Different to touch a mans pecs to a woman's breasts?

[imamearcat]

Did anyone see the thing where a woman touched 'Gastons' chest at Disney land?

I got into a bit of an argument on Facebook about it with people saying it was the same as a man touching someone's breasts. I just don't think it's the same at all. Not saying it's right, but not the same.

AIBU?

In my opinion once you start adding caveats and sliding scales to unwanted physical/sexual contact you play right into the hands of apologists. Because no matter what happens to you , it will never be "that bad".

Some men don't realise that being a tit isn't the same as having tits. Poor loves.

DdraigGoch

Haven't seen it but have idly wondered how things would turn out if women started patting men's bums, telling them to cheer up, talking at their crotch and telling them they're too handsome and need a nice woman to look after them. Whilst catcalling "look at the arse on that".

Id never advocate any of this behaviour but im intrigued by the social side of what would happen if loads of women did it.

@RealBecca

Haven't seen it but have idly wondered how things would turn out if women started patting men's bums, telling them to cheer up, talking at their crotch and telling them they're too handsome and need a nice woman to look after them. Whilst catcalling "look at the arse on that".

Id never advocate any of this behaviour but im intrigued by the social side of what would happen if loads of women did it.

I presume even more violence against women and "she asked for it".

I seriously doubt it would be the social revolution and lightbulb moment that one would expect.

@RealBecca

Haven't seen it but have idly wondered how things would turn out if women started patting men's bums, telling them to cheer up, talking at their crotch and telling them they're too handsome and need a nice woman to look after them. Whilst catcalling "look at the arse on that".

Id never advocate any of this behaviour but im intrigued by the social side of what would happen if loads of women did it.

Are there men patting women's bums? or is this just a thing from your imagination, perhaps a memory from decades ago? There was a post earlier about a woman concerned that he looked at what she was looking at when shopping for underwear.....i think you might be fighting a fight from a long time ago

If women went around doing to men what they do to us in pub club etc. I imagine mainly it would be hand grabbed and women pushed away. Told to fuck off. Something more serious and painful done back. That sort of thing.

The differences in expectations around male/female behaviour, the different level of risk of serious sexual assault, and the fact that men are generally more bigger, stronger than us.

Makes it, irrespective of those saying there's no difference, different.

And a race to the bottom is a rubbish idea.

The level of sexual entitlement, the expectation that women and girls jolly them along rather than making a fuss. The aggression that often comes if we don't.

Plus the fact that it's often painful. Or you can't get away easily. There's a domination aspect often.

And I'm sure many know that smug smile when one does something and knows there will be no comeback.

I’m so glad he told her off, she properly laid her hands on his breast tissue. There’s no joke about it, OP, don’t normalise this behaviour, regardless of whether a man or woman does it.

The first time I was assaulted was by a random student touching my breast as a 12 yo, I don’t think it’s right that anyone, male or female, be subjected to that.

@Zugs

Are there men patting women's bums? or is this just a thing from your imagination, perhaps a memory from decades ago? There was a post earlier about a woman concerned that he looked at what she was looking at when shopping for underwear.....i think you might be fighting a fight from a long time ago

Yes, there are still men patting women’s bums, as many women who have been on the Tube, a bar etc, can attest to.

The level of sexual entitlement, the expectation that women and girls jolly them along rather than making a fuss. The aggression that often comes if we don't.

Plus the fact that it's often painful. Or you can't get away easily. There's a domination aspect often.

And I'm sure many know that smug smile when one does something and knows there will be no comeback.

I do agree with this too. As I get older, the aggression is turning from ‘sexual’ to just plain hate for being in their ‘space’, like a footpath.

I do become a screaming banshee when confronted with these men. And when I get home I feel annoyed at myself for not saying more,

I've never heard of a bum pat.

From me and friends experiences and reading here surely it's-

Fondle
Squeeze way too hard
Try and rub over area where anus/ vagina are.
Pinch way too hard
Slap way too hard
...?

I think of a pat on the bum as affectionate and done with people you know well.. like to a kid or partner.

Or a man to a woman in an old carry on film. And she goes off annoyed. And sid James and his mates laugh...

?!

Mountbatten saying something often makes it worse IME

@NiceGerbil

Mountbatten saying something often makes it worse IME

It does, but I feel much better in myself when I’ve given them both barrels. Why should they get away with it, I often think. I never expect anyone to intervene on my behalf, so always feel it’s up to me to shout and make a ‘fuss’.

[quote mountbattenbergcake]@Zugs

Are there men patting women's bums? or is this just a thing from your imagination, perhaps a memory from decades ago? There was a post earlier about a woman concerned that he looked at what she was looking at when shopping for underwear.....i think you might be fighting a fight from a long time ago

Yes, there are still men patting women’s bums, as many women who have been on the Tube, a bar etc, can attest to.[/quote]
I'm no spring chicken to be fair but have never seen or experienced this behaviour in public for decades. There are cameras everywhere in London (more cameras than people) - if someone assaulted me while on the tube I'd be straight to the police. I just don't see why in this day and age anyone would put up with this - trendy bars/clubs etc i don't know - i can see how some people might try that in confined difficult to see places. I've seen more public male sexual assaults when out with the girls!

@Zugs the tube itself (mostly) doesn’t have cameras and some men do take advantage of that in rush hour.

I now would go to the police but didn’t feel able to when younger.

there are 15, 500 cameras in London's underground network.

I travel on the tube most days at rush hour, have done for 15 years - never seen anything like this.

I'm sure you understand though. That just because you personally have never seen (or had) a bloke touch, grope, grab bum or boobs, on the tube or in any pub or club etc ever etc.

Doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Right?

@Zugs

there are 15, 500 cameras in London's underground network.

I travel on the tube most days at rush hour, have done for 15 years - never seen anything like this.

Yes but not on the actual trains.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-47722878

Are you seriously saying because you haven’t seen it, it doesn’t happen?

You’re not meant to see it, it’s furtive groping dine under the radar.

*done

‘A woman who was sexually assaulted on the London Underground is calling for CCTV cameras to be installed on all Tube trains.
The 23-year-old was grabbed around the waist by a man on a Central Line train on 19 March.
Almost one in four sex assaults on the Tube network happen on the Central Line. Unlike most other lines its trains do not have CCTV cameras.
Transport for London (TfL) accepted the lack of CCTV was "an issue".
Sarah - not her real name - was in a busy carriage on her way to work in Oxford Circus when she felt what she thought was a bag brushing against her.
"I then got grabbed on the waist. The guy behind me was evidently brushing an erection against me," she said.
"I was absolutely petrified. I couldn't move, I was frozen."

When she spoke to a member of British Transport Police (BTP), he told her it was unlikely the man would be caught.
"He said to me 'This kind of thing happens regularly. It's because there's no CCTV on the train that they think they can chance it'," Sarah said.
"Why is there no CCTV on the trains, when they're obviously aware this is a regular occurrence?"

"When it's busy, it's very difficult to identify the people as well as the nature of the actions, so what is more valuable is the CCTV in the Tube stations themselves."

TfL plans to fit Central Line trains with cameras by 2023.
It said Piccadilly Line trains should get cameras "in the 2020s" but there are no current plans to put them on Bakerloo Line trains.’

Yes she's not seen it so it doesn't happen.

I assume she's googled transport police stats, tfl info about it. Seen the tfl campaign couple years back.

And discarded them as... Dunno. Propaganda? Really pretty rare/ trivial. Dunno.

Something else maybe. Interested to find out!

Mountbatten prob no point.

Incidentally I have first hand experience of the police reaction to an incident.

The ideas that cameras = doesn't happen

It must be nice to be so naive!

Exactly, NiceGerbil, I was just about to quote TFL sexual assault stats to her but what’s the point?

@zugs

I travel on the tube most days at rush hour, have done for 15 years - never seen anything like this.

That’s weird because on the thread about the woman being woken up by her husband at 5am for a clean shirt, you said you’ve been a SAHM mum for years.