Body buried wrong way round

[keepsgettingworse]

Not using normal name for this, as I've posted a lot about the two deceased and don't want it to be linked in case of future action. MNHQ have access to my past threads.

My very close relative died suddenly last year (not parent). They were fairly young. Their family had them buried in a double plot...all fine.

A couple of months ago another very close relative died (may be parent). They were buried in same grave.

At the time a few of us thought the second coffin went in the wrong way round, but all of us were too uncomfortable to speak up. Plus it was a bit of a disaster as we'd rushed up to yhe graveside, as the the hearse drove straight past us in the carpark, where we were waiting (last year the hearse stopped, family pallbearers carried the coffin and we walked behind).

When we arrived at the grave the coffin was already out!!!

We've been thinking about it and it's not right.

How can we put a headstone up when it will be at one person's feet?

It also means that peopke will be walking continuously over relative's head. We can't mark the grave, as it is in the part that only allows headstones.

It is a total fuck up!

We hsve a complication. When challenged the FD claims that the NOK ordered the body to be placed the wrong way. This can't be true as I was involved. Yes, the FD phoned NOK the day before, but said he would speak to them before the funeral. Then drove straight past us.

We never met this FD before the day, and they didn't introduce themselves. We arranged it with another, but he was off that day.

What would you do?

OP, in the kindest way, is it possible that your grief is making you fixate your energy and anger on something tangible? Make a complaint to the FD if you feel it will help you, but a lot of people would be more upset by disturbing a grave, than a coffin facing the wrong way. It’s personal choice

@keepsgettingworse

So if you went to your lived one's grave and it was vandslised you wouldn't care?

I happen to think this is a pretty big thing,. Aren't all funeral ceremonies for the living? The FD fucked up and lied about a little old lady, I'm angry.

This is a really odd comment op. Nothing has been vandalised. Are you after compensation? Do you want your relative digging up and turning around? What do you want?

You do know that the headstone isn't actually "on" the grave, it's placed on the solid ground above it.
That means whenever you stand in front of it to arrange your flowers, you're actually standing on the grave. You'd have to stand about 7 feet away to avoid the actual grave itself.
I only found this out when discussing a headstone for my dad - and decided to have an extra wide one as the ground was quite unstable.

Oh, and my Grandmother was "double deckered" on top of my Grandfather. His coffin had collapsed, as he'd been in there for about 40yrs, so they'd had to level it off before burying her.

I would do nothing, and I honestly don't see what the issue is.

Op I think you should say something and get it fixed.

The people saying oh its just a body blah blah,that is someone's much loved family member you are talking about. How would you like it if someone referred to your deceased parents like that??!!

I think your main issue has to be how the funeral director didn't communicate properly. If the PP is correct in saying it's down to COVID rules, that should have been explained to the NOK prior to the funeral. I don't think you'd be unreasonable to say that you felt communication was poor.

As PP said, the not stopping is likely a Covid thing. Don't think they've done anything wrong there.

If you want the coffin turning then ask

@keepsgettingworse

No the NOK didn't ask them to go ahead, she is frail and disabled. The FD already had the coffin out before we arrived. NOK was out of breath and distressed.

It's the lying that upsets me the most.

But NOK may not have asked them to stop at the entrance. If they normally go straight to the grave, they won't stop at the entrance unless asked. Sounds like they weren't asked.

And again, the NOK can confirm they didn't ask for that burial to be the other way round. So go back to the FD and tell them that

I can understand why the lying about the situation is so upsetting, I would want to deal with that too and have an acknowledgement of that and an apology.

@Helenluvsrob

Vicars are traditionally buried feet at head end. So that when they rise on the day of judgment they are facing the people they minister to , in full vestments.

Unless that’s your faith / the faith of the deceased then who cares ?

That’s lovely and I’d never heard that.

OP
I’m so sorry. It matters to you, and that’s what’s important. I hope you can find some peace around it. Most faiths don’t believe the person is ‘there’ in the body wherever or however it’s buried. But it’s obviously blocking you from getting closure so do what you have to do but know that at the moment it’s blocking you from grieving. Whatever the resolution your loved ones will still be dead.

You are obviously very distressed about the whole thing..........can you ask for a meeting with the original contact at the funeral directors and the next of kin to discuss what happened and how to resolve the issues?
They must have some sort of complaints procedure.

I understand your feelings OP. My MIL's funeral turned into a farce because of an incompetent funeral director and it is awful. In our case they hadn't checked the size of the grave with the size of the coffin and the hole was too small. Watching them on their hands and knees trying to scrape soil out to make it fit was so undignified, really awful - the lady in charge of the cemetery had to tell them to stop in case they made the grave collapse. MIL's body had to go back to the funeral directors and we had to come back two weeks later for another burial, but this time instead of the full gathering of friends and family that were at the first one there was only my DH, me and DH's best friend, so only 3 people present at her burial. These things do leave a kind of trauma imo. It's so undiginifed for the deceased and upsetting for relatives.

I'm so sorry about what happened at your daughter's burial - that is shocking.

I'm with the NOK now. They couldn't deal with the arrangements so I know what was agreed.

We are about to go up there.

Thank you for those saying complain that's all we want. To acknowledge they made a mistake and clear mum's (NOK) name.

The bypassing walking behind coffin is NOT related to Covid. Last year we were in lockdown and did it. This year there were no restrictions.

Members of the team asked why coffin was wring way round, FD blamed mum. That's what we're upset about.

We were told it would be same as last year.

I would write a letter asking them to remedy this within say 30 days.
If this doesn’t happen I’d go straight to the papers.
It’s the quickest easiest way to get it fixed rather than a drawn out court proceedings.
You could set up a go fund me to raise the costs yourselves of having your loved one exhumed and turned around.
I work in PR, and for what it’s worth the papers would love this as they’re anti funeral directors at the moment - which is a shame as I also work in that industry and can honestly say 99% of funeral directors are amazing.
I’m so sorry this has happened and yes you have every right to be upset

Persective OP. I get a feeling that there is more to this tale.

What do you want from this? Exhumation and reburial? Compensation from the FD?

If you are not NOK and had no say in the arrangements there is little you can do. If you are, is it worth it, because the person is buried beneath the ground, they are dead, they won't know, nor will anyone else and it seems unnecessary to disturb the grave. You would need permissions to do anything I reckon anyway.

I don't understand why a gravestone cannot be erected either, who will know now what lies beneath and in what direction?

I hope you are OK, I am guessing a sibling passed on and their NOK did not involve you directly in the arrangements. Been there done that, but I left it up to them and remember my relative with great fondness. I could be wrong about that though, but overall it seems that your reaction is way ott. Let them rest in peace.

I am sorry for your losses, but agree with others that you need to be clear about how you want the FD to fix this. If this was a burial in a churchyard, the church is unlikely to consent to the coffin being disinterred and reburied.

I'm sorry but I really don't see the issue here. The people in the grave won't know, or care, about where the headstone is in relation to them. All that is in that grave are their outer shells, which they no longer require. For your own peace of mind I think you should let it go.

If it matters to you, it matter. Simple as that. Can you phone the regulatory body for advice (NAFD)?

You're going to need permission to exhume the grave if you want the coffin turned around.
And it depends what condition the coffin is in - if it was MDF faced with a veneer, it might not be that sound even now.

You need to think about what you want done.
If all concerned want it to be corrected, then you should ask that it is corrected to your satisfaction. It's irrelevant whether others would have a (very theoretical) issue with it. It's not something that has happened to me or I have ever thought about. But yes, it might bother me if it were me.
Separately, you feel that the funeral director is lying and has suggested that the relative asked for it.
That will never be proved one way or the other. Are people asked routinely? Would it only have been discussed if the relative had bought it up? Either way, you cannot prove this.
Ask the next of kin what they want to do. And do that.

F

OP I feel with and for you and I honour your respect for the dead who ony have us to defend them .
The true mark of a civilised person, and of a civilised society

If you get nowhere with the FD there will b e a professional organisation he will be a member of. Maybe the CAB will now or it will be on the FD.s details.

I would definitely contact them with your very real and valid concerns. As there are carefully laid down standards of care and respect for the deceased and their families.

And thank you for caring.

Thank you all. I haven't grieved at all yet.

We will complain (don't want him exhumed). But the FD was horrible, made us hurry and now, when confronted by colleagues, is lying that we specified it. It may not be a big problem, but he made a mistake and is blaming us, that needs addressing, as it would with sny other mistake and lying.

How did it happen that the coffin was the wrong way round? Surely it's very unusual to have the feet at the headstone end? Is the FD saying that the NOK made this strange request during planning?

I understand why you're upset, lots of thought goes into planning funerals and you want to feel you got what you asked for.