To expect my children to be treated as equals to dh sisters children?

[invisiblezara]

Dh and I had a discussion last night over Christmas gifts and budget. When we got to talking about his Niece's and nephew he suggested we spend £25 on each of them which is what we have done ever since we got together some years ago. Now, I usually always agree to this budget and we usually get a few small gifts for each of them rather than one larger present worth £25.

My problem is that every year for Christmas and their birthdays we do so much for his Dsis children and she doesn't put any kind of effort in back for my children.
For example 4 times a year we visit dh sister for every one of her children's birthdays with loads of gifts and spend time down there with them all but my children don't even get a "happy birthday" from her.

I want to make things more fair, we definitely don't give to receive but even though they don't say anything I feel my children will begin to notice they are being treated differently just because they're not family by blood. They are not my dh's biological children and he doesn't have any of his own but we have been in the family long enough to know each other very well and spend a lot of time together.
My dc have absolutely no contact with their biological dad or any family from his side and know Dh's parents as their own grandparents.

This year I suggested we get each of her children a t-shirt from Primark as she does each year for my children. Dh at first thought I was being very unreasonable but then said he sort of understood where I was coming from, but now
I'm starting to doubt myself and feel like I maybe being petty? So I'd like your thoughts, am I being unreasonable? Should I just continue spending what we usually spend or should I match her Christmas gifts?
Of course we will still continue to buy for her children on their birthdays regardless of the fact she doesn't acknowledge mine.

it really does sting that it's spend, spend, spend for her family but pitiful gifts for ours - nowhere near equivalent to what we give. It just feels so insulting

What are you measuring when you compare ££s being spent? Is that honestly how you value friends and relations? I'm sure it's not so why get so uptight about it?

Gift giving should either be done without expectation or with mutual agreement. To choose the amount unilaterally and then get offended that the other party does things differently is bonkers.

Despite returning to your thread @invisiblezara you are seeming a little cagey about all the people asking what your husband did for his sister’s kids before you stepped in and wifeworked up a shitload of balloons and multiple presents and family visits…

It matters.

Imagine your SIL:

“AIBU? I’ve got 4 kids, one SN, and a busy life. My bro just married his girlfriend and is now father to her children. Which is lovely! I’m pleased for him, I like them, I like their mum. But overnight, this woman has turned birthdays into a song and dance and now I feel under pressure that I’m supposed to magic that up for her kids too. And I feel mean, she’s lovely and clearly wants to be one happy family. But I’m just busy enough!”

How would you respond?
I bet 90% of posters would say, “I feel your pain, but I think you have to suck it up, BUT… don’t feel dragged into a big performance you don’t have the energy or the will for. It’s her choice to do the big thing - some people like that. Just send a card with a voucher.”

I do get that it’s annoying that SIL is doing nothing for birthdays right now… but look at it from her point of view, suddenly expected to take on yet more “things to do” simply because you like doing more than average.

Of course I change my mind if your husband used to do loads for her kids… but if he did, then you’d have answered that question already 🤷🏻‍♀️

There are two issues - it’s not your niece and nephews fault their mum is an ass. So just take that into account.
It’s up to your husband to speak to his sister and ask her why. It is possible she just is a bit insensitive but when she realises this may change her ways.

So all these people who don’t see these kids as family because the DH didn’t contribute sperm to create them - assuming you’d also reject your siblings’ child if they used a sperm or egg donor or if they adopted? Lovely.

No. Adoption and siblings children by sorry or egg is different because if the couple split I’d still have a relationship with those children.

These children have no legal tie to this family and if the op and her DH split up her DH has no right to see them and his family even less.

*sperm

@Gensola

So all these people who don’t see these kids as family because the DH didn’t contribute sperm to create them - assuming you’d also reject your siblings’ child if they used a sperm or egg donor or if they adopted? Lovely.

You know what they say about “assume”. Don’t be an ass. No-one has said that, and there’s no reason to suggest anyone thinks that.

Just match the cost of the gifts - Primark T-shirts if that’s what she gives yours.

Is all this effort coming from you or DH?

I mean - you say you buy the presents but who’s behind the birthday visits?

I send my children's cousins birthday cards with a little cash and a wrapped gift at Christmas. My dc are lucky to get a card a few weeks late.

Its not about my children it's about them. I want the children to know I didn't forget them that they are important to me and I love them. (We don't get to see them to often)

@Cocomarine but they’ve implied it by saying the children aren’t related by blood, neither are adopted or donor children.

@Gensola

So all these people who don’t see these kids as family because the DH didn’t contribute sperm to create them - assuming you’d also reject your siblings’ child if they used a sperm or egg donor or if they adopted? Lovely.

It's a very different thing for a multitude of reasons including clarity of role to outsiders and relatives, so you'd be better off not assuming that.

Just leave him to buy the presents for his sister and family. I’m glad it works for you but I don’t know a single opposite-sex couple where the present buying always falls to the man. It drives me bloody mental - it’s one of the last weirdly societally acceptable ‘women’s tasks’.

And it’s causing bad feelings so sounds like he should just pick this task up - I also work long hours too but still find time to buy presents for friends and family.

Just one other thought which is are you SURE it’s because of the whole real/not real family thing? Is SIL not just one of those really tight people that give terrible gifts?

It may be she thinks the effort you put in his overkill for nieces and nephews and is trying not to encourage it to continue (which if she reciprocated, it certainly would). Do they actually want more stuff? Multiple inexpensive gifts can be a burden (see the many many threads about Christmas and this issue).

Also....
His nieces and nephews are his nieces and nephews. Your children are not his sister's nieces and nephews. It sounds like she is rude and takes things to extremes, but I find it hard reading thread after thread where it's expected that new partner families are expected to step up because a child's father and his family aren't involved.

There may well be a bit of this.

I actually mentioned that my dc don't have contact with their fathers side of the family because they only know my dh's parents as their grandparents etc so it is relevant
It isn't relevant as the fact you and DH have chosen to be in a relationship doesn't create a responsibility on any of his family to fill the gap by your DC's absent father/father's family.

If his parents want to be grandparent figures then that's lovely. If his sister doesn't want to get involved as much for whatever reason then that is also OK. The fact your DC don't have relationships with their father's family doesn't create any responsibility on your DH's family to step up.

Either your DH needs to speak to his sister to find out more about her feelings on gift giving, or you need to accept that for whatever reason she just isn't into doing birthdays etc the same way you are.

Just leave him to buy the presents for his sister and family. I’m glad it works for you but I don’t know a single opposite-sex couple where the present buying always falls to the man. It drives me bloody mental - it’s one of the last weirdly societally acceptable ‘women’s tasks’.
It's one of many weirdly acceptable 'women's tasks'. We all know these men will have either done their own present buying to varying levels before they have a woman to pick up the slack.

Then women end up moaning at/about each other for not getting the right amount of gifts, right amount of fuss, too much, too little, not the right amount of expense etc. It's depressing.

I agree with previous posters asking if there is another reason to believe it is because they are not biologically related. Does his DSIS get your husband and tou presents for birthday? Does she instigate things for their parents' birthdays etc?

Honestly, the take home message I see from your original post and updates though is how great things have turned out for your kids, with a lovely dad and grandparents who dote on them. That will be so much more important to them than one aunt being a bit flakey with presents. If you are worried about how your kids feel, it will not go unnoticed by them how they are equally grandkids to your parents in law.

Thanks all for your input, most answers have been brilliant bar a very few harsh ones!

Dh broached the subject again tonight after dinner and said he's completely on my side and agrees that the children should all be treated the same.
I told him about this post and how some mumsnetters had actually made me realise I'm being quite unreasonable in expecting SIL to match our gifts as technically they're not her relations and it's not her duty. Dh disagrees and says the children should be treated equally regardless.
I suppose I let my emotions take over after thinking about the effort we put into her children's birthdays each year yet she doesn't even post a birthday card or call to say happy birthday let alone pop in for the little birthday party we put on at home each year but this is petty of me.

I decided I would like to continue giving her children the same amount of gifts we usually do because 1) it's not her dc's fault and 2) we love them and want to show it.

However, Dh now is on the other side of the fence and insists we scale back slightly. I mentioned that she maybe just forgets it's their birthdays but he said no way as it's talked about in the family group chat for days before, and he always calls to remind her, which is true.

I suggested he does all the present buying for SIL's children alone going forward so he could make the decision on how much to buy which he was all for. So that's a weight off my shoulders worrying over what to buy. --

Call me unreasonable but I do still hold out hope that sometime in the future SIL will make more of an effort, I'm not saying she needs to come with arms full of gifts or bloody balloons, maybe just show up to the party with a card.
It really isn't about the cost at all it's more the thoughtlessness that hurts e.g at christmas it would be wonderful if she spent whatever she spends now but on a more thoughtful gift to do with my dc's interests rather than the always far too small primark T-shirt!

It's good he is taking responsibility for present buying for his relatives OP. It removes pressure from you.

Ultimately you (and him) can't force or expect his sister to take on the role you would want or expect with your children just because you're married to her brother.

With your DH taking over gifting for his relatives, it's then up to him to manage the arrangements and discuss with his family. There's no reason for you to be carrying the mental load and worrying or being annoyed at his family's present giving.

And yet, you still won’t say what he used to before your turned up.
If my brother didn’t do anything for my kids’ birthday, then started calling to remind me when he had kids of his own, I’d call him a cheeky sod 🤷🏻‍♀️

If fact, he sounds pretty rude to me. She’s already established that she doesn’t do their birthdays. He admits that she knows because it’s in the family chat group. So why’s he calling her to remind her? That’s pretty rude and pushy, don’t you think? I might dig my heels in to that sort of thing too 🤷🏻‍♀️

My SIL is not at all like yours. (Quite the opposite, in fact…) My DH has always been the lazy arse with presents, etc. Although we live impossibly far apart (opposite sides of Australia) we speak all the time, and were both complaining of the mental load, and our mutual enemy (MIL - although BIL is also on our side, so she’s got that going for her too.) Anyhow, she and I both worked out between us that I was no longer doing the present thing and her kids were warned. (Older teens, they had been told if uncle didn’t follow through, auntie would send gift card later, which is undoubtedly preferable anyway…) My that buying gifts for DN’s that you actually only spoke to on the phone (and that was always me - and I knew clothing sizes, etc of course) was “easy” so he of course toddled off to the shops on Christmas Eve, entirely forgetting that Santa’s Elves had no way of getting anything to them in time. (Aussie Post is woeful at normal times of year - would take a week usually.) Wouldn’t admit he was late. Came home with sparkly, cheap little girl princess dress for nearly 12 year old niece - with matching plastic tiara & jewels. Suitable up to 4yrs. Emo, animal-loving 15y/o Nephew received plastic cricket set for when they go to the beach. (A - he hates sport. That’s his big brother’s thing. B. They live in the middle of the desert.) 18 year old nephew who has finished school and has just started an apprenticeship, and has his driver’s license was bought a book on personal development. Obviously I laughed at his efforts and told him to return them when the shops opened and I advised him of the ages and interests of his relatives. Then informed him that to purchase (generous) online vouchers for stores that suited these interests (prearranged by the kids themselves.) that could be emailled directly to them so they arrived on time.
And he tried to argue with me. (Token argument, nonetheless…) Oh how SIL and I laughed about it later…

I understand your hurt. She’s mean to not acknowledge your children’s birthdays when her children play and sleep over often at yours. Obviously the children are close and all children love birthdays. You are right that it’s horrible for her not to give a token gift (as you would to one of your children’s friends when close enough to sleep over) and wish them happy birthday. Or take the time to attend the parties. I would accept that she’s unlikely to change to minimise your hurt but it’s difficult to explain this to your children when they will inevitably realise. I didn’t get gifts from my dads side of the family even though we showed up at Christmas with gifts for all the other children. It’s very hurtful. She should be shamed for acting like this to children. Your husband or his parents need to have a word with her. I would minimise your efforts with their family.

But. What did he do before you came on the scene?

If my brother pointedly posted in a group chat and phones to remind me that it was his step children’s birthday I’d be a bit wtf. One of my siblings has a relatively new on the scene teenaged “stepchild” (they’re not married, moved in together in the last year) I’ve not seen more than twice due to COVID. I’ve no idea when her birthday is. We didn’t meet up last year at Christmas so we didn’t do presents but normally there’s a secret Santa and I fully expect she will be added to that.

@invisiblezara it is quite telling you aren't giving any back story of previous routines despite numerous people asking!

I think an important aspect which doesn't seem to be clear is 1. what did your DH do re gifts for them prior to you doing it and 2. How long have you been together?

Just wondering what the previous status quo was.

If for example, his nieces and nephews were born before your relationship started and your DH had already been buying them presents, there was no previous history of buying for your DC equally and they wouldn't have started buying gifts for your DC if it was a very new relationship.

If they were born after your relationship, then you started buying presents for them when there was already (presumably) no "routine" of buying for your DC so he needn't have started buying for them!