - but not in that climate!

This sort of thing should not be viewed as acceptable.

I do find introverts hard work though, and I say that as an omnivert, I understand the need for introverts to have their quiet time.

My DH is an introvert and I find he leaves all the jobs that need interaction with other people to me, like picking up a parcel from a neighbour or taking the kids to play dates. I do find introverts can be quite selfish in some ways, but maybe that’s just my experience of them.

I'm like you, OP. I'm an introvert but people have assumed I have social anxiety. I don't. I just like to listen and take in everything that is happening. I will only give my opinion in company if asked.

With close friends I am chatty but not in groups of people I don't know well.

As I say - I tend to go with the flow but if something is really important I’ll pipe up. I may be an introvert but I still end up doing all the ‘task’ stuff (sorry mowglika, I think he may be taking advantage!)

I don't feel I have to be specifically asked. It's just what happens. I'm not an open book and I can't help.

*can't help it.

I hear ya. I've been overlooked countless times for promotion even though I'm top performer within team. Purely because I'm 'quiet' and therefore can't be considered. It's a joke as I can manage people even if I am 'quiet', managing people isn't about being full on and chatty it's about managing people. It's something I'm repeatedly told to work on if I want a promotion.

'True' introverts or extraverts are vanishingly rare - the vast majority of people, as with most things in life, fall within a bell curve.

I can deliver a presentation to 200 people, or enjoy an evening at a party, then spend the next two days sitting at home with a book and a cat without talking to anybody.

Labelling yourself is reductive and self-limiting.

@AffIt

'True' introverts or extraverts are vanishingly rare - the vast majority of people, as with most things in life, fall within a bell curve.

I can deliver a presentation to 200 people, or enjoy an evening at a party, then spend the next two days sitting at home with a book and a cat without talking to anybody.

Labelling yourself is reductive and self-limiting.

Vanishingly rare is an exaggeration. I can think of many people in my life who I would consider definite introverts and who have also taken the Myers Briggs test to prove it. On that test I had 75% introversion

@AffIt

'True' introverts or extraverts are vanishingly rare - the vast majority of people, as with most things in life, fall within a bell curve.

I can deliver a presentation to 200 people, or enjoy an evening at a party, then spend the next two days sitting at home with a book and a cat without talking to anybody.

Labelling yourself is reductive and self-limiting.

This.

This tribalism around "introverts" and "extroverts" (most of whom are being mislabeled anyway) is my current bête noire.

It seems to have become yet another excuse for people with a persecution complex to harp on about how poorly understood they are by society. Lockdown made this far worse as well: everyone seeming to believe they unique "needs".

@DizzySquirrel90

I hear ya. I've been overlooked countless times for promotion even though I'm top performer within team. Purely because I'm 'quiet' and therefore can't be considered. It's a joke as I can manage people even if I am 'quiet', managing people isn't about being full on and chatty it's about managing people. It's something I'm repeatedly told to work on if I want a promotion.

I think managers in particular do need to be always “on” so that employees feel they can approach them and also very open so everyone knows what the vibe is.

A quiet manager that sticks to themselves and only speaks when spoken to would make employees uncomfortable around them I think.

There's actually some interesting research by a professor called Adam Grant on this topic. He has found that introverts and extroverts can both succeed in leadership positions, but introverts do particularly well - better than extroverts - with a highly motivated team with ideas of their own that need to be listened to and nurtured.

www.businessinsider.com/wharton-professor-organizational-psychologist-adam-grant-what-leaders-get-wrong-with-promotions-exit-interviews-power-moves-2019-1?r=US&IR=T

@AffIt

'True' introverts or extraverts are vanishingly rare - the vast majority of people, as with most things in life, fall within a bell curve.

I can deliver a presentation to 200 people, or enjoy an evening at a party, then spend the next two days sitting at home with a book and a cat without talking to anybody.

Labelling yourself is reductive and self-limiting.

Me too! And so do 'most' people I know Yes yes there are quizzes which mark you as either an introvert or an extrovert but most people have moods

I do find it wearing as a pp said when someone doesn’t “uphold” their side of the social contact. Fil just sits there makes no effort whatsoever. I would like to do that sometimes but when I tried it got once got lots of “are you ok” etc. I’m not a massive extrovert but have good social skills and think it’s abit unfair to just opt out entirely and let others do all the work socially.

I haven't read all of the comments yet, so apologies if I'm repeating something.

As I understand it -

Introversion means needing significant time alone to recharge.

Extroversion means needing a significant amount of social contact to recharge.

Introverts can be witty, warm, chatty, charming. They just like to spend a lot of time alone and find too much social interaction exhausting.

Introverts aren't necessarily always lacking in assertiveness. My sister is majorly extroverted but not assertive. Very chatty, thrives on social contact, but not actually deeply confident within herself.

OP, going back to your original post -

I think happiness with being however you are comes from BOTH internal happiness AND putting yourself in the right environment as much as you can.

At school, my reports always said the same thing. Bright, but should speak up more. Should contribute more. Should use her voice more in class.

In jobs, I'd always get reviews that said I was doing brilliantly, but just needed more "confidence". Many managers don't understand that by highlighting someone's perceived lack of confidence, all this actually does is make the person feel under a microscope, which DECREASES confidence.

Now, I work for myself and this definitely suits me. I've gradually taken steps to align my life in such a way that I've chosen not to work in fields where I'm expected to constantly outshine people, be loud, constantly spouting ideas, etc. Is this something you can do?

As for personal acceptance - you have to become happy with you are. There will always be outside triggers and influences in life. No matter what you do. You could become the most confident, assertive, calm, gregarious person in the room and still have people commenting on it.

I'm not an expert, but for me, if I don't like something about myself, I either work to change that thing, or I work to change my perspective about that thing. I used to lack assertiveness, then I decided to make some big changes. To leave a bad relationship. To start driving lessons. To build my own little business. Various steps that help to give you strength as a person. Generally speaking, inching towards conquering things that intimidate you is how you develop greater assertiveness and confidence.

@DizzySquirrel90

I hear ya. I've been overlooked countless times for promotion even though I'm top performer within team. Purely because I'm 'quiet' and therefore can't be considered. It's a joke as I can manage people even if I am 'quiet', managing people isn't about being full on and chatty it's about managing people. It's something I'm repeatedly told to work on if I want a promotion.

It's unprofessional and discriminatory to not promote you for being 'quiet'. It is however acceptable to not promote you based on key competencies your line manager feels that you lack. You have to be told which ones, and how to demonstrate that you do meet the criteria.

In my org a certain seniority requires actively seeking out and building relationships, keeping your 'finger on the pulse'. A lot of colleagues aren't suited for this. Excellent technical staff and great at managing their own teams but that's not enough for the next level although they are top performers.

If that's not the case with you - you should be able to evidence it. Connect with key people you've made an impression on, get them to speak up for you. Promotions generally need the support of multiple people anyway if an organisation's being fair

I'm similar to you op. I'm good in a small group but would get lost in a crowd. My dh is very chatty, opposites attract and all that. I am confident though and have an inner strength he lacks but most people wouldn't realise that. Friends from work don't think I'm particularly quiet but that is because I'm the boss in our work environment and make all the decisions as the overarching responsibility is mine. My biggest issue is that I'm rubbish at making small talk. I'm on mat leave currently and have made some mum friends by putting myself out there but it doesn't come naturally to me. I have to work very hard at it and tbh sometimes I'm just not all that bothered.

so rude!

People typically view me as overly quiet and sometimes shy. It’s been pointed out and criticised for my entire life. My younger sister has a polar opposite personality: chatty, confident, extroverted. I remember my grandmother always smiling about her and saying how she would do well in life. There were no smiles like that for me and it can really make you feel like something is wrong with you.

I seem to be on the extreme end of the introversion spectrum. I had selective mutism as a child and I still feel the mutism, but I have developed ways to cover it up. I didn’t fully understand that this is my personality as a child/teen, so I put a lot of effort into attempting to change it. I wanted to fit in and be what the people around me desired. I would put myself in uncomfortable positions over and over again in an effort to just ‘be normal’.

I did develop some communication skills. I can talk to people when it’s required, give presentations in front of a crowd and maybe even pass for an extrovert for short periods of time. I have social skills, but talking at length to people that I don’t know very well drains me. I need to be energetic to do it. In the society we live in, introversion can almost be a disability sometimes.

But I believe there are advantages to being introverted. It’s a difference rather than a disability. I think I have a better-than-average ability to tune into things and concentrate for long periods of time. I never get bored. I am naturally musical and tend to excel at creative pursuits. Based on what I know about the science of introvert/extrovert brains, I think these things are related. I think we can improve our sense of self by concentrating on what we are good at and what we actually enjoy in life. That said, being able to communicate verbally is such a useful skill that it’s always worth trying to improve, even if it doesn’t come naturally.