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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Joining mi6- this is crazy right?

238 replies

user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 16:47

So posting for traffic.

Pre warned this is crazy but I promise it’s true.

I’d posted under another nickname of brother who has a history of lying and I’m not talking little white lies I’m talking pathological as well as really frankly dangerous behaviour. Stole pension money from elderly grandmother (was her x mas money and he cut it out of her suitcase), stole 10k worth of jewellery, pushed father undergoing chemo over, held knife to mothers throat, not mentioning the amount of times he hit me 6 ways to Sunday. He was never held accountable for anything which is why I think we have this issue today.

But the previous post was an elaborate tale of him joining the navy. He told this to my very sick (and now passed away father), he bought a few Royal Navy T-shirt’s from the highstreet (pretending they were part of his training uniform), army style boots and epaulettes from god knows where to illustrate the scam. No military in the family so all a bit ignorant on this. DF unbeknownst to everyone was suffering and easily confused, he totally fell for it. Brother, mid 30s , was at the time working as a waiter (earning close to min wage, no shaming here just for income purposes) made several elaborate purchases in a year that as a minimum would have cost 50k. Father was wealthy, it is my strong suspicion that the navy was used to gain money from a v sick and vulnerable person. Reason for believing it’s a scam there was no commendation ceremony, he alleged you get epaulettes as a gesture of good will from the navy and said he was so skilled they fast tracked his application and shortened basic training and was offered an incredibly senior commanding position with 0 experience.

This was 4 months ago, brother is still working as a waiter but now is telling other vulnerable relatives (widowed mum and GM) that he’s been enrolled in mi6 as an intelligence operative as they work under authority of the navy (of which is apparently as the rank of lieutenant commander), there are implications he’ll need money to move to london to do this. He’s screenshotted me his application, which just confirms an application submitted, not a post being offered and he said he can’t disclose more for ‘issues of national security’ and that image was from 12 weeks ago, but I looked online and it says it’s a 9 months hiring process, obviously because caliber of the person needs to be seriously vetted.

Can anyone confirm that his story is bollox? He can’t be joining mi6? He also said they have a join whenever start date policy. I’m concerned this is yet another scam and each time he gets away with it and leaves me to pick up the pieces of humiliated and upset relatives who despite past knowledge fall for it every single time.

The steer from family will be to carry on as if it’s true but I’m sure this has to be a crime? And I can’t be complicit in that.

I also have real concerns about how dangerous he could be if successful in application.

OP posts:
BudrosBudrosGalli · 12/11/2021 21:25

My dear friend underwent a long and really intense vetting process. They looked into absolutely everything, including financial history, etc. For example, a while before her recruitment (she worked in the civilian section of the police) I sent her a lump sum when she had her purse stolen while on a holiday. She repaid me this amount when she got back. I was asked to corroborate/verify the reason for the money being paid to me. This is due to ensuring that there isn't any part of her life that made her susceptible to blackmail etc. This is really the only reason as to why I knew of her new job. They dig incredibly deep, so there is no way your brother would be accepted.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 21:31

This one was truly awful.....

Luckily he was jailed for life.

www.theguardian.com/uk/2005/sep/06/ukcrime

notimagain · 12/11/2021 21:32

@dad11122

Lots of people with varying degrees of mental illness say that they work for the military, MI6, SAS, etc. For the many reasons given above they clearly don't but delusional behaviour such as this can be a signpost to serious mental health problems. Good luck,
It can be, but unfortunately there are also a few who most definitely go into “Walting”, presenting themselves as former members of the less secret side of the military etc, simply for financial purposes…..doing paid/expenses paid speeches to things like expats groups, that sort of thing…straight forward fraud.

They usually get caught out/warned off when they stumble across an audience that contains somebody who was really “there”.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 21:33

Hideous consequences for victims

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/nottinghamshire/4219170.stm

user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 21:45

[quote IamtheDevilsAvocado]Hideous consequences for victims

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/nottinghamshire/4219170.stm[/quote]
You know @IamtheDevilsAvocado I’m half expecting to see his face on one of these links.

I think you’re right. I absolutely do need to document it. I think it would be wise getting it somewhere for M too on her medical records just in case he flips out at her again. She’d make excuses but at least they might look in his direction. As you said though al kept extra hush hush due to safeguarding, they should be familiar with this though.

What he really needs truthfully is a big scare, almost like a cease and desist letter or someone to ‘have a talk’ with him.

Do you think I’d need to inform all the different local police authorities (we all live in different areas)?

I know all logic says this mi6 is just the latest in a fantastic web of lies but I do need some sort of proof to show GM that he can’t BS his way out of. The screenshots from the navy fb chat worked well before. I felt awful as she was gutted, think they mi6 thing has given the glimmer of hope that her grandson is an utter turd.

OP posts:
user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 21:59

^isnt an utter turd that should say

OP posts:
WiddlinDiddlin · 12/11/2021 22:06

When I read your first post about him I really thought you might be talking about this guy...

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/walter-mitty-alan-claytons-lies-1309088

I doubt you are now but I knew the guy in the article when I was in my early teens and his pathological lying and manipulating people had begun as early as that (still in secondary school).

People like this have a way of spinning the most outrageous bullshit and until you talk it through with others, there will be that little niggling .05% of doubt in your mind, as if 'this is SO outrageous.. could it be true?'...

I dunno what the answer is, go NC with such people but then of course with no one who knows them, they are even more free to lie and manipulate others and fictionalise their lives to do so - safe in the knowledge there most probably not be anyone to contradict them because they've all cut contact or forced the person to move away.

Cocomarine · 12/11/2021 22:10

In your last post, you seemed ready to step away.
What changed?

  • he’s lying
  • he’s dangerous
  • your relatives are making their own stupid deciding to be taken in
Walk away from this shitshow.

Why the angst over what to say about what his job is when people ask?
You either laugh and say, “well, this week it’s Mi6”, or, “I don’t know” (possibly followed by, “really I don’t know - we aren’t in contact.”

PollyPepper · 12/11/2021 22:10

Have you told your family about this latest tall story so they have the heads up and don't part with anymore money when he inevitably asks?

user1473878824 · 12/11/2021 22:12

@JoanOgden

If he really has a job offer from MI6 (which I don't believe for a minute) he has already breached his terms of employment as you are not supposed to tell anyone apart from your long-term partner/spouse that you work there.
They have to be super vetted before you can tell them too. So… yeah it’s bollocks.
Cocomarine · 12/11/2021 22:16

Of course you could apply yourself.
And show your relatives.
And put him in the position of saying, “but that’s only an application” 🤣

But seriously: *Walk. Away.”

user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 22:25

@Cocomarine

In your last post, you seemed ready to step away. What changed?
  • he’s lying
  • he’s dangerous
  • your relatives are making their own stupid deciding to be taken in
Walk away from this shitshow.

Why the angst over what to say about what his job is when people ask?
You either laugh and say, “well, this week it’s Mi6”, or, “I don’t know” (possibly followed by, “really I don’t know - we aren’t in contact.”

Nothings changed @Cocomarine. I did the what I thought was sensible thing, contacted RN for ‘proof’ sent it to uncle for GM and M. M refused to believe it and accused me of all kinds of non sense and I thought well, i can only pass on the info it’s ultimately up to them if they believe it. I do feel more sympathy for GM though than M after all she’s older and just buried her son.

Since GM spoke to B and asked him about the navy thing and that’s when the mi6 thing came about, GM told me when we spoke earlier this week. Mentioned it to M and she already knew so it obviously wasn’t a moment of panic when called out or questioned by GM.

Oh I’ve not no intention of keeping up this farce, its just what my mother wants me to do ‘in honour of my dad’ and just the very idea and the expectation to do so is tedious.

OP posts:
user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 22:39

@PollyPepper

Have you told your family about this latest tall story so they have the heads up and don't part with anymore money when he inevitably asks?
M doesn’t believe me @PollyPepper when I said it sounded v implausible. She must have mentioned my doubts to B because he text me from a new number (had previously blocked him) with a screenshot of his app, called me a hateful bitch and told me to watch out. I’ve since blocked him again.

But I do think sending proof to uncle is the best way so he can have a chat with GM and maybe be explicit this is pattern of behaviour, i mean 2 fake jobs in a few months should be fairly clear? Uncle and GM aren’t aware of his previous history and violence that was all kept from them.

OP posts:
saraclara · 12/11/2021 23:00

A good friend's job was to vet people applying for intelligence jobs. He travelled the country to interview the applicants' families, friends and colleagues. The procedure is very intense and can take up to two years. Every single element of their life is checked on.

He said that people weren't expected to be perfectly squeaky clean, but they did need to be open about anything in their life that could come back to bite them. If they were, then within reason, their history didn't rule them out at all. But if they lied or tried to hide anything, it would be found and they would be immediately ruled out.

The job is intelligence. They know how to find find out his past.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 23:54

@Namechangetimes100

I would contact all the different forces... Often the computer systems don't link up.

I'd also really ram it home with their GPs (as well as yours), they need to know the stress you're living under.

The police /social services etc will be WELL USED to disclosures that are then retracted....

Just write the truth... M made a complaint as brother attacked me with x, y, z... Eg this was NFAed (no further actioned-as my mum put lots of intense pressure on me/my grandma said this as she was ashamed /whatever)... They will be well used to coercive family dynamics.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 23:57

Also include ré vulnerabilities... Like your grandma just losing your dad...

This shows the pinch points....and how he can exert power and control.

Spell it out... Something like... Naturally she doesn't want to beleove her grandson could be so duplicitous.... But this has been evidenced by x, y and z. Include anything that cna be likely proved.

user14943608381 · 13/11/2021 10:54

I think that’s a good idea.

Slight concern that with x mas coming up and this ‘new life’ in mi6 and london it’s a ‘perfect opportunity’ for B to really milk this.

Thanks all!!!

OP posts:
KittenCatcher · 13/11/2021 13:41

Even if you write to the Armed Forces police and Security Services he will just come up with another delusion. They will not provide proof that he hasn't really applied for a job as a Naval Commander in MI6. You know its absolute rubbish and he is not James Bond. You could write to your relatives gp and adult safeguarding teams to say you are concerned he will manipulate them into handing over money and that he is a threat to their safety. The first thing is to report his threats to the police.

TheSchmaus · 13/11/2021 17:51

Op, have you read the book "The Bigamist" by Mary Turner Thompson?

user14943608381 · 13/11/2021 17:56

@TheSchmaus

Op, have you read the book "The Bigamist" by Mary Turner Thompson?
Nope, not even heard of it? Is it my brothers life in a book lol?
OP posts:
medwench · 13/11/2021 18:07

Op, screenshot all the horrible texts, especially the threatening ones. Show them to your relatives. And keep them to show to the police, just in case too. I would imagine there is a record of the times the police were called too, maybe ask the police via a freedom of information request? Then start a folder of evidence. Sorry your family can't see his psychopathic behaviour.

Shimmyingmetacos · 13/11/2021 18:09

Absolutely 100% a lie - not only would he have broken his terms of employment by telling anyone aside from a partner/spouse, he would also have to go through DV which takes at least 6 months and goes into every minutae of a persons life, it’s is very intrusive and is designed to weed out anyone who is prone to lying. He wouldn’t stand a chance if he actually applied

MrsPinkCock · 13/11/2021 18:10

I know someone who worked for MI6, absolutely donkeys years ago. He told his spouse, who told me and shouldn’t have even years later I would add
Even now he absolutely point blank refuses to either confirm or deny he was in the secret service, and shuts down any conversation about it when asked.

He is ex-RAF and was recruited directly rather than applying, so I’m told. I can see it though - I’ve never met anyone quite like him. Incredibly intelligent, articulate, measured and discreet, and just has a certain demeanour about him that makes it believable.

Pinch of salt with this though. Whilst I’m 99% sure it’s true he was in the secret service (there’s certainly a gap that couldn’t easily be explained otherwise and he’s not the type to have been in prison Grin) I’m not him or his spouse so I can’t be certain.

I do, however, suspect your brother is talking utter bollocks.

Oldraver · 13/11/2021 18:11

Look you know from all the advice on your other thread that everything he says is bullshit

Why are you entertaining the idea he could actually be joining MI6 ? Surely you know deep down it's all poppycock

If you are actually bothered about vunerable relatives then you need to challenge him and keep challenging him, not looking things up onlibe etc