Friend forward facing her 9 month old

[JimHairy]

My friend has a 9 month old DS who she has started front facing in the car. She has a Cosatto rotating car seat and her reasoning is that her son sometimes gets upset when rear facing and is a lot happier when facing forward. This is true, but from being in the car with him previously he’s not that bad in rear facing, just gets a bit frustrated and wriggly but he does settle after about 10 minutes.

She’s a great parent and also has a 7 year old. I’m a FTM so I feel really awkward giving her advice but it’s really really worrying me that her DS is unsafe in the car. This is compounded by a local incident that happened a few years ago where a child died in a head on collision due to an improperly fitted car seat. This is always in my mind.

So far, I’ve sent her the government advice sheet about car seat safety that says to rear face as long as possible and at least until 15 months but she just said that her car seat says it’s ok forward facing babies from 9 months. I didn’t argue, just said I’d seen that it wasn’t advised to forward face so early.

I feel I’ve done what I can by sending her the information and she’s now making an informed decision to forward face, even though it’s clearly very wrong. The other problem (although less so) is that she keeps telling me I should forward face my DS who’s the same age because he hates the car. I’ve said I’d rather he was safe and temporarily unhappy, but she argues that it’s cruel to make him so unhappy even for short periods and the chances of an accident are really low. I won’t be forward facing my DS and he’ll be rear facing as long as possible.

WWYD? Do I keep sending her info or just leave it now?

Her DS’s safety is not your responsibility.
It would be different if she was unknowingly doing something dangerous. But she does know what she’s doing and has chosen to, so there’s really no point sending her more resources.

I haven’t a friend with a baby a similar age to mine and we never give each other unsolicited advice (I’ve made a conscious decision not to, and I can only assume she’s done the same)

*have

Absolutely none of your business.

People follow guidance and advice about various things in different ways.

My kids were travel sick on most journeys longer than 15 minutes from a young age so I needed them to forward face so I could see what was going on. I would be highly unimpressed if someone started sending me guidance notes or dramatic videos about car seats.

You can forward face with this car seat from 9kg which a 9 month baby is very likely to weigh more than.

She's not breaking the law, she's not going against the manufacture instructions. Nobody's business but hers.

Neither of us are interfering in anything.

Jesus wept it’s like half the commenters here have never had an honest conversation with a good friend. I feel really bloody sorry for you if you’d feel like someone you love giving you help and advice is ‘interfering’. I’ve known her 15 years, she can give me all the advice she like and I’ll gladly receive it in the spirit it’s meant - to be supportive and genuinely help. She understands as well as I do that some I’ll take and some I won’t - the same way she’s not taken my advice about car seat safety. The reason for checking here was mainly to make sure it wasn’t an issue I needed to push harder based on how unsafe it really is - turns out most people don’t feel it’s something I need to worry about as much as I am, so I’ll take that on board and not worry anymore.

Honestly. The risk in the UK of head of collisions is incredibly low. It's an even lower risk that a young child be in the vehicle and it be at a high enough speed to internally decapitate a child in a properly secured forward facing seat.

The reality is we can all make a bigger difference to car safety by making fewer car journeys and doing them at lower speed, than by focussing on the difference between forward & rear facing seats.

Also OP, not your child. Butt out.

You need to agree to disagree with each other.

Car seat guidance has changed so much in the last few years, if she has an older child it will be quite different to what she did with that child.

Both my kids were forward facing at 9 months - our car seats were legal and safe for that. Would I do the same now, probably not, but there will be lots who would.

You need to just stop talking to her about it.

Is she having to drive your screaming DS? Maybe that’s why she’s asking you to move him round. Or if you are the one driving, does she think that your ability to concentrate is being compromised?

The Rf/FF thing is touchy here On mn because people don't like that it's safer. No idea how massive these kids that can't RF are as even I can almost fit in my kids' minikids lol

@Rosesareyellow

There’s loads of things we do differently. She weaned at 4 months, I weaned at 6. I have a jumperoo, she thinks they’re dangerous and bad for development. I feed DS a mix of purée and finger food, she sticks to purée only. The kids are very very different so there’s loads of stuff I do that she doesn’t and vice versa.

If you didn’t care about these things then they wouldn’t even register with you. This sounds like an exhausting friendship - you’re both just judging each other and keeping tabs on parenting choices at all times, or at least you are even if you’re not admitting it to yourself. If your parenting styles are that different this friendship won’t last into the toddler years.
She will have her reasons for forward facing her child and she will know the risks. That is her call to make. Going on about it further is out of line in my opinion - you’re trying to sugar coat it but you are essentially just calling her a shit parent who endangers her child.

That’s really, really unkind.

This is good to know! I’m hoping DS has the same attitude, I’d like him rear facing until 4 ideally but he’s a high centile so doubt we’ll get that far!

Well the advice is to rear face until four, some say 5 or 6 and centiles don’t really come in to it… but it’s ok, you pick and choose rules for your self while judging others

There’s loads of things we do differently. She weaned at 4 months, I weaned at 6. I have a jumperoo, she thinks they’re dangerous and bad for development. I feed DS a mix of purée and finger food, she sticks to purée only

The fact you have even noticed this stuff means you're massively overinvested in her parenting and need to back away.

This stuff may all seem wildly important while your kids are tiny, but once they're a bit bigger you probably won't even remember at what age you started forward facing your own children, let alone what anyone else did. Suggest you calm down, let her parent how she wants to parent, and maintain the friendship (if you want to) so you're still friends even when car seats and weaning aren't on the agenda any more.
And ffs, don't send her information again - that's beyond patronising. If someone did that to me, I'd think that a) they think I couldn't read or research myself, and b) they think I'm a bad parent. Am surprised she took it with good grace tbh.

The guidance has changed over the years. When my older teen DCs were young the guidance was forward from 9 months or 20lbs. Both mine survived!
It’s a risk, but we all followed that guidance at the time.,
Tbh I’d not say anything- not really any of your business unless you’re driving the car.

@JimHairy you sound like two mums who have shared the first months of their baby growing and on the brisk of being toddlers.
There is nothing surprising at what you have been sharing. It sounds like the normal chat I’ve had with other mothers at that stage.

You also seem to appreciate each other very much and able to accept you dint do things the same way. That’s great.

Re the car seat, it seems that SHE has brought the issue a few times. And each time, you sent her some links.
I think that’s the most you can do and I’d be tempted to leave it at that. If she was continuing to bring the fact she is happy with the forward facing ‘out of the blue’, I’d be tempted to ask her why she thinks it’s such an i important issue. Not in a nasty way but I’m sure she isn’t doing that with the finger food etc…. So I’d be wondering if there is another reason why she keeps talking about it iyswim

@JustDanceAddict

The guidance has changed over the years. When my older teen DCs were young the guidance was forward from 9 months or 20lbs. Both mine survived! It’s a risk, but we all followed that guidance at the time., Tbh I’d not say anything- not really any of your business unless you’re driving the car.

I agree there.

I think it’s something you feel even more when you have two dcs quite far apart. There is always a part of yourself that wonders why something that was ok before and didn’t do any harm to your child is suddenly not ok at all.
Weaning at 4 or 6 months was one of them for me.

In the UK the only advice is to rear face until 15 months in an iSize seat. I dont know anyone who has kept a child rear facing for longer than that

@TheYearOfSmallThings

In real life, I see most kids in forward facing seats

Me too. 99% of them. I am always fascinated by this reality gap, because on Mumsnet everyone rear faces their children until 4 or 5 (at least). In real life I don't know anyone who does after about 1 year, and the child is being awkwardly shoehorned in by that stage.

Same here.

I don't know anyone who rear-faces their child in real life!

Some advice I’ve taken, some I haven’t.

So same for her then?

I do agree with you about the car seat like I said though.

This is an area where the advice has changed in the last 10 years - both my kids forward faced from about 10 months (my eldest is 10 and it was the norm then; her younger brother is 7 and inherited her car seat and though rear facing was becoming more popular, many people still had forward facing seats). Your friend probably had a forward facing seat for her eldest and so it feels fine to her to do the same for her younger child, whereas if it’s your first child and you’re looking at the current safety advice, it’ll be overwhelmingly in favour of rear facing. Obviously both my kids survived, but progress is a good thing and it’s good you’re doing the best for your baby. I wouldn’t push it with her though - everyone makes different parenting choices and weighs risks differently.

I cant believe that you sent her the government advice sheet after she already said she was happy with her choice.

That's such a sanctimonious thing to do.

I also can't believe you're keeping a score sheet of things you did vs things she did.

It doesn't sound like much of a friendship to me tbh.

We went longer than anyone else I know irl as ours were happy enough until almost four. As a pp said though, we don't drive that much. DH does drive to work a couple of days a week, but obviously the kids don't go with him. And we don't drive like idiots. I think focusing on rear facing as the only way of keeping your dc safe in the car might actually be a psychological pacifier for anxious parents.

That said, we did rear face, but plenty of parents we know didn't even get to a year. Never really spoke about it. Some of these parents are doctors and police officers. You'd think fairly au fait with anatomy and car accidents. Anyway, their babies are all 6+ now and fine, but I know that isn't necessarily the point.

@CatsOperatingInGangs

It’s none of your business. Leave her be or it’ll ruin your friendship.

Why do we all have this Not your kid Not your problem attitude?

That is a real human being who deserves to be safe.

Not all threats are imminent, sometimes they're about risk assessment, and in this instance the mum is wrong!

I'd rather lose a friendship and know that someone was kept safe and well than risk rocking the boat and then find out they lost their baby in a RTA.

I literally couldn’t get worked up about this

@JustDanceAddict

The guidance has changed over the years. When my older teen DCs were young the guidance was forward from 9 months or 20lbs. Both mine survived! It’s a risk, but we all followed that guidance at the time., Tbh I’d not say anything- not really any of your business unless you’re driving the car.

Just because your children survived doesn't mean that it's best practice or that every child with the same set up as your children survived. When I was a child we'd sometime have four or five children on the back seat (no car seats), sometimes with two children secured by the same seatbelt. Everyone survived but it wasn't safe and I don't doubt that other families weren't as lucky as ours.

I'd rather lose a friendship and know that someone was kept safe and well than risk rocking the boat and then find out they lost their baby in a RTA.

But where would you personally draw the line? At what point is another person's child NOT your business? Would you approach a stranger putting their baby into a forward facing seat in a carpark? If not, why not? That baby is "a person who deserves to be safe".

And of all the babies wo tragically die in RTAs in the UK, how many were as a direct result of them being forward facing? It isn't as if forward facing = instant death is it? So how far would someone like you go to keep all babies safe? Do you approach parents who haven't strapped their baby in to their pushchair properly? What if you see a child riding a scooter to school who you personally think is a bit too little to be on one? Or how about when you see an overweight child? Do you make it your business to check what they're eating?