Lying to someone on their deathbed?

[Nc4post99]

What’s everyone’s take on lying to someone on their death bed? As a general principle and then in this specific incident listed below.

My personal view is it’s wrong, but what about the pretence to make the dying person happy? I still feel this is wrong and shows a lack of respect for the dying person and there are many other ways to leave a loved one with fond memories than a lie.

Person in question lies to a family member on their death bed about gaining a snr military position straight out the gate, bought from eBay the kit to sell the lie. Person In question did not know the family member would die, it v much came out of the blue. Now the family member has passed, the person in question is maintaining the lie and wearing the uniform etc.

Person in question has a history of being a pathological liar and weaving these sort of intricate tales to vulnerable elderly family members and financially gaining due how how ‘proud’ they were of him. I’m talking in the £000s, cars bought etc not a £5/£10 here and there.

Ask to see his MOD90
Ask him what his BFT is.
Ask him about JPA
Ask him for his BFPO number.
That'll get him flapping.

Can you laugh him out of this? When he turns up in uniform, say "Hi, Walter Mitty!" and when he talks about how he is helping with counter-terrorism say "Yeah, sure you are" and change the subject? Or ask when they changed the uniform, it seems strange that no-one else of his supposed rank is wearing what he is.

@2Two

Can you laugh him out of this? When he turns up in uniform, say "Hi, Walter Mitty!" and when he talks about how he is helping with counter-terrorism say "Yeah, sure you are" and change the subject? Or ask when they changed the uniform, it seems strange that no-one else of his supposed rank is wearing what he is.

Problem is I don’t see him enough to actively call him out. I live v far away from my immediate family, he lives about 20 mins.

It’s largely used as an excuse for not helping the elderly relatives (who’s money he’s taking/ being given) refused to help with funeral arrangements due to ‘top secret military training’ couldn’t attend certain funeral dates due to an intensive military training course (that turned out to be a music festival he had tickets for). Unable to visit my recently widowed mother because he’s training in Plymouth(?) and needs cash for a hotel because the navy aren’t paying.

I’ve gently questioned the things that don’t add up, and more lies come. He is very good at telling lies and thinking quickly. That’s why he could probably bla for BS the jpa or bfpo as he knows the family are none the wiser.

He has a very long history or lying and stealing and scamming money or expensive items of jewellery from vulnerable members of the family. An eternity ring lost from my mother’s safe looked a lot like one he gave his ex GF for instance, never any hard proof and he was always given the benefit of the doubt. This is where I get concerned, one of the extended family members has dementia as well x

@AdmiralCain

On My Dad's deathbed I told him every and I mean EVERY little shitty I'd ever done, every secret, every immoral thing. I cried my eyes out, I wasn't after forgiveness and I wasn't trying to disappoint him by making out he'd done a bad job and raised me wrong. I just couldn't let him go, he was my best friend and I had to tell him the truth as that's how he raised me. It takes a special kind of scum to lie to someone on their deathbed.

That was incredibly cruel and selfish of you.

I'm assuming his seamanship is next to zero op.

This is all very bizarre.

Honestly, when hearing of his doings I would call it out. ‘He isn’t in service, he bought his uniform on the internet’. ‘He doesn’t have any training or missions, he just wants your money without having to see you’

@knittingaddict

I'm assuming his seamanship is next to zero op.

This is all very bizarre.

Correct. Literally 0 and he’s saying that due to exceptional test scores he’s been fast tracked to a commanding lieutenant position.

There’s also the question of his fiancé, is she in on it? They both want a v expensive 200 guest wedding this summer. The location is luxe, v beautiful and my mother has told me he’d tried to get her to give money for it (she has £5k but felt no more as a big wedding is a huge commitment financially speaking and it shouldn’t just fall on her and my father to clear out their savings for retirement) his reasoning was that his fiancé had already bought her own dress and this made my family look bad, so they should cough up the £20k for the wedding. Does the fiancé know and they were both working to extort my vulnerable and ill father? Or is she in for a nasty surprise? I don’t know, surely she’d know it’s bollox, right?

You should turn up to the wedding in full Royal Navy dress uniform, as the rank of Admiral.

You have my sympathy. It may be that fiancee has to believe him otherwise she will end up losing faith in everything. Are you able to talk to her? Something along the lines of 'You know it is all a lie dont you?'.

What he is doing is quite nasty. I would worry for her safety if he got caught out.

My DB has slight Walt tendencies. Thankfully never for financial gain just to elevate himself in what he perceives as other people's estimation. DB is deeply disappointed that he didnt go to public school or join the army. However, if you didnt know better you would think that he had done both those things. Never direct claims, just the way he speaks about things he has done.

I worry for her safety in many other way @GnomeDePlume, he was horrifically violent growing up, mainly to myself but he had held a knife to my mother’s throat and pushed my v v frail father too. When I say growing up, I mean well into his 20s when he finally left the parental home. He also went to attack me at the hospital visiting my father, squared up to 5 months pregnant me, ripped off his gloves, cracked his knuckles and put his hand around my throat and the booted me in the leg. One nurse or hca spoke to me after if the police needed to be called. I’d hope he’d changed and grown out of his bullying and aggressive ways but he hasn’t. I fear for her long term physical safety.

I fear for her financial safety as they bought a very expensive house on mortgage and now he quit his initial job in a computer shop and works odd shifts in restaurants, as this navy career is bs she could easily be expecting that hefty salary to pay the bills..: but as it’s fiction it won’t.
And then as you said, if it comes out and there are legal consequences. It’s just dire.
Also if he extorts her family too

Was he ever reported to the police for the violence against you and your parents?

If it was going to let someone die happy, or at least not worried or agitated, I’d do it in a heartbeat.

I’d compare the ‘love lies’ told to someone with dementia, who keeps asking where their long-dead spouse is. Some people actually say you should always tell them the truth, even if they’re going to be terribly upset and cry - only to forget and ask again soon afterwards.

To me that is wanton cruelty.

In The Forsyte Saga, Soames tells his dying father, who’d been so anxious for him to have an heir, that his wife had just given birth to a boy, when it was actually a girl.

@elephantstrong

Was he ever reported to the police for the violence against you and your parents?

At points yes, but no charges were ever pressed to protect him. He benefited from a single parent household so was able to play one parent against the other (father was resident abroad due to work) Same for the thefts (we’re talking tens of thousands taken over the course of many years in credit card fraud, jewellery stolen, pension and x mas money)

Sounds like he has never had any consequences for his behaviour, so hard to know what is hard wired personality disorder territory and what is a childish self centred ness that has been enabled around him so he feels utterly entitled to bully and abuse to get what he wants.

I'd keep a safe distance and protect yourself as much as possible. Previous violence is the greatest indicator of future violence.

You’ve hit the nail on the head @elephantstrong. I’d never confront him 1:1 out of fear but I do fear he’s going to exploit vulnerable family members (more so than he already has) and truthfully I think given time he will become physically abusive to his future wife and future children. Let alone the potential legal implications of all of this

This guy sounds like a nut job and someone that needs to be investigated for fraud at the very least.

JPA is our administration HR system that controls pay leave etc.... He would know what this is, he has to use it for military admin.

In fact I have a great way to weed him out. Given elderly relatives etc. Is there a family WhatsApp group or similar?

Id just say that you are concerned you won't be able to get a hold of him given his "very important job" but coincidentally a friends husband who is military has told you the military emergency compassionate procedure but you need his service number and current unit name and address for the compassionate cell to be able to contact him.

If he gives you a service number, PM me.

I am avidly threadwatching now for @CombatBarbie's tactical operations, that's genius. It would be a public service for this guy's army-larping to be exposed. Perhaps then he might get the psychological investigation he clearly needs.

This is such a weird thread to conflate a fairly random chat about white lies, with a really serious family situation.

I would tell all family members that his tales are utter bullshit. Including his fiancée.

Then I’d not want to hear another word about it from them.

And I’d call the police if he touched me, ever. (I have a violent brother)

@CombatBarbie

This guy sounds like a nut job and someone that needs to be investigated for fraud at the very least.

JPA is our administration HR system that controls pay leave etc.... He would know what this is, he has to use it for military admin.

In fact I have a great way to weed him out. Given elderly relatives etc. Is there a family WhatsApp group or similar?

Id just say that you are concerned you won't be able to get a hold of him given his "very important job" but coincidentally a friends husband who is military has told you the military emergency compassionate procedure but you need his service number and current unit name and address for the compassionate cell to be able to contact him.

If he gives you a service number, PM me.

This is a great idea @CombatBarbie, if you don’t mind I’ll actually come back to you on this via PM with what he says, I’ll give it a few days as the work incident just happened and I’ve already gently warned my two remaining immediate family members (the work colleague pretty much gave me concrete proof that it was a lie too, v mortifying to be pulled up at work like that but I digress) I don’t want to look like a dog with a bone or a hater which is how he will spin it. Do you mind if it reach back out in a few weeks via PM? X

@Cocomarine

This is such a weird thread to conflate a fairly random chat about white lies, with a really serious family situation.

I would tell all family members that his tales are utter bullshit. Including his fiancée.

Then I’d not want to hear another word about it from them.

And I’d call the police if he touched me, ever. (I have a violent brother)

@Cocomarine no real conflation of white lies (dog is fine/ i love cake with nuts etc) to protect someone’s feelings. You know when I was drafting the post those didn’t enter my mind as in the same league of lies, i was more referring to out and out lies like I’ve just won the lottery or I’m an astronaut or hey I’m a lieutenant commander in the Royal Navy.

I genuinely wanted to know if people would consider the latter acceptable to tell someone on their death bed or when gravely ill, under the pretence of making the proud. Although as is apparent from the thread this lie was started before my father was admitted to the ITU and I have some real concerns of the sinister motivations behind the lies.

Sorry, I wasn’t meaning to sound critical of the thread - just commenting that it was weird to read through white lies interspersed with the nasty shit show that is your brother.

But that never was a death bed lie to make someone proud.

• at the time you didn’t know it was a deathbed (and I’m sorry for your loss)
• you know full well your brother was never lying for someone else’s good feeling

Like I said, I’d tell all family what he’s doing, even at the risk of not being believed and falling out with them. If any of them were specifically vulnerable, I’d contact social services. Then I’d walk away from his shit.

@AdmiralCain

On My Dad's deathbed I told him every and I mean EVERY little shitty I'd ever done, every secret, every immoral thing. I cried my eyes out, I wasn't after forgiveness and I wasn't trying to disappoint him by making out he'd done a bad job and raised me wrong. I just couldn't let him go, he was my best friend and I had to tell him the truth as that's how he raised me. It takes a special kind of scum to lie to someone on their deathbed.

What did you hope to achieve with this? Seems you've just off loaded your guilt

More than welcome OP, just tag me here as I use the app so don't get notified of messages.

I spent 20 years working in the MOD, much if it working at one of the military colleges where they do officer training. I was a civil servant. And this chap sounds like he's lying his head off.

Well impersonating military personnel is illegal for starters......