Appropriate punishment?

[SheABitSpicyToday]

Caught my 7 year old last night up watching her iPad at gone 11. She had snuck downstairs and got it out of the cabinet and took it upstairs to her bedroom. This, ontop of losing her camera she got for a birthday a month ago and not being remotely remourseful about it plus her attitude in general at the minute, we’ve decided no more screen time for the next week until her bedroom has been tidied and her camera has been found. It’s definitely in there somewhere, it hasnt left the house.

She just seems to have no respect for her stuff at all. We told her if she carries on like this then we won’t bother getTing her anything nice for Christmas as she will just lose it. She just shrugged and said ok.

She never used to be like this! We’ve said from now on she can go to bed and it’s lights straight off until she can show us sue can behave. Is this effective for her age?

What an overreaction. You'll end up ramping up punishments so much that you'll give her nowhere to go - and then you really will have problems.

She's 7. Just tell her if she does this again she'll be in trouble and will lose it. Just tell her off? Does nobody do this anymore?

I'd just remove the iPad in future at a time that I felt was right and keep it in my room. I don't get the camera thing either really. Just spend half an hour with her looking for it?

You seem to want to punish for what I'd consider very minor issues

Thw thing with punishments is that they engender this attitude of don’t give a fuck

Why care about anything if it’s just going to be used as leverage against you?

My best friends now adult kid used to be like this.

I remember her saying to me she was thinking of giving her pocket money again just so she would have something to take off her for being naughty

I remember thinking at the time something wasn’t right but I didn’t have the strategies I have now with my own to advise her

Positive reinforcement is more effective than punishment.

It’s your job to set them up to win

By all means hide the iPad after bedtime but taking her birthday presents away because your mad is about power and control not discipline

So her punishments are

Losing screen time for a week (including her switch)
Possibly no Christmas
Lights straight out

I wonder if she's pushing boundaries before the baby gets here to "prove" that you'll still love her.

Why punish her for having the ipad "after hours" when you are partly to blame for not making sure it was out of reach?

I find the majority attitude on this thread that a week of no screen time is some barbaric punishment absolutely baffling. Clearly I am a horrible parent because my dc get zero screen time in the week (and are much happier and nicer to be around for it).

To me sneaking the iPad late at night is something I would be very cross about and disappointed in dc for doing (as they know that would not be allowed) so restricting access to the iPad with a new code etc seems a sensible strategy as she has shown, for whatever reason, she isn’t able to regulate iPad use herself. Therefore as a parent you can put strategies in place to help her with this.

Threatening no Christmas presents etc, no that’s ridiculous and also Christmas is months away. Don’t do that.

Your dd’s life is about to change enormously with a new sibling, that is quite possibly the reason for some of her attitude / behaviour and she will need lots of reassurance that she is still your baby too. I would have a discussion with my 7yo (at a calm moment when we could spend proper time together) about the behaviour I’d noticed and whether dc could explain how they were feeling, where they thought it was coming from, what they needed etc (note what they need not what they want). Behaviour is communication after all and often our dc need our help to understand that and regulate the way they communicate their needs to us.

She's 7. 7 year olds don't have a huge sense of what's expensive or valuable to adults. If the camera is so important to you then there should be a special place for it and she should always put it back in that special place, and until it becomes a habit you'll need to check that it gets put there after she uses it. But really you need to ask yourself, is it her toy or yours? And think about whether she wouldn't really prefer cheaper presents that aren't such a source of contention.

I can't imagine leaving a 7 year old to tody their own bedroom once it gets in a state. If you want it tidied then get a cup of tea and sit there with her while she goes through it and puts things away, and talk to her about where things go. Having your attention and company is a huge motivator to do something.

"Stuff" is probably a lot less valuable to her than your time and attention. And that's how it should be.

She never used to be like this! We’ve said from now on she can go to bed and it’s lights straight off until she can show us sue can behave. Is this effective for her age?

No, it's not effective for any age. Apart from the things other poeple have said, it's too vague. You know what "show us you can behave" and "carry on like this" means to you, but she doesn't. You know what "attitude" is, she doesn't. Instead you need to plan specific consequences for specific bits of good and bad behaviour, small rewards that she can earn easilty along with praise and compliments for getting it right, and small punishments that you can repeat easily. And a lot of annoying behaviours that come under the heading of "attitude" mainly need to be ignored. Spend your energy instead on noticing and making a fuss over any odd bits of good behaviour.

As for the iPad, I would just remove temptation. Put it somewhere at night where she can't get at it and be sympathetic but firm that she can't have it.

OP, you sound very wound up about this. I can see why - but you're in for a very, very bumpy ride when your daughter as a teenager if you are already going down this route with her when she's 7.

Explain why you are cross/disappointed, and explain the consequence. Then don't bang on about it or start ramping up the consequences when your daughter professes not to care. Just follow through, and move on.

On a slightly different note, she does sound a bit spoilt (having to sort out her bedroom before her birthday to make room for the new stuff coming her way? Really?) It will be a big leap for her to go from being a rather spoilt only child for seven years to being a 'big sister'. Could some of her behaviour be related to this? And what's the context? Is the baby a full sibling or a half sibling? These things can all have an effect on children's behaviour.

The camera will turn up somewhere in the house, in a weird place. I would leave it at that, and change the password on her ipad. She shouldn't have unrestricted access to it anyway.

@ProfSprout is spot on with behaviour is communication

@QforCucumber I went to bed the same time as she did as I’m 32 weeks pregnant and exhausted and ill. My husband heard her giggling when he got home from work and found her on the iPad.

I can’t believe the posters suggesting that a single day without the iPad is a sufficient punishment!! I’m not a strict parent by any means, but I’d be taking the iPad away for a week minimum. A child who sneaks downstairs like that has an iPad addiction, and a single day away from it isn’t
Going to help. She needs to go cold turkey to break that addiction!

"Going on a camera hunt" seems like a fun (and useful) activity to me. It may not even be in her room.

Children need positive attention.

As pointed out "until you behave" is very vague. If you cannot tell her clearly what the goal is, then there is no goal. It means that she (and you) doesn't know when the punishment is supposed to end. How is she supposed to "win back" normal bed times? Is she supposed to be a perfect child?
It's one of the worst attempts at discipline that you can try.

Punishments should be short, immediate, and for clear actions.
Just have a quick tell off, short punishment, an apology, and move on.
Tell her you understand why she did it (so many adults do it - stay up late on their gadgets) and why it's not a good idea - not that it's a random rule made up by you.

Another pp mentioned not allowing screen time during the week. It's a different thing when it's a rule or when it's punishment. A week long is not bad because it's barbaric, but simply because it's too long for her age (and for the action itself).

A child who sneaks downstairs like that has an iPad addiction

Sorry, but LOL. A little OTT there.
It's not as if the OP told us she had been caught every day this week.

If the kid has an iPad addiction, and I do think sneaking down and watching it till late would suggest it is, there needs to be something more constructive than a punishment, taking it away for a week and then handing it back.

She needs some help building better habits, building better routines than sitting on it for hours in the afternoon and also some help to fill in the time to substitute for this default pass time.

She is seven. This needs fixing but that isn't going to be achieved by sticking it in a box for a day or a week and consoling yourself with doling out the right amount of punishment.

I’m quite a relaxed parent and never punish my dcs but I’d be taking that iPad away for the foreseeable future as it has become a problem.
Time to help your dc away from prioritising they iPad even above sleep and start seeing the difference.

I’m not worried about her ability to tidy her room at the age of 7. By 7 I was doing chores around the whole house. She’s always managed to keep her room tidy and like I said, it’s not even that messy she just shoved things in drawers and while I’ve had a small look for the camera I haven’t seen it anywhere. And no it’s not my toy, what a ridiculous accusation. It’s very much gets in just annoyed that she so desperately wanted it and had been asking for It for almost a year and she’s managed to lose it in the space of a few weeks.

And the iPad thing was just outright naughty. She knows not to get out of bed unless she needs me or to go to the toilet or get a drink. She took the headphones sos that the noise wouldn’t wake me. It was very sneaky and there’s no way I’m letting that go without consequences.

It's not the punishment which is the issue, it's the breakdown in mutual respect. The OP's DD is just shrugging her shoulders and saying 'ok' at punishments rather than being upset and genuinely remorseful. This is (understandably) goading to the OP, who then ups the ante (no Christmas presents etc.) to try to get a response. This boxes them into an unhealthy cycle of conflict which might better be resolved by a cuddle and a chat.

GoodForTheSoul, how ridiculous; you keep telling yourself that the punishments are what produce the compliant 'good' children but it is sadly a load of rubbish. I have a 14 year old and he is in top group for most things, laid back, kind and deals with people with respect, he is anything but entitled and brattish and will most certainly be able to handle the 'real world', my 10 year old DD is similar, in fact parents say to me all of the time how they love having her over as she is so easy going and polite. I never use punishments, never have and never will!

Sadly for you and your like minded folk that want to believe this false nanny 911 narrative!

My DD confessed to sneaking down to get her phone in the middle of the night, she’s 10 and very curious about what happens after she goes to bed. Looking at parental controls she’s been on it for around 90 mins in the early hours of the morning.

We had a “laugh” about how much fun it was to stay up late being naughty, I took her phone for the day but honestly her being tired on a day when she had school, tutoring and 2 hours of gymnastics was enough of a consequence, especially when I wouldn’t let her drop anything from her day because she was tired. They will learn through natural consequences - DD had such a long, tired day and straight to bed after gymnastics, she’s told me it wasn’t worth it.

I think you need to separate the iPad at night from the lost camera - combining the two together will just confuse her.

Yes a week with no tech is appropriate.

Wonder how many of us adults on here are addicted to our phones or Mumsnet!

I suspect she's pushing boundaries due to your pregnancy.

@SheABitSpicyToday

The iPad does have a code, she knows it.

She has a Polaroid camera because that’s what she wanted for Her birthday.

We have a switch because she’s not the only person in the house who enjoys gaming.

I’m not here for judgement by the old “kids only need crayons and a muddy puddle” brigade thanks.

If she knows the code, then change the code…

She's just gone back to school and doing a normal thing by pushing the boundaries.
I'd just ban for a couple of days and talk about the impact of a late night (she'll probably be feeling it!)

Oh dear. I think threatening her with no Christmas presents is horrible. Christmas is 3 months away. Why is it her responsibility to find the camera? 7 is too young to have such expensive gifts and sole responsibility for them.