To want to correct dh's interactions with DC?

[Sam020]

I need to start by saying that dh is a great father and very involved and affectionate. He adores ds. He gets Ds ready in the morning, puts him to bed and does a lot of the organisational stuff. Ds is very attached to him too.

So, it's nothing major that troubles me but little things, for example being too distracted by his phone to listen to Ds, being unnecessarily strict or harsh at times, dismissing ds' feelings, being very strict, comparing him to other kids, etc. It's not nasty stuff but there's room for improvement and there's the possibility to make his and Ds's life easier and more pleasant and improve their relationship.

He hates me criticising him though. He's super sensitive and thinks I'm calling him s bad parent. I'm not. I think he's a good parent but could be better. And when it comes to the kids why not try to be as good as you can?

I try and pick my battles and only mention something when I think it's truly damaging. I try to model more playful (and more effective I believe) ways of dealing with things. I try not to say it in front of ds as he feels that undermines him and we need to present a united front. He still doesn't like it.

I get a lot of my parenting techniques from books like "how to listen to little children" and similar and I'd like him to read them as well as I find the technique very effective.

Sorry this has become more of an wwyd rather than an aibu but yes, what would you do? Keep quiet to avoid confrontation and to avoid hurting your partner's feelings?

I want to tell him gently without hurting his feelings but how?

You've just got to let go. He is a good dad and they have a great bond. There will be benefits to his way too. You can't make him be more playful and he can't make you be less. It's part of your nature too.

I think dh can be too strict, he thinks I can coddle them. For the most part it works fine and there are benefits to both ways. As long as neither of us are too extreme one way or the other.

If you're prioritising the DC then you need to ask if criticising your DH and trying to get him to parent the same as you will lead to positive experiences or a positive environment for your DCs.

You're making it clear to your DH that you don't agree with his parenting style but he obviously does because he isn't changing. You can't micro-manage him or every interaction your DC has with other people.
Ultimately, you need to decide whether you truly think their relationship is damaging in which case you need to remove your DC from it or if you're just nitpicking because you feel like the expert and want to control their relationship.

@PerfectlyUnsuitable

Btw the looking at the phone is a pain and rude imo. I’m pretty sure that in a few years time, your DH will be pretty listed off his ds is ignoring him in favour of his phone. But money sees, monkey does… so….

I’d have more issues with the comparing him to other children, ignoring feelings etc…
All pretty much rooted in patriarchy and sexism and toxic masculinity. You’re going to have a really hard time to fight that. You are also totally right to want to fight it.

Agree with this

Yes so that's exactly my question. How do you do that? How do you start this conversation without it sounding like criticism?

I think what you're asking is "how can I criticise him without criticising him?" That isn't possible.

You can have conversations about parenting issues - but not if your objective (which you have stated) is for him to parent exactly like you

From your examples, neither of you are damaging your son.

You prefer to cajole him, dh prefers to be stricter. You both sound like you're on the same page with your end goal. You both sound like good parents.
If he's an only child, I agree with your husband; he shouldn't grow up thinking the world revolves around him and that he can always have the attention from adults. Tantrums shouldn't really be pandered to at all at school age (I know they happen occasionally but still )

Try to relax. I get it, as a mum you constantly worry about your children and their emotional well being. I don't think your husband will damage your son's emotional development.

Don't let these differences in parenting cause a wedge between you and your husband. And remember it's not a best parent competition. Both of you will make mistakes.

@JustLyra

It's the former (comparison). Like I said, it's not nasty but ideally I think there should be no comparisons.

So twice a year he makes a very minor comparison to another child, as millions do, and that’s one of the things you want to correct?

In the nicest way - you need to relax.

Between that and you wanting him to correct you (so he can’t do right for doing wrong) I’m not surprised he’s being defensive.

That’s massively controlling.

It was an example. But yeah, like I said, it's nothing major just little things. I would like to voice them though without making dh feel that I think he's a bad parent.

At the moment we don't even get to have a discussion about anything because dh becomes so defensive. If we'd talk about it and then he'd explain why he disagrees or prefers his method I wouldn't mind.

Maybe your DH doesn’t want a big conversation with you, he just wants to get on parenting his DC

It was an example. But yeah, like I said, it's nothing major just little things. I would like to voice them though without making dh feel that I think he's a bad parent.

At the moment we don't even get to have a discussion about anything because dh becomes so defensive. If we'd talk about it and then he'd explain why he disagrees or prefers his method I wouldn't mind.

You can’t tell someone they’re a shit parent (which is what you are doing by criticising everything he does) without making them feel like you are saying he’s a bad parent.

Why does he have to justify his methods to you? He likely becomes defensive because you expect him to justify himself or do as he’s told.

Even your choice of “I wouldn’t mind” is very telling. You clearly think you are the number one parent and things should be done your way unless the other, lesser, parent can explain to you why theirs is better.

You are being ridiculously controlling over things and it will damage both your marriage and your husbands relationship with your children.

Minor comparisons twice a year, handling a tantrum or getting up in the morning without long conversation or pandering is not bad parenting and shouldn’t need your permission.

Tbh you sound both controlling and like you’ve read too many books.

@SmileyClare

From your examples, neither of you are damaging your son.

You prefer to cajole him, dh prefers to be stricter. You both sound like you're on the same page with your end goal. You both sound like good parents.
If he's an only child, I agree with your husband; he shouldn't grow up thinking the world revolves around him and that he can always have the attention from adults. Tantrums shouldn't really be pandered to at all at school age (I know they happen occasionally but still )

Try to relax. I get it, as a mum you constantly worry about your children and their emotional well being. I don't think your husband will damage your son's emotional development.

Don't let these differences in parenting cause a wedge between you and your husband. And remember it's not a best parent competition. Both of you will make mistakes.

Haha, Thanks for saying that neither of us are bad parents. I was getting a bit worried with some.posters saying that dh is emotionally damaging Ds and some others saying that I am controlling and manipulative!!

Though it's true, I might be a bit controlling.and I do think that some of the things that dh does could potentially be damaging to ds' self esteem. And some things are just not fair (eg DH oversleeps, wakes ds late and then gets annoyed with ds for not getting ready quickly enough.)

But even now you are still at the starting point of assuming you're right, and if he can defend his methods and give you a good enough explanation, you will graciously allow him to continue with it. That might not be what you think you're doing, but I bet that's how it comes across to him, as it does to people reading the thread. That underlying sense of 'I am right' shines out from every comment. No wonder he is defensive! Your ways might be equally irritating and annoying and wrong to an outside observer, and you really aren't showing that you believe that at all - it sounds like you want to give lip service to his ideas so that you can ultimately make him realise that yours are best. That's not open-minded, that's pretending to yourself that you're open-minded, while you are just waiting for him to see the light.

Your children do not need two mothers.

They need a mother and a father.

They do different things, most often.

You'll be happy of a more disciplinary approach when they reach teenage years, believe me.

Embrace the difference, the yin/yang. It's what makes for healthy and adapted kids.

@JustLyra

It was an example. But yeah, like I said, it's nothing major just little things. I would like to voice them though without making dh feel that I think he's a bad parent.

At the moment we don't even get to have a discussion about anything because dh becomes so defensive. If we'd talk about it and then he'd explain why he disagrees or prefers his method I wouldn't mind.

You can’t tell someone they’re a shit parent (which is what you are doing by criticising everything he does) without making them feel like you are saying he’s a bad parent.

Why does he have to justify his methods to you? He likely becomes defensive because you expect him to justify himself or do as he’s told.

Even your choice of “I wouldn’t mind” is very telling. You clearly think you are the number one parent and things should be done your way unless the other, lesser, parent can explain to you why theirs is better.

You are being ridiculously controlling over things and it will damage both your marriage and your husbands relationship with your children.

Minor comparisons twice a year, handling a tantrum or getting up in the morning without long conversation or pandering is not bad parenting and shouldn’t need your permission.

Tbh you sound both controlling and like you’ve read too many books.

Because it's our child and what is the best for him matters to me. I don't care how he does the gardening or his work or whatever and I don't ask him to justify himself regarding anything else or criticise. But when it comes to the kids it matters to me

Could you raise it as a reflection of both of your behaviours? e.g. "We should try and be on our phones less, especially around the kids - what do you think? Shall we leave our phones in the kitchen tonight?"

OP I get exactly what you are saying. Both DH and I had authoritative parents who were actually abusive in many respects.

We both have had to learn how to parent outside of the examples taught by our own parents. DH was slower than I was to seek out learning this stuff but actually he is a kinder more sensitive soul by nature than I am so a lot of the stuff we needed to change came more naturally to him. However at times he reverts to his childhood parenting, My kids are older and these days they call my husband’s parenting, roll of the dice parenting where mostly he is all emotionally available and attentive and once in a while he reverts to what they call his 1950s parenting but they aren’t remotely afraid of him like we were of our parents, or calling him out when he is being unreasonable, so they just gently tease him for it.

The 1950s type of authoritative parenting is damaging for children even in its most benign form. It is like slapping though lots of people believe it did them no harm.

It doesn't always have to be a full blown sit down conversation, could you not just say "ooh that was a bit harsh" when you think it?

Because it's our child and what is the best for him matters to me. I don't care how he does the gardening or his work or whatever and I don't ask him to justify himself regarding anything else or criticise. But when it comes to the kids it matters to me

And the clear suggestion in that is that it doesn’t matter to him. Which is likely highly offensive.

And again you are clearly suggestion that you’re right and he’s wrong. Which is also offensive.

I’d suggest kindly you find yourself a book on how to be less controlling and how to co-parent properly because at the moment you are being ridiculously controlling and not co-parenting well at all.

And what will happen if you continue to criticise him, so he splits up with you. How beneficial will that be for your DS? How will you control his parenting in his contact time?

@thisplaceisweird

Could you raise it as a reflection of both of your behaviours? e.g. "We should try and be on our phones less, especially around the kids - what do you think? Shall we leave our phones in the kitchen tonight?"

Yes, that's what I do but he still sees it as pointed criticism at him. Wherever possible I try to frame things as "I've noticed it works well / not so well if I / we do X".etc.

He kind of sees it all as criticism and maybe that's fair enough when it is really about stuff that he does.

To be honest you sound like a bit of a dose. And precious. And you are way overthinking things. Leave the man alone to parent as he sees fit. Nothing you have described so far falls within the realm of bad parenting, let alone likely to cause long term damage. And even if he gets it 'wrong' sometimes, well parenting is no more capable of perfection than any other human endeavour. Relax and enjoy what sounds like a decent husband and father and a nice family.

To be honest I wouldn’t be happy with things like him waking ds too late then moaning at him for not getting ready quickly enough - would he be happy if you came and moaned at him for waking up too late? That just sounds like him taking out his laziness on the child.

Also with comparing him to other kids - he doesn’t like being found wanting so why should ds?

I agree some things just need to be accepted but some things should be challenged. DS can’t say ‘dad don’t moan at me, this is your fault and not mine’ so who else will say it? It makes a really negative atmosphere to have your dad going off at you because he couldn’t be bothered getting up in time, or saying things like ‘why can’t you be like Jordan?’

I don't think critiquing his parenting will help, as that will just make him defensive. Would he read a parenting book? There are a few pitched at different levels, Unconditional Parenting is less 'useful' than How To Talk..., but if he's the kind of guy who would like to understand it might be better. Otherwise would he listen to podcasts (Janet Lansbury has a good one), blog posts, YouTube videos. Might help more than you saying (in his perception) I'm a better parent than you. And then you need to accept that he might not agree with the information and that just because his parenting opinion differs from yours doesn't make it wrong.

You said that saying "I really liked the way you handled ds' tantrum today" would feel insincere, but is there another way that you could phrase it so that it does. Maybe in terms of a 'thank you' than 'I liked'. Or comment on how quickly DS calmed down or how early he got him out of the door. But if he is happy with his parenting style then I don't think there's anything that you can do. I also don't think authoritarian, authoritative, and permissive are discrete labels. They are sliding scales and while he might lean more authoritarian than you, from what it sounds like he's a warm loving parent, not demanding perfection and punishing harshly and often when his unreasonable expectations aren't met.

OP, your DH is a poor father - the defensiveness on his part shows he knows what he's doing is wrong. Please don't mistake this type of super strict parenting as simply being clear and enforcing boundaries. I think you're already in 'dysfunctional territory'. You have a baby but you also have a 5 yr old - please don't let your DH do most of his parenting. As your DS grows up, he will remember the fear, the walking on eggshells and he will resent you both. This type of parenting never works - as an adult you simply have no love for that parent. It stays with you even if on the outside you look 'normal'. Nobody is a perfect parent but your DH is potentially doing lifelong harm to your DS.

And I also don’t think it’s acceptable to regularly ignore or ‘not hear’ your child because you’re busy playing your phone - it’s very lazy.

@JustLyra

Because it's our child and what is the best for him matters to me. I don't care how he does the gardening or his work or whatever and I don't ask him to justify himself regarding anything else or criticise. But when it comes to the kids it matters to me

And the clear suggestion in that is that it doesn’t matter to him. Which is likely highly offensive.

And again you are clearly suggestion that you’re right and he’s wrong. Which is also offensive.

I’d suggest kindly you find yourself a book on how to be less controlling and how to co-parent properly because at the moment you are being ridiculously controlling and not co-parenting well at all.

I've said clearly on this thread that he loves ds as much as I do and wants what is best for him.

And yes some things I do think are wrong. I'm sure I do a lot of things wrongly as well and I don't mind them being pointed out to me.

Just as I don't mind people on here calling me controlling and manipulative. Maybe I am and that's what I need to think about.

But just as on MN I want to have the option at home to discuss it rather than having to bite my tongue because I don't want to upset dh.

@MsPootle
Parody account?