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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Joining mi6- this is crazy right?

238 replies

user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 16:47

So posting for traffic.

Pre warned this is crazy but I promise it’s true.

I’d posted under another nickname of brother who has a history of lying and I’m not talking little white lies I’m talking pathological as well as really frankly dangerous behaviour. Stole pension money from elderly grandmother (was her x mas money and he cut it out of her suitcase), stole 10k worth of jewellery, pushed father undergoing chemo over, held knife to mothers throat, not mentioning the amount of times he hit me 6 ways to Sunday. He was never held accountable for anything which is why I think we have this issue today.

But the previous post was an elaborate tale of him joining the navy. He told this to my very sick (and now passed away father), he bought a few Royal Navy T-shirt’s from the highstreet (pretending they were part of his training uniform), army style boots and epaulettes from god knows where to illustrate the scam. No military in the family so all a bit ignorant on this. DF unbeknownst to everyone was suffering and easily confused, he totally fell for it. Brother, mid 30s , was at the time working as a waiter (earning close to min wage, no shaming here just for income purposes) made several elaborate purchases in a year that as a minimum would have cost 50k. Father was wealthy, it is my strong suspicion that the navy was used to gain money from a v sick and vulnerable person. Reason for believing it’s a scam there was no commendation ceremony, he alleged you get epaulettes as a gesture of good will from the navy and said he was so skilled they fast tracked his application and shortened basic training and was offered an incredibly senior commanding position with 0 experience.

This was 4 months ago, brother is still working as a waiter but now is telling other vulnerable relatives (widowed mum and GM) that he’s been enrolled in mi6 as an intelligence operative as they work under authority of the navy (of which is apparently as the rank of lieutenant commander), there are implications he’ll need money to move to london to do this. He’s screenshotted me his application, which just confirms an application submitted, not a post being offered and he said he can’t disclose more for ‘issues of national security’ and that image was from 12 weeks ago, but I looked online and it says it’s a 9 months hiring process, obviously because caliber of the person needs to be seriously vetted.

Can anyone confirm that his story is bollox? He can’t be joining mi6? He also said they have a join whenever start date policy. I’m concerned this is yet another scam and each time he gets away with it and leaves me to pick up the pieces of humiliated and upset relatives who despite past knowledge fall for it every single time.

The steer from family will be to carry on as if it’s true but I’m sure this has to be a crime? And I can’t be complicit in that.

I also have real concerns about how dangerous he could be if successful in application.

OP posts:
user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 19:57

I dont intend to have any further contact with him. Not only is he unhinged and a pathological liar but it’s also exhausting. Im a very straight down the line person, with an average middle management Job in a good company, although I’d argue I’m underpaid and due a promotion (but who wouldn’t lol) I see no shame in any job, who cares if it doesn’t have the ‘wow’ factor if you do it with dignity and it makes you happy then that’s all that matters. I see no shame in being a waiter. But having to nod and smile and basically suspend reality whilst being told how insignificant you are by a fantasist Is beyond tedious.

This is what M wants to just go along with whatever he says, ie if people ask you oh how’s your brother, where’s we working now? I meant to say mi fucking 6 🙄, which when he was entry level as a lieutenant commander 3 months ago and a snr project manager 6 months ago and cyber security manager 6 months before that gets a tad ridiculous and we look like fools.

Is there any way I can get proof this mi6 thing isn’t real? M will probably believe it if he tells her he’s next in line to the throne but it’s GM and other members that I’m also worried about, just in case the common sense is explained away …

OP posts:
LadyTiredWinterBottom2 · 12/11/2021 19:58

MI6 are not under the remit of the Royal Navy. They are Crown Servants and their allegiance is to the Crown.

cabingirl · 12/11/2021 20:07

There's no way this is true.

And if it was, he wouldn't need tens of thousands to relocate to London.

If no one in your family has been interviewed by someone on behalf of your brother's application to a civil service position in the 'foreign office' then he's not been recruited. Sure, he may have filled out an application form - anyone can do that!

BelindaBumcrack · 12/11/2021 20:09

Yeah, you know it's bullshit.

This is from MI5. MI6 will be the same.

MI5/6 Vetting

HotSauceCommittee · 12/11/2021 20:10

Ha, ha. My DH was "approached" back in the dim and distant past and told people. He never heard from them again Grin

Colouringaddict · 12/11/2021 20:11

If I didn’t know better, I would say this has been written about my son. Liar and fantasist. Conned and/or stolen from everyone in the family, and didn’t even have enough respect to hide it. I slept with my purse, never left bank statements etc lying around. Learned that the hard way after he emptied my bank account paying for take away and just eat delivering up to 5 times a day at one point.

He made me ill, have had to go no contact with him now, but I still get people knocking on the door looking for him because he has conned or stolen money from them, I haven’t been able to persuade any of them to report him to the police.

Your head tells you it’s all total bull, but it’s never extreme enough to be dismissed immediately. Although this latest from your brother is pretty out there! My son’s latest scam was to tell my MIL that he had cancer and he needed money to pay for private treatment because this was a really aggressive cancer and the NHS wouldn’t be able to treat him fast enough. Gave her all kinds of excuses as to why she shouldn’t tell me, including the loss of my father. I had to make calls in front of her so she believed me, I adore her but she’s very naive.

I am ashamed and embarrassed by him. I have lost sleep and made myself really ill trying to work out where I went wrong, but the truth is, some people are born that way.

Protect yourself, if he has made threats against you, I would be reporting him. If your DM refuses to see through him, I’m afraid you can’t help her, but she can’t help him either. As a parent it’s really hard to acknowledge that one of your children is like this

notimagain · 12/11/2021 20:19

With regard to the comment in the OP about items of uniform etc, I’m pretty sure under Uk law a civilian wearing a military uniform is not doing anything illegal. However given some of the details the OP has shared it might be worth being aware that AFAIK wearing one in an attempt to make a financial gain is a criminal offense…(fraud).

And…in the RN Lt Cdr is a senior officer rank, albeit the lowest. I’d agree with the comment somebody made upthread that it might ten or so years of service, give or take, for your average junior officer to progress to that point - there’s no way this guy with his skill set as described has been “fast tracked” there so quickly so I spot what is known in some circles as a Walt.

user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 20:22

Oh gosh @Colouringaddict I’m really sorry you’ve had to go through all of that! Your first paragraph I was convinced you were my mother, but she’d never go no contact.

Even pretending to have cancer, I wouldn’t put it past him.

M like you said can’t acknowledge her golden child is like this, I’m hoping if I can get some sort of proof I can give to uncle and he can show GM and then it will be 2 scams in a very short period of time and then it will cast doubt on everything else he says.

OP posts:
MissCrowley · 12/11/2021 20:34

@ThatsNotMyReindeer absolute truth!

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 20:42

This is interesting - don't know how /if law has changed...

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/features/men-who-impersonate-military-personnel-stolen-glory-a7404526.html

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 20:43

I think other posters are riggt ré the vetting... If je was making a serious application, I'm sure the vetting would pick this up.

Given his history - are you sure he is even a graduate? It's not unknown for people to claim degrees?

Gingernaut · 12/11/2021 20:45

The first thing any applicant to the security services is told is not to tell anyone.

Have the police been involved at all?

Do any of your vulnerable relatives have power of attorney?

He is a leech and will exploit anyone regardless of who they are - although you know that already.

logsonlogsoff · 12/11/2021 20:52

Sounds like a lunatic. Even at the very first application step you are told NOT to tell anyone you have applied. Not to discuss your application. Not to discuss any part of the process with anyone who isn’t your DW/DH/DP.
So if he’s telling his nan and others then he’s already failed his application. He’s be putting his, and his family’s , lives at risk by being so chatty about it.

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 20:52

The most worrying this to me, is yours and your family's safety.

The threat I believe from him is worrying. It sounds as if he's a loose cannon.

I would do what someone has said upthread... I'd definitely contact social services, if you beleieve your mum /gran are vulnerable.

Also I'd contact HIS GP and your Mum's and DGM GP. Also include YOUR GP.

I'd head the letter something like crédible threat to personal safety (for you), incluse previous attacks, and with anyone vulnerable say... Risk of exploitation /danger to vulnerable family member.

I would do a very factual letter...including the threats and his earlier history when a child. There is quite a history there.

Am sure the GP will know what to do with this, if only keep it on their records.

Do state how it is essential that this is kept confidential unless they give you the heads up.

Any increase in risk to you would happen if your brother realises your making représentations àbout him to authorities. As je has previously - better watch out etc comment.

I'd also think seriously about speaking to the police too.

user14943608381 · 12/11/2021 20:53

@IamtheDevilsAvocado he 100% has a degree. He fibbed about the class to me (said 1st to prove a point) but he has a 2:1, he didn’t go away for Uni was through his local college but awarded by a Uni and he had a graduation and everything.

Parents were there and have pictures so that much is real. He tried to claim it was an MA for a while but the certificate says BA.

@Gingernaut police have been called on him twice to my knowledge but both have been explained away as the caller (myself on one instance) wasting police time.

No family have POA in place, but you’re spot on the man is a leech who would steal your last penny with no remorse.

I do wonder if something like that or the lies coming out caused him and his fiancé to split. Wedding was all paid for and in 6 months, bought a big house 8 months ago, brand new car, pets and then bam all over.

OP posts:
logsonlogsoff · 12/11/2021 20:53

If he really was joining that is. It’s one of the things your vetted for - can you do a job that you know you can never talk about for the most part. Not to friends, not outside your immediate family.
You have to lie to some of the closest people to you.

Sundayturtle · 12/11/2021 20:55

@BelindaBumcrack

Total bollocks. Which of course you know. There is zero chance he would ever get through Developed Vetting, which is required for the security services. I am SC cleared and that was intrusive enough. DV is a whole other ball game! They go through your entire life and history with an extremely fine tooth comb and speak to family members if they deem it appropriate. Nothing is out of bounds.

And Lieutenant Commander sounds impressive but it isn't that senior. It's equivalent to HEO grade in the Civil Service. For context, an HEO wouldn't be senior enough to be managing a high street Jobcentre. That would be somebody one grade or probably two above.

As a CS (G7) my equivalent armed forces ranks are Colonel (Army), Commander (Navy) and Group Captain (RAF). The CS does this because civilian CS are often attached to/supporting work that the armed forces are undertaking and they want to ensure that rank privileges are applied equally.

My former colleague, who was SCS had Brigadier status, which was brilliant. She was broad Glaswegian, drank like a fish and swore like a trooper. I don't think the Officer's Mess quite knew what hit them after her visit!

Not quite- the rank equivalent thing is for messing purposes. So an EO civil servant could sleep in the officer mess if needed. My husband is a Lt Commander and on around £60k - twice what a HEO earns almost.

A RN commander would be commanding a ship. A civil servant SEO would not be. The CO of our base is a an army colonel. Unfortunately a lot of civil servants have an inflated sense of worth. And I can say that as I am one. I am an HEO and I am much cheaper than a Lt Cdr Grin

Clun · 12/11/2021 21:01

@Sundayturtle

Yes, absolutely.

LinoVentura · 12/11/2021 21:01

It really bothers me too

2 thoughts:

If your family are prepared to believe he is innocent of the incidents you describe then they'll believe anything. That's their choice - and I think it is a choice.

If he assaults you again, or even commits any more criminal activities against anyone else, you really need to get the police involved.

izzylizard · 12/11/2021 21:07

Your brother sounds very unwell.

dad11122 · 12/11/2021 21:08

Lots of people with varying degrees of mental illness say that they work for the military, MI6, SAS, etc. For the many reasons given above they clearly don't but delusional behaviour such as this can be a signpost to serious mental health problems.
Good luck,

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 21:12

The more I think about it OP.

You really MUST get this documented.

You need to do a full letter.... Bullet pointed.

The police will jave a vulnerable people unit /ofr financial exploitation.

Please find these folk and speak to them

Rubyupbeat · 12/11/2021 21:15

He would not be able to disclose any information, official secrets etc....

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 12/11/2021 21:15

Here you are... The Care Act... Re police duty.

Joining mi6- this is crazy right?
Joining mi6- this is crazy right?