To think bus drivers should manage the behaviour of teenagers on their bus?

[user64323]

I get the bus to and from school with my reception age child. I am really struggling with how to cope with the awful behaviour of teenagers from the school next door to my son's. For the record, this is a public bus, and not a school bus.

Today as usual there were no empty double seats, and my son was wobbly trying to hold on to the bar so I asked a teenage girl if she could please move her leg off the seat next to her so he could sit down. She moved it slightly but refused to move her knee off it, as she was talking to her friends in the seats behind. She then went on and on about how she was going to fucking batter the stupid fucking bitch etc on and on and on. A girl on the other side of the aisle kept kicking the back of my leg. As soon as a seat became available further up I moved my son into it to try and get away from the swearing. Unfortunately this was right next to a group of younger teens about age 13 who were very roughly play fighting, swiping each others legs, smacking each other over the head, hitting with bags, kicking etc eventually when one was grabbing another in the aisle by the ankles trying to knock him backwards I asked them to please stop, because if he falls back he is going to land on my son. They stopped for maybe a minute and then just carried on.

Then one boy huffed very loudly behind me, apparently because his stop was approaching. Then he did the same to the people in front and started swearing about needing to get off. I told him to try saying excuse me, and people might move for him. A few more pushed passed me. Then approaching our stop a boy probably about 16 or 17 and 6ft tall shoved me out the way very roughly by my shoulder followed by 'scuse' and nearly knocked me off my feet, I confronted him and told him I was also getting off at this stop and if he'd said excuse me I could have told him and there is no need to push me. Then my son who no longer had anything to hold on to fell over into the fighting kids while the boy who shoved me was screaming 'Who the fuck are you talking to? who the fuck do you think you are! I fucking said excuse me you stupid cow' etc I left the bus very shaken up and queried the driver about the fighting kids and asked why they hadn't been asked to leave the bus, and he said there was nothing they could do about it because they have a duty of care to minors. I said, so they could do anything they want? He said yes, I ended up crying, I was just full of frustration and shock from being shoved, and now I don't think I can ever get on the bus again because they know they can do whatever they want and they saw me so upset and probably revelled in it.

What about a duty of care to other passengers? If this was a school bus service I would understand, but this is a public route. The buses on the route are every half hour so they wouldn't be left stranded if they behaved enough to be asked to leave. Surely a bus driver isn't in loco parentis? I will be getting in touch with the bus company to find out if this is right, but if it is, I don't feel safe to take the bus anymore. If adults fought or shoved they'd be done for assault, so how is this allowed?

There is a very small minority of other pupils who take this bus who hate it too, they will offer a seat or ask others to say excuse me when they shove and they look absolutely miserable, there should be a duty of care to them too.

AIBU to think that teenagers shouldn't be able to run riot on public buses, and bus drivers should have a duty of care to other passengers to keep them under control or kick them off?

This makes me really sad. I don’t generally expect a bus driver to be responsible for the behaviour of people on the bus but I do think the teens behaved disgustingly and I’d be really upset in your position too. I left a park once because some teens decided to start throwing things over my 3 year olds head and blocking all of the equipment. I haven’t been back to the park and my son is 8. Definitely contact the school and the bus company for CCTV, the school then should be able to identify the little shit.

Pretty sure there is a clue in the job title of the bus driver.

Ask the bus company for the CCTV as soon as you can, before it's recorded over.
You can't ask for CCTV! They cannot give that to you.

Complain to the school, they will deal with it.
You can also record them on your phone and pass that to the school.

In civilised countries they have school buses for this reason.

However, you complain that things would be different if they were adults, yet you are treating them differently too. As well as contacting the school you should report the assault to the police and the CCTV from the bus can be used in evidence. Teenagers are not above the law.

I know bus drivers. They make a whopping £10.50 an hour, unpaid breaks, work crappy hours, starting from 4 or 5 am on earlies lates finish around midnight. Lots of pressure to get the bus round on time. Formal warnings if a customer, or their Mum complains, even if they were acting up. They can not win, try complaining to the school.

Bus driving is a tough job, but everyone has unpaid breaks.

Agree with all the others advising to talk to both the school and the police. Even without the physical contact, you were threatened, which is assault.

It's not the driver's responsibility: he has to drive, not manage behaviour.

But there are others in these kids' lives who can take steps to manage their behaviour and you need to let those others know.

I'm sorry you had such a horrible experience. Post pubertal teens are the same size and have the same strength as adults. It's intimidating when they act aggressive.

The school will definitely want to know though and to be able to do something about it so please speak to them.

Report to the school. The driver is bound by various rules and cant do much.

YANBU to feel upset but it's not the responsibility of the bus driver to keep the kids under control and he can hardly throw the lot off even if he wants to, because there are so many of them and some of them are the size of adults.

Make an appointment with the school head and complain. Push for action and if they don't take it seriously enough report to the police. Meanwhile ask your son's school if they can grant permission for your son to begin school later, so you can take the later bus to avoid these hooligans. If they refuse write to your MP and your local education authority, and consider keeping your son off school until things improve.

@MissMaple82

Just a regular school bus by the sounds of it! Could just get a later or earlier bus. Problem solved.

And what if that's the only bus?

They're not there to tell kids off - can you imagine how that would work?

My dad used to provide buses for school bus runs. His drivers were told, if the kids misbehave, stop the bus and tell the kids the bus won’t move until they sit down and behave. And that’s what they did. Solved the problem every time because the other kids would then get involved and gang up on the trouble makers.

I know bus drivers. They make a whopping £10.50 an hour

Our local bus company pays 12.50 per hour.

You can just imagine the fuss the parents would make if a bus driver tried to put schoolchildren off a bus. They’d be sad-facing all over the local papers and calling for boycotts of the bus company and accusing the driver of assault. Whichever poor bus driver gets that poisonous shift probably gets out of bed with a feeling of dread.

What about a duty of care to other passengers?

There is some confusion about what the "duty of care" is. It is your duty to make sure that your passengers are safe, and that they don't get injured or killed on your bus. It's your duty of care to drive safely.

It isn't your "duty" to care for the passengers' well being, or to control the behaviour of obnoxious teenagers. I know it's awful when you have to put up with such horrible behaviour, but the poor driver has enough to do with driving a huge vehicle safely .

I didn't read all of the OP as it got tedious.

Call the school on Monday, speak to the head or deputy head.

Nothing to do with the driver. Poor guy/girl is just trying to do their job!

That sounds awful - but I think it's hard work for a driver to drive safely and try to control the passengers.

I agree with reporting to school & they can speak to them.

You've had a snapshot of dealing with teenagers - it doesn't sound like you will be training as a teacher?

A colleague used to be a bus driver. She described the school routes (on public buses) as the worst - the behaviour's as bad as the late night buses, but on the school routes there are also other passengers who expect the driver to parent 50 teenagers at the same time as driving a 10 tonne vehicle.

YANBU to expect teenagers to behave, but YABU to expect the driver to manage it. As PP have said, a complaint to their school is likely to be more effective.

@BoredZelda

They're not there to tell kids off - can you imagine how that would work?

My dad used to provide buses for school bus runs. His drivers were told, if the kids misbehave, stop the bus and tell the kids the bus won’t move until they sit down and behave. And that’s what they did. Solved the problem every time because the other kids would then get involved and gang up on the trouble makers.

I know a driver who used to do that. He'd pull over and get out his paper and sit there reading until they'd all sat down.

But, he was ex-army, and the sort of person you'd cross the road to avoid after nightfall to look at. In reality he was every so sweet and gentle, but he didn't look like it.

I get your frustration and YANBU I'm not wanting yourself or your son around that.

However, it isn't the bus drivers fault. Kids like that are unlikely to listen to being told to get off by the driver, it's likely going to end up with them starting on the driver and starting a fight (I've seen this happen on our local bus). The drivers are in a difficult position

@icedcoffees the OP states that there are buses every half hour

I'm one who voted yabu, the teens behaved appallingly and I'd be embarrassed if they were mine but the question was about the driver and no I don't think he could have done anything. Bad language and play fighting aren't really reasons the throw kids of the bus and the other incidents were kids pushing past when they were getting off.

Problem is teenagers nowadays they can get away with everything... this is a huge problem, they steal, touch you, you can’t touch them as they have too many rights. I work in retail and we constantly have them coming in taunting and stealing and 2 girls even attacked a collegue, 6 months ago and still nothings been done.
I remember years ago when I used to finish work there was a group of teenage girls who always got on my bus, I was only 18 at the time so they weren't much younger. There was a particular gobby one who would always give the driver hassle, everytime it was about something different. One day she was being particularly annoying and held the bus up for 10 minutes, I had some where to be so I piped up and told her to either pay or get off the bus, people have places to be and don’t have time for your bullshit, leave the driver alone before I come over and make you, she squares up to me, I told her go one then little girl, see what happens. She started kissing her teeth and finally sat down, the bus started clapping me. Usually I mind my own. The bus driver thanked me and said there literally nothing he can do, the police wouldn’t do nothing. After that whenever she got on the bus she would see me and just got on no issues.

Report it to the school but the driver is unlikely to be able to help. Tbh this situation sounds eerily similar to how it is in the area I live in (NW). The behaviour of the general public is disgusting and I'm ashamed of the area I live in because of the general attitude of people around here. The police can't sort the antisocial behaviour because it's too widespread. It's going to hell in a hand basket. It's pathetic and angers me immensely but there's not much I can challenge being a very short single female parent with a child in hand without retaliation.

Definitely report to the school. We had a similar issue with kids from my sons school messing about in the local shop. The principal called an assembly and ran riot on the whole school, they were representing the school, letting down their parents, giving teenagers a bad name, anymore complaints and the privilege of being able to go to the shop on break would be revoked. The shop never had another incident. I know its different when it's public transport, but maybe the school could get the CCTV and contact parents regarding the behaviour.

Some schools have connections with local police and bus companies.
If there are problems then cctv is checked and child can and have been suspended from school/ given warnings from the police/ been made to pay damages