If I'd known how hard conceiving can be I'd have started younger

[conceptionisdraining]

I feel like society/people/medics act like you have sex once and bang, you're pregnant.

I know this can and does happen, but it's just not the reality for most people - especially not me!

Actually getting pregnant can take time, then with miscarriages along the way it's ridiculous. It's been two years now since the journey started I'm 35 and planned to have a baby by now but not even pregnant.

Am I unreasonable to think there could perhaps but a little more factual education for women which in turn would probably save a lot of funding that goes towards IVF and other treatment.

Me and DH never ever had unprotected sex until TTC as I thought I would fall and have a baby right away, had I have known what I do I probably would have been a little more relaxed about unprotected sex a few years earlier.

TTC is quite possibly the most boring, emotionally draining thing I've ever done.

[quote Knickynackynoo]@Peach01 I don't think the op is talking just about the threat of declining fertility, just that even when there's no problems that current testing techniques can flag up some people can take a long time to fall pregnant even if they're under 35. If you're only getting pregnant once a year then miscarrying that is an awful slog at any age we many women don't realise is often the reality.[/quote]
I get that, I've been through it myself.

It is okay to give up op. The process is completely soul destroying and not one I would choose to go through again. It destroyed my mental health for four years and took a lot the joy away from my first child (secondary infertility). A lot of the problem with infertility I found was feeling powerless and I guess by stopping you can take back that power. My story is that I had a second child who has learning difficulties and probably will never be independent. That’s a whole new level of powerlessness.

I was 22 when I started ttc. I’m 25 now and 24 weeks pregnant, having sadly had 3 miscarriages. Sometimes youth isn’t enough, but what it does give you is time and less pressure. I agree with you OP, and very best of luck. The trauma of those losses and the years of trying will always stay with me.

What are we going to do though? Start telling women that they probably won’t get pregnant and they can relax about contraception?

Reality is some women will get pregnant that one time. And there is no way to tell which women they are. So if you don’t want a baby at that point in your life, you do need to take contraception seriously.

You could not have known then what you know now. I did not start ttc until my late 30’s- i was absolutely not in a place to have a child before that. I was lucky and conceived very quickly, one late 30’s one early 40’s.

Until we have some way of diagnosing those who will struggle with fertility early on the message still has to be that you can get pregnant any time you have sex, which is true.

@conceptionisdraining get the investigations done again privately, the NHS investigations aren't thorough and focus on the female when most 50% of the time it is the sperm that is the problem. Ours was a sperm issue which wouldn't have been picked up by the NHS - and I'm just old.

Have a look at the recurrent MC boards on bsbycentre and see whether you want to investigate that further, again what the NHS offer is woeful off first bat but, there is more available at specialist centres funded in part by the NHS which you won't necessarily be told about.

Get your partner on the Serum Centre Sperm quality protocol, give it a Google.

Try and mix up the times of day you try and start from the day aft your period is finished until 10 days before your period is due if you're regular. We finally dropped on without assistance after 18 months doing that then having set every 36 hrs or so day 1 at night day in them morning - if that makes sense, we never dtd in the morning and ever and it was doing that that we finally dropped on, we lost it but it showed it wasn't impossible.

I think from reading this thread and another thread running at the moment on breastfeeding, that the problem is not simply a lack of specific education in these areas, but schools in the past not teaching people the skills needed for contuning to educate and inform themselves throughout life (not sure how good education in this area is now, my DD is only 3 so I'm a bit out of touch with education).

It seems that everyone is aware of the basic fact that fertility declines with age, but not about the specifics and how it might affect them, and the likelihood of this happening. I knew throughout my 20s and 30s that this was a fact, but then when it became a potential issue I had any hope of tackling (I was not in any kind of stable relationship until my mid 30s that it would be fair to bring a child into) I did my own research, and had no problem finding the infomation.

In the age of the internet, all the info is easily available through the huge range of books on sale, easily searchable via google or amazon, and google scholar with huge numbers of abstracts of peer reviewed articles as well as a good number of full text open access articles. But people need to be educated in what to search, how to search and how to identify quality evidenced base infomation from all the opinion based stuff that can be utter crap.

We can not expect to be spoon fed everything in adulthood, and have to take a degree of personal responsibility, by doing our own reading on topics that are relevant to us as individuals. But without the basic skills being put in place at school, then this puts many people at a huge disadvantage. I learnt most of my research/info gathering skills and critical thinking skills at uni, not in school, many people didn't ever get this opportunity and they have been failed by the education system.

@Nomoreusernames1244

What are we going to do though? Start telling women that they probably won’t get pregnant and they can relax about contraception?

Reality is some women will get pregnant that one time. And there is no way to tell which women they are. So if you don’t want a baby at that point in your life, you do need to take contraception seriously.

You could not have known then what you know now. I did not start ttc until my late 30’s- i was absolutely not in a place to have a child before that. I was lucky and conceived very quickly, one late 30’s one early 40’s.

Until we have some way of diagnosing those who will struggle with fertility early on the message still has to be that you can get pregnant any time you have sex, which is true.

Yes but the two aren't mutually exclusive are they?

We of course need to know sex once can result in a baby but we also need to be told the rate of miscarriage, how normal it actually is (never knew anyone that had one previously until mine then a few people spoke up)

Has I had known the common rate of miscarriage that would have changed my perspective, but no one talks about it.

So it makes you 'think' everyone just has a baby like that. The back story is never or rarely shared. All you see if news articles from time to time how over 35 fertility declines.

Well actually they should also point out miscarriage is common too so give yourself time.

[quote Knickynackynoo]@Peach01 I don't think the op is talking just about the threat of declining fertility, just that even when there's no problems that current testing techniques can flag up some people can take a long time to fall pregnant even if they're under 35. If you're only getting pregnant once a year then miscarrying that is an awful slog at any age we many women don't realise is often the reality.[/quote]
Yes @Knickynackynoo thank you this is exactly the point I'm trying to make.

All we know is start trying after 35 a which I did when arguably I probably still wasn't ready but started because of age fertility pressures. I already did what I was 'supposed' to do if that makes sense,

What I didn't know because people don't share, is that it takes months to get pregnant then you're pregnant for three months, then you have miscarriage and need surgery, need body to heal etc there's a whole another year wasted and then it happens again. Had I have realised one in four end in miscarriage (even though I never knew anyone personally had one) then that may have changed my perspective)

*So it makes you 'think' everyone just has a baby like that. The back story is never or rarely shared. All you see if news articles from time to time how over 35 fertility declines.

Well actually they should also point out miscarriage is common too so give yourself time*

I always knew how common miscarriage is? Yes it’s not well talked about, but it’s hardly hidden. There’s so much information about IVF and assisted conception too, i never took the “it only takes one time” message to mean no one will have fertility issues. I also never thought I’d conceive “just like that”.

The information is out there, and accessible.

In this day and age with the internet as pp said, do people really not look any further than the secondary school message of sex=babies? If so women really need to start educating themselves about their bodies.

@conceptionisdraining sorry in my last post reread and it isn't clear, try having sex every 36 hrs or so.

So day 1 at night day 3 in the morning and so on until 10 days before your period is due.

This bloody Hauwi phone is a nightmare sorry if my posts are garbled!

We of course need to know sex once can result in a baby but we also need to be told the rate of miscarriage, how normal it actually is (never knew anyone that had one previously until mine then a few people spoke up)

Who and how do we teach this? I don't really think it needs to be yet another thing for schools to have teach teenagers nor do I think it tells teenagers anything of much use to them, I found out the statistics pretty quick when I fell pregnant, for people who want to know the information is there, I'm not sure what value it brings to "teach" these things? Though I agree one positive (if that's an appropriate word) would be for people to be able to talk more openly about miscarriage and not have it be a taboo thing, I think that's happening.

I always thought you just needed to have sex once and you'd have a baby. That's what we were told at school.

@user0176 yes that's what I mean, I don't think I'm schools necessarily but amongst peers. When I had mine I told most people o didn't see what the secret was, we announced pregnancy pretty much from day one.

Only once I had mine did I hear about other miscarriages so my perspective was you fall pregnant I probably thought one in 20 had miscarriage not one in four - because I 'thought' no one I knew had one of that makes sense

@Knickynackynoo haha no that's fine I got it!

That's a great idea because even every other day is starting to wear us out, sadly.

As I keep being mentioned in posts, I wasn't only referring to declining fertility with age.
The point I was making is that you don't know how you or your partners fertility stands until you start trying at any point in life, it is a case of if you can conceive. I was well aware that miscarriage and infertility were a strong possibility. I hoped to fall pregnant but didn't necessarily expect to. I have miscarried and I know of many other who have. I always believed it to be a common.

I don't think it's always a case of people just don't talk about it. It's very personal. I decided if I fell pregnant again I wouldn't wait 12 weeks before announcing. If anything happened during that first trimester I didn't want to deal with it alone.

I think it’s good schools teach you, bang- have sex once and be pregnant, even though that’s not reality, your so much more fertile when your younger it’s almost ridiculous!

Had sex once at 18 without protection and became pregnant. Only 4 years later took a year to conceive, then 5 years later took 6 months. Your age must make a difference.

What’s funny now, it that I’m finished having babies, I wouldn’t like any more, and guess what happens to me now,
I KNOW when I’m ovulating, as I get mild cramps!!! Where was all that when I was actively trying to conceive!

Typical

@user0176

We of course need to know sex once can result in a baby but we also need to be told the rate of miscarriage, how normal it actually is (never knew anyone that had one previously until mine then a few people spoke up)

Who and how do we teach this? I don't really think it needs to be yet another thing for schools to have teach teenagers nor do I think it tells teenagers anything of much use to them, I found out the statistics pretty quick when I fell pregnant, for people who want to know the information is there, I'm not sure what value it brings to "teach" these things? Though I agree one positive (if that's an appropriate word) would be for people to be able to talk more openly about miscarriage and not have it be a taboo thing, I think that's happening.

We don't need to let teens know about pregnancy but must educate adults on miscarriage? We can literally do both

@conceptionisdraining I'm surprised you thought that, especially when actively TTC, my midwife told me on my first call that we don't book in until later in the pregnancy because of the risk of miscarriage. I'm sorry your expectations weren't managed but I do think it's out there quite a bit. (And I'm very sorry for your loss, I can imagine how much more devastating it was not knowing the statistics).

We don't need to let teens know about pregnancy but must educate adults on miscarriage? We can literally do both

I don't understand what you're saying here in response to what I wrote? I didn't say anywhere teenagers don't need to know about pregnancy, quite the opposite and I don't particularly think adults need education on miscarriage in this day in age. Awareness is quite high, I think, and whilst it should increase I don't think it needs to come from any kind of formal education, we just need to be able to talk about it more openly.

[quote Knickynackynoo]@conceptionisdraining sorry in my last post reread and it isn't clear, try having sex every 36 hrs or so.

So day 1 at night day 3 in the morning and so on until 10 days before your period is due.

This bloody Hauwi phone is a nightmare sorry if my posts are garbled![/quote]
It's repetition of incorrect 'myths' that is part of the problem. As a PP who concieved whilst menstruating can attest to, there is no specific day of the cycle that ovulation occurs across all women.

In the 1940s a large study was carried out that has not been repeated, at least on the same scale, due to the unique circumstances at the time. They asked thousands of women who knew very precisly, to a day or 2s accuracy, as that was the length of leave for their husbands during the war, when they conceived. What the data showed was that women conceived as the result of sex in almost all parts of the cycle, just that it was statistically most common to concieve around day 14. If someone is an outlier then the advice you are giving is bad advice, hence why GPs, or at least my GP, said sex twice a week throughout the cycle. There is also now the option of home ovulation test kits, so that women can pinpoint their unique time of ovulation.

This is also an example of why it is best to look for evidence based research or talk to you GP or better still a fertility expert, not listen to randoms on the internet.

Didn’t you wonder why it’s a “thing” to announce a pregnancy after the 12 week scan? And why m/w care doesn’t really start until after that?

Have you never seen all the opk’s and fertility indicator things in pharmacies? Wondered why they’d be needed if it was a case of bang and pregnant?

I do think a lot of this knowledge is shared by multiple generations of women sitting around kitchen tables chatting (or as my DH says..."talking about other people"). If you don't have that for whatever reason then this kind of handed-on information can get lost or scrambled by other messages that are being sent (like in PSHE classes - the "teens don't get pregnant!" message can overshadow other info).

I remember as a kid sitting quietly around the table and listening, with my mum and her sisters folding dumplings and learning about miscarriages because they were talking about someone with a huge gap between her 2nd and 3rd DC because of the miscarriages in between, then the story of another woman with a similar experience, etc. And discussions of how normal it is. Also my aunt brought up a friend of a friend who waited until she was a partner in a hedge fund to start TTC and was now having a hard time, IVF not a walk in the park, etc.

@Nomoreusernames1244

Didn’t you wonder why it’s a “thing” to announce a pregnancy after the 12 week scan? And why m/w care doesn’t really start until after that?

Have you never seen all the opk’s and fertility indicator things in pharmacies? Wondered why they’d be needed if it was a case of bang and pregnant?

No need to be so rude. There’s a shelf in pharmacies for vulval cleansing products but there isn’t a woman on earth who actually needs them.

@ohfook

Yes I actually believed the whole 'you can get pregnant any time you have unprotected sex' bollocks for years. It was only when ttc that I realised how ignorant I was about the whole thing.

But it isn't bollocks for everyone. AFAIK I have got pregnant every single time I've had unprotected sex and not taken the morning after pill.

My mum was the same. It's important that young women understand how real that risk is.

I'm sorry for all of those who have had difficulty conceiving but that doesn't mean it's the same for everyone. And i don't think teenage girls need to be told that they might expect "a long heartbreaking journey to conceive". In fact I think that could be a very dangerous thing to teach