To think that men have turned into neanderthals?

[Sparklfairy]

I've lived in my city for three years, never had any trouble. In the last few weeks I've had a weird guy follow me and give me his number, witnessed a sexual assault, kicked some drunk guy out of the pub myself and had another bloke follow me around saying he wanted to have sex with me.

WTF is going on? I genuinely think that men's 'standards' have dropped and they're now regressing to animals

I think it’s a product of openly pervy, predatory men being rewarded by society. Trump and Boris Johnson are both awful misogynists, but they rose to the top via popular vote.

As with Brexit, once a seeming ‘alpha’ starts saying previously unsayable stuff, there’s nothing to stop the less socially adept from speaking their dark shit either.

And porn.

@KikoLemons

I think there's been more bad behaviour generally. The fabric of society is more fragile. No-one gives a shit what anyone thinks and they don't have to regulate behaviour to remain part of a group. We can find our own groups online - people who agree that we are 100% right and justified.

Sadly I don't see that changing any time soon.

☝️this

@BrozTito

People become very extreme and lose all other perspectives over one single issue, then follow it to hell with its scummy friends. See brexit, trump, trans stuff. It generates rage.

Yep

@Samcro

all men??

The very first post! Good going for the NAMALT defence.

OP, I agree there seems to be something in the air. It seems to me feminism had made some progress, as for a time, people expressing openly antediluvian, sexist attitudes and hatred toward women were strictly frowned upon. As recently as the past five years ago open misogyny was again de rigueur, and the kinds of hateful views expressed in the likes of the manosphere became common currency.

About this time I found myself the victim of sexual harassment and stalking in my workplace. It wasn't taken at all seriously: society would prefer to rugsweep this and take the stance that women are obviously lying. Again, it's a stance fueled by a deep-seated hatred of women.

I have various theories as to why the above is the case.

Lots of men basically want:

• a sex object; and

• a maid; and

• a mum; and

• someone who will stroke their ego (looks pretty, laughs at their jokes, tells them they're amazing).

They don't want an equal partner.

That’s really quite rude to Neanderthals

Porn and lockdown. Lockdown and porn. The one fed the other, if you go by the stats for porn consumption.
It even bubbled to the top for real lives here on MN.
Does anyone remember the thread about a male co-worker reaching across the lunch table to wipe an (allergy?) tear from the OP's face? Such white-collar gallantry.
Except (1) he then remarked about coming in her face and (2) this was when masking and social distance were new.

During lockdown, saw lot of Tiktoks by f**kboys, (wannabe-player teens with cowpat-head hairstyles) referring to what girls were going to 'get' when lockdown was relaxed.
I remember one which utilised the mentos challenge with a 2ltr coke.

And yes, feel sorry for the Neanderthal compare. This out and proud lechery, and the mainstreaming of kink (I add) exists side by side with public and private institutions giving lip-service to equality and anti-harassment. Weird times.

[quote ChocolateChipBelvitaSoftBake]@Naunet

Your right, it is not OK. Yes, you are allowed to complain about it and yes, I can also give my views on it, even if you don't like it and it differs from the views of the OP.
We all have experienced stuff like this in different ways and these differences will mean that we will have different perspectives on it. By discussing these different perspectives you can get a bigger picture of what is going on and understand the problem better. Each persons view is just as valid as the next its just seen through different eyes.[/quote]
I disagree, I don’t see how saying Not All Men or Women Are Bad Too, helps anyone but these creepy men.

Oh is that why young scallies all have haircuts like Henry V atm, Throwaway?

Forgot to add. Much if their behaviour is hidden in DMs . These men are often family men, devoted to their partners and generally large parts of the group. I am not beautiful, I've tried to call it out and have been told I am making it up, it was a joke, ostracised. Now, I no longer bother trying to be involved in anything online.

@Grimacingfrog - I would remove myself from them but I never ripped them a new one nor did I ever tell their partners/wives. I should have done and I certainly would now.

I do agree with @IceLace100 - men don’t want to be challenged, they can’t handle it. They just want us to serve their needs and fulfill our roles.

I’ve spent my whole life literally running around after the men in my life. I am so done with them and their bs.

I currently live with my ex (separated, financial constraints etc.) we get on grand but my god when I think about the shite I put up with over the years, his life was more important than everyone’s in the house, his job, his hobbies blah blah blah. He now actually has to get the finger out and get his shit together and he’s exhausted from it! I don’t pander to his every need, I have a bed all to myself, I look after myself, I’ve a fab relationship with my kids, great friends and I know even still he cannot bear the fact that I don’t “need” him anymore. I’m free. I will never be in another relationship again. They are not worth it. Rant over!!

I do think a lot of it is due to the internet which has been exacerbated during the lockdowns, people getting fixated on things, falling down rabbit holes partly due to COVID stress.

In ancient times the local weirdo was pretty much isolated and shunned, put in the stocks maybe. Now he has a whole echo chamber of voices backing him up on some dodgy corner of the internet / and we are witnessing the results.

I don't what the answer is. I feel like we've opened Pandora's box.

Good point re Pandora’s box.

Perhaps the internet truly IS that box. Opened up with all the perversions and worst of mankind on view to all at any time. Sad.

Most certainly. I have noticed this recently myself. It’s horrific

Men are lost Are they hell! They're really not that sensitive.

And anyway, what the hell have they got to be lost about?

They're just as entitled and predatory as they ever were.

Literally every single one of my DH's friends have tried it on in some way, shape or form. My friend's partners have done the same. Their sense of entitlement is astounding to me. They all come across as "family men" totally devoted to their wives.
Are they fuck.

Nothing's changed from when I worked in the city (London) in the 70s.

All the men trying it on with every, usually much younger, woman they encountered: young women in the office, every pretty waitress in their lunchtime eatery, every pretty barmaid in the pubs they drank in after work before getting the tube or train home to the wives and children.

It was amazing that they ever got any work done.

Their propositioning was wrapped up in charm and a level of suavity but it was no different from the bloke on the building site that catcalls and whistles at every passing female.

They all think they're entitled.

You know the fat old men who look at young women and announce to their friends 'Phaw, I would'? Well in their heads they think that they could.

Nothing's changed. It's just that you're yet another generation of women experiencing the same old thing that generations of women have experienced before you.

*Quote from pp starting Literally every singled one of my DH's friends should have been in bold

I don’t think this is new. At age 50 there was so much wolf whistling, grabbing bottoms, shouting at women when I was younger.

I do think it’s generally a bit better now ‘on the whole’.

But I do think after opening up some people are being more giddy and vocal and we have forgotten how quiet it was during most of the lockdowns - less drinking in public more in private etc.

Not all men no, there has always been the uncultured, the aggressive, the rude and those who think nothing of abusing people. There are also women who behave in similar ways. What is probably happening is that you are noticing these behaviours more rather than there being any increase.

More on the “lost” men….

It’s always very interesting to see men interacting with other men in their own environments. All the grumpy old man ‘elf’n’safety’ stuff in the pub stuff is just for show - even the oldest ones really snap to it when other men tell them what to do or they fear looking like dinosaurs in front of other men. Transfer all your work onto Zoom in three days? Completely reorganise the company structure? Introduce some new pet piece of software that everyone has to use? They literally cannot adapt fast enough. (Especially if they want to impress more senior or junior Alpha men - they are competing to show who can be more flexible, adaptable and up to date).

Change all the institutional roles and professional titles? Hell yes boss right away (especially if this involves improving their roles and downgrading other people’s “expectations”). You will not believe how fast men can do this when they want.

You can’t reorganise do much as a minor bit of a workflow in my institution without some man instantly popping up to “explain” the “new roles and expectations” to you.

Yet we are meant to believe that for the last sixty years women have increasingly been asking not to be treated as service workers and support humans, and the poor dears just feel so lost, they can’t get their heads around it? Pull the other one!

One of my mum’s friends has a son aged 27 and is always taking about “how difficult he finds it adjusting to men’s changing social roles” because his girlfriend has a full time job. His mum has always worked! He was born in the 90s not the fucking fifties! What a load of old enabling cobblers.

They’ve all adapted very quickly to porn culture somehow, haven’t they….?

Also, I don’t think saying ‘men this’ or ‘all men that’ is very helpful or fair.

All men are not horrible!

It would be horrible to see a thread where ‘all women’ this or that existed too.

It would be horrible to see a thread where 'all women' this or that existed too.

Well they're out there, in plenty, if you just Google it.

[quote FMSucks]@Grimacingfrog - I would remove myself from them but I never ripped them a new one nor did I ever tell their partners/wives. I should have done and I certainly would now.

I do agree with @IceLace100 - men don’t want to be challenged, they can’t handle it. They just want us to serve their needs and fulfill our roles.

I’ve spent my whole life literally running around after the men in my life. I am so done with them and their bs.

I currently live with my ex (separated, financial constraints etc.) we get on grand but my god when I think about the shite I put up with over the years, his life was more important than everyone’s in the house, his job, his hobbies blah blah blah. He now actually has to get the finger out and get his shit together and he’s exhausted from it! I don’t pander to his every need, I have a bed all to myself, I look after myself, I’ve a fab relationship with my kids, great friends and I know even still he cannot bear the fact that I don’t “need” him anymore. I’m free. I will never be in another relationship again. They are not worth it. Rant over!! [/quote]
Hahaha I could have written this post myself @FMSucks apart from the being separated (possibly my bad).

It's not really funny though. But hell that bit about their job and their hobbies and their lives all being more important, that really resonated.

How did you get him to agree to separate while staying in the house?

This guys take on it all is good...

Wrong photo...

No, it's not all men, and it certainly transcends class.

However, I can't lie about my observations, what I have witnessed in working class circles is pretty fucking weird. It's like a celebration of stupidity and a wholesale rejection of progressive evolution.

Ive been staying in a shitty town since covid to help a family member out, my entire life here is loud, farting cars, smashed glass, mountains of dog shit and gangs of pissed up human wreckage. Most of them have enormous, pretty savage dogs which are left in a tiny yard 24-7.
Nobody challenges it, it's like some sort of apathy.

During the euros this year a lot of local shops (what's left of them) were smashed up, there has also been a large increase in speeding in residential streets, in farted up Mazda's or fucking quad bikes. The town center is a dereliction, only frequented by hopeless addicts and the odd person puking into a gutter. It isn't unusual to see drunken young men staggering through the streets with open wounds.

There are likely many contributing factors here, but the issue is largely a male one. It has become far worse since covid, and the load rags and FB pages are awash with racist, thuggish tripe, trump support and a complete denial of covid.

My own home town isn't the same, no, and there are issues everywhere, but ive never seen anything like this. The sheer amount of visible aggression is pretty mind-blowing. It's there when you leave the front door, it's on the roads, outside dog people's houses and in the supermarkets. I see nothing like this where I usually live, so I do think there is a tribe, or class component.
Is it some sort of wholesale disenfranchisement?
Or is it something nobody is willing to challenge?