CM is apparently crippling him financially, and I don’t know what to do

[CMOrNoCM]

ExH sees 7yo DD 1 night a fortnight, that’s it. This is court ordered. He occasionally has her for tea if it’s a special occasion that makes him look better i.e. his birthday, her birthday (which is in the order so can’t stop him) his parents birthdays etc.

He lives in a little house about a mile from me, but has contact at his parents’ 10 miles away as he has a housemate who’s in the other bedroom – DD and he both have their own rooms at his parents.

According to the CMS he earns £180 a week so about £850 a month. He has to give me £102 a month according to CMS.

Recently he’s asked me if we can look at what he pays as he can’t afford to live. He has sent me a breakdown of his outgoings to show he “can’t afford it” and according to that he pays rent on his house and to his parents for the 2 bedrooms there (I can well believe his parents charge him rent for those rooms as when he moved out when we moved in together they had lodgers in them paying around £50pw each – they have two bathrooms so they probably had exclusive use of one of them between them).

In one breathe I feel sorry for him but in another I don’t. I work 25 hours a week and can’t work more as DD has a muscle condition and some learning needs so she struggles with childcare for long periods. Apart from that £102 I get nothing else from him. I get some UC top up but DD doesn’t qualify for DLA or anything and she needs specific things for her condition – don’t tell me to apply for DLA I’ve applied 5 times and been told every time she doesn’t qualify or require more care than any other 7yo, I’ve even been to tribunal over it and had the decision maker upheld. I also think if he lost his job and couldn’t work for awhile I’d have to suck it up and work more myself and pay for more childcare (he wouldn’t have her more). I also work more hours than him usually anyway (I earn between £250 and £300 a week on my 25 hours).

Without the CM I could manage to live, but with CM DD and I have quite a comfortable life, I don’t have to worry about her needing new shoes (£85) or having to give up her extracurricular activities.

Another part of me thinks that I have to parent 95% alone and why shouldn’t he be made to pay at least the legal minimum? I have to pay for everything for her, clothes, shoes, extra activities, as well as bills and food when she’s with me. He refuses to have her 50% of the holidays so I have higher childcare costs then too (can be as much as £100 for 3 days holiday childcare).

So WWYD? Speak with him about a reduction or just ignore?

So in theory he could sleep on the sofa and let DD sleep in his bedroom but he doesn't want to "as he likes things as they are" , therefore he prefers to pay rent to his parents for 2 bedrooms+bathroom a couple of nights a month [ will not even get there now, what GPs charge rent their son/granddaughter for 2 nights a month???] but he cannot afford that, so what is his solution?

Not to try to work a bit more ( bloody hell, even if he did a few surveys a day while watching TV, that would easily get him 50-100 quid a month, tax free money!), not to talk to his parents about NOT charging rent to see their granddaughter a couple of nights A MONTH, not to accept to sleep a couple of nights A MONTH on his sofa or on a blown-up bed so that he doesn't need to pay rent to his parents. No, his possible solution is to pay less for his daughter, when he's already paying less than 4 pounds a day???? Nope, I will NOT feel sorry for him at all, and unless he has serious health issues OP hasn't disclosed so far, she shouldn't feel sorry either.

It isn't how much you earn, OP, or how much the shoes cost (I am sure you'd buy cheaper shoes if you found cheaper shoes what would be good for your child) or how much you spend on clothes, haircuts, clubs. It is that the father of your child pays 3-4 pounds/day for his kid, and when his income looks rather tight the first thing he looks into reducing is the small amount he's paying to HER? Disgraceful, so no, no, you really shouldn't feel sorry for him and "be kind" towards him!

So in theory he could sleep on the sofa and let DD sleep in his bedroom

Query here. If exDH is living in a bachelor house, is it actually OK to have children staying overnight? From a safeguarding point of view? Drunk groups of men coming back with the housemate, lines of coke, porn etc?

I would have assumed that's a total no-no.

Seeing as you do most of the childcare there's no reason why he can't look for another job with full time hours. Don't let him reduce maintenance.

@Oftenithinkaboutit

You earn between £250-300 You get UC But that only totals £1200

I’m confused
You will get £324.84 single person allowance plus £237.08 for your one child a month. Plus CB of £140. So £710

Plus you will take home about £1100 a months

So that’s circa £1809 a month without without his contribution

I absolutely think you should insist he carries on paying

But your monthly income without his contribution is much more than £1200 a month

What is single person allowance? I'm a single parent and get no such thing, it's just working tax and child tax credits.

[ will not even get there now, what GPs charge rent their son/granddaughter for 2 nights a month???]

Just as well, as OP explains it upthread.

The GP's are not to blame for their son's lack of provision for his DD, nor should they be subsidising his feckless lifestyle.

GP's used to let rooms to lodgers.
OP's Ex doesn't want to provide accommodation suitable for a father of a visiting child to stay in, so asked his parents to let him take over the lodgers' rooms on contact dates.
GP's agreed, but obviously had to let the lodgers go in order to do that - hence losing income, which Ex has to compensate them for.

@baileys6904

85 quid for shoes???? For a 7 year old? That's more than comfortable and to be honest, I'd try and give him a break even if just temporarily. Show a bit of kindness now and it may come back in the future

Why? Does the resident parent get to just give up looking after/providing for the child? I don’t think so.

Don’t give him the chance to stop. He needs to pay for his kid, if that’s getting a better job or working more hours so be it.

@SpaceshiptoMars

So in theory he could sleep on the sofa and let DD sleep in his bedroom

Query here. If exDH is living in a bachelor house, is it actually OK to have children staying overnight? From a safeguarding point of view? Drunk groups of men coming back with the housemate, lines of coke, porn etc?

I would have assumed that's a total no-no.

Or they have an air bed in his room so dad keeps her safe? And grandparents during the day!

It’s workable if he wants it to be.

ChargingBuck fair enough, if the GP were getting an income out of those rooms and they have to give it up, yes, it does make sense. As they rent the rooms to their son for the whole month, not for the paltry 2 nights he's choosing to use them. Then if he cannot afford to keep doing it he may as well stop renting them from the parents (who can go back to having lodgers) and just pay twice a month for rooms in a hotel, it would probably be much cheaper. Or just give up his current place he also pays rent to and move with them but one or both parties might not agree with that either, who knows.

Or, if there are no safeguarding issues (and OP didn't mention them, she just said that the father likes to sleep in his own bed instead of sleeping 2 nights/month on the sofa) he could just use his own flat and sleep in the living room or on a blown up bed, while letting DD have the bed. Like a lot of other parents who live in a flatshare do.

What's crippling him financially is not earning enough!

As far as I see it his options are:

1. Give up his house and move into the room he pays for at his parents.

1. Change his job to work more hours and get paid more.

1. Sort his own finances out by cutting back on unnecessary items.

Don't reduce to cancel the payments, that's for him to pay towards his child.

Nope! Why should you feel bad when you have to shoulder the absolute lion's share of expenses anyway. He should be out there working more, regardless of what job if he claims to struggle.

Get a full time job. Tell the parents to do one. Pay his way.

If he was working full time and then some, making every sacrifice etc then maybe. But he isn't, so don't you do it.

It OP's DD needs something like Piedro shoes, £75 is at the cheap end. Not because of fashion, just because that's how it is.

No SN of ExHs I know of.

His parents charge him rent because of the loss of income due to the lodgers, they can't really say "Have a room for all but 4 days a month".

The housemate is his best friend, was the best man at our wedding, DD quite likes him and he's never said anything in front of DD that would make me think he doesn't want her over. I know during the restrictions when DD couldn't stay at her grandparents she went to ExHs house for the day and the housemate was helping her with her school work. I just think ExH can't be bothered, he wants me to stop contact I suspect.

Not that it matters but ExH took me to court then didn't turn up to one of the hearings. He says he forgot about it.

He's always been very money orientated, when we were together he'd berate me for spending £3 in greggs when we had sandwiches and bread at home - called me selfish and said I was wasting money.

I'm tempted to say he can stop paying just to see if he walks away from DD like I suspect he will, but I won't. At least not yet.

@Pazuzu

Get a full time job. Tell the parents to do one. Pay his way.

If he was working full time and then some, making every sacrifice etc then maybe. But he isn't, so don't you do it.

It OP's DD needs something like Piedro shoes, £75 is at the cheap end. Not because of fashion, just because that's how it is.

They are piedro boots and she has custom insoles as well, the NHS at least provide those, but at assessment they would only provide one or the other and the insoles are harder to get so I chose those over the boots. We're hoping by the time she's 10 she'll no longer need them.

Exh has similar figures and makes a similar complaint. He has a good degree and yet chooses to work 20 hours at NMW. It's what they do ... they'd rather be poor than give you more.

Do not let him out of paying CMS. That money is for her, so she has a better lifestyle.

Let him walk away if he wants but he continues to pay regardless.

Be glad he's your ex!

can't ex sleep in the front room and DD in his room!?

Id start with "your financial problems are not my concern."

Followed by "CM is lower than it shoukd be because you have her less than the court order."

Finishing with "you get full time childcare, bar minimum contact, for £180 a month. Try and find another mug who will do your share for less than a tenner a day."

Given your update it does sound like he's trying to take advantage of your good nature. He could make changes to his situation but why bother if he can just plead poverty and you give in? Don't do it.

Either ignore or send him breakdown of all dd expenses including holiday childcare bet half of that alone is way more than his maintenance

@Hankunamatata

Either ignore or send him breakdown of all dd expenses including holiday childcare bet half of that alone is way more than his maintenance

His maintenance just about covers 3 days in holiday club 7.45am-4.45pm but that doesn't include food, I still have to provide a packed lunch and then a hot meal when she gets home.

Why not move back in with his parents full time as he’s paying rent anyway and rent out his room in the other house to boost his income?!

Might not be what he wants to do, so the other alternative is increasing his hours or getting another job. Tell him he can choose whichever of those options he prefers or dislikes least.

I think you should really not be involved in offering solutions. Just say you aren't prepared to discuss it and its his problem to sort out. If he decides to stop contact, he would do that anyway.