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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that men have turned into neanderthals?

189 replies

Sparklfairy · 05/09/2021 07:45

I've lived in my city for three years, never had any trouble. In the last few weeks I've had a weird guy follow me and give me his number, witnessed a sexual assault, kicked some drunk guy out of the pub myself and had another bloke follow me around saying he wanted to have sex with me.

WTF is going on? I genuinely think that men's 'standards' have dropped and they're now regressing to animals Sad

OP posts:
TheDistortion · 05/09/2021 10:32

I was on a train last night and one man (whose every other word was fuck and cunt) was loudly proclaiming how he fucked his girlfriend when she was asleep and how women were only good for spreading their legs and being fucked. His girlfriend was with him. He was 40. He was obviously drunk but doesn’t excuse it. He had latched on to a 20 year old and a 16 year old (brothers) and while they were not saying the same they were laughing and telling him he was great. (I know all their ages because they were bellowing for the entire journey).
I have taken night trains all my life and never heard misogyny like it. I know it goes on and lots of men talk like that but it is not something I have heard myself before.

Lessthanaballpark · 05/09/2021 10:32

Wtf they send you porn? Expecting what exactly?

The same thing that men expect when they catcall women on the street. The same thing the builder I used to walk past expected when they would yell at me to suck his dick.

It’s just indiscriminate ejaculation into the wild.

TheDistortion · 05/09/2021 10:32

When I say about night trains I mean trains with drunk people on!

BrozTito · 05/09/2021 10:33

Somebody told me on here men actually believe some porn like 'street encounters' are real and try it themselves, is this part of it? (realise i sound like the perv troll)

BrozTito · 05/09/2021 10:34

Sorry for the naive questions but being a weirdly socialised unfeminine gay type this is all new ground for me

TatoAndBeans · 05/09/2021 10:44

@KikoLemons

I think there's been more bad behaviour generally. The fabric of society is more fragile. No-one gives a shit what anyone thinks and they don't have to regulate behaviour to remain part of a group. We can find our own groups online - people who agree that we are 100% right and justified.

Sadly I don't see that changing any time soon.

This is a really good point. If you behaved badly 20 years ago, your local community/neighbours/witnesses etc would likely pull you up on it. If you told your friends you’d been following a woman, it’s likely there be at least one who would tell you that’s a shitty thing to do. Nowadays people’s community is online and there’ll be a Reddit or 4chan group of friends egging you on. I guess the loss of real world friends over lockdown has accelerated it.

It’s worrying. Maybe I’m over-sensitive, but it feels as if there’s a lot of aggression increasingly close to the surface in the UK now. Even seemingly innocuous interactions seem to end up with some very intimidating behaviour. More road rage, more abuse of shop staff etc. We’ve lost our sense of community and the caveman threat of being ostracised.

Downunderduchess · 05/09/2021 10:45

@PearlyRising Exactly what I was thinking!!

Mumoblue · 05/09/2021 10:47

It does seem like these days many men expect you to be their personal sex object, their mother or both depending on their mood.
And people are surprised that I don’t want to date!

thepeopleversuswork · 05/09/2021 10:48

I think this behaviour has always been quite close to the surface for a fair amount of men. I have seen these sorts of behaviours over 40+ years.

I think recently though for a variety of reasons, Brexit and COVID key among them, the fabric that holds us together as a society has become weaker

People no longer feel an obligation towards their community (as others have pointed out) as it’s easier to find their “tribe” online and this exacerbates more extreme positions.

I suppose for men of certain demographics the rising empowerment of women and their growing autonomy had been harder to take than others.

So what you are seeing probably applies across the board but unpleasant male behaviour is the lens through which you see it.

MoiraNotRuby · 05/09/2021 10:49

Behaviour has got worse recently, I've encountered much more sexism and racism this summer. Really depressing

Starbucksbasic123 · 05/09/2021 10:53

@lannistunut

I think all behaviour issues have escalated due to the pandemic stress, so there will be more violence, assault, bad behaviour, sexist behaviour, anger... everything Sad
Agreed!
Elieza · 05/09/2021 10:54

Lockdown has affected the horny misogynistic males chances of picking up a drunk burd in a pub for sex. Or visiting a local lady of the night waiting in her usual street. So he’s not had as much sex and is stressed meaning he likes sex to relax and unwind, it’s a vicious circle.

So he started watching porn. Lots and lots of misogynistic porn. As he was locked down (and perhaps furloughed if he was working). Confirming his belief that women are all hoars and good for sex only and that we are secretly even hornier than they are and totally up for it all the time with anyone. Strangers up alleys. Anything. We are all totally ready and waiting from us being children to us being pensioners. All horny.

That’s why they are approaching women and following them like randy male dogs. They believe the shite that porn tells them.

While internet service providers allow access to porn this problem will not go away.

It’s disgraceful that this has been allowed to escalate.

reprehensibleme · 05/09/2021 11:01

Tato, so true. You're not allowed to pull anyone up for bad behaviour, be it man, woman or child.You hear it on here all the time
'Don't judge, you don't know someone's backstory, maybe they're having a bad day'.
Nope - you bet I judge. If someone's behaving like an arsehole, I judge them to be an arsehole.

LibrariesGiveUsPower45321 · 05/09/2021 11:04

YABU. Not all men.

The normal minority of gross men seem to have got worse though.

SprayedWithDettol · 05/09/2021 11:12

You do realise that 50% of Neanderthals were female? They were also intelligent, had family groups, made tools, had language, made cave paintings etc etc. They were of shorter stature and had distinguishing features due to the climate, though some people mistake these traits as being less intelligent, which they don’t appear to have been.

The men you are describing don’t resemble our cousins. They are louts.

Grimacingfrog · 05/09/2021 11:18

@KikoLemons

I think there's been more bad behaviour generally. The fabric of society is more fragile. No-one gives a shit what anyone thinks and they don't have to regulate behaviour to remain part of a group. We can find our own groups online - people who agree that we are 100% right and justified.

Sadly I don't see that changing any time soon.

I think that's very true. Added to the Brexit debate (not wishing a debate on the rights and wrongs of that btw) people have been encouraged to find their tribe and get very angry with anyone who disagrees with them. The same with vaxxing vs anti-vaxxing. People have been encouraged to take a very polarised view and to believe that abuse and even violence are acceptable ways to win their argument.

Obviously this is a minority of people but they get a lot of publicity and maybe it's helped other people to think they can get away with more previously socially unacceptable behaviour. I've twice heard mature adults telling people from ethnic minorities to go back to their own country. I haven't heard this since the seventies.

I've also noticed people being a lot angrier when they have a disagreement with others, like shouting at them in the street, which again I can't remember seeing so often previously.

FMSucks · 05/09/2021 11:21

Men are lost (poor babies). Their roles have been diluted, they’re losing control and they know we don’t actually need them anymore.

Literally every single one of my DH’s friends have tried it on in some way, shape or form. My friend’s partners have done the same. Their sense of entitlement is astounding to me. They all come across as “family men” totally devoted to their wives. Are they fuck.

Grimacingfrog · 05/09/2021 11:23

@FMSucks

Men are lost (poor babies). Their roles have been diluted, they’re losing control and they know we don’t actually need them anymore.

Literally every single one of my DH’s friends have tried it on in some way, shape or form. My friend’s partners have done the same. Their sense of entitlement is astounding to me. They all come across as “family men” totally devoted to their wives. Are they fuck.

WTF 😳.

What do you say to them?

ActonSquirrel · 05/09/2021 11:25

@PearlyRising

not all men blah blah blah well it's not like those not all men ever stand up for what's right. They just quietly enjoy their privilege and THE ONLY TIME THEIR PASSIONS ARE ROUSED IS WHEN THEY'RE OFFENDED ''NOT ALL MEN!!!!'''
Quite. They don't give a shit about women who have been poorly treated or bringing to justice men who have treated women poorly.

They just want to declare they didn't so sod it.

BrozTito · 05/09/2021 11:29

People become very extreme and lose all other perspectives over one single issue, then follow it to hell with its scummy friends. See brexit, trump, trans stuff. It generates rage.

irresistibleoverwhelm · 05/09/2021 11:31

I never buy the “men are lost not knowing what their roles are now that expectations have changed”. I work in a very make dominated environment and I see men adapting to new roles and expectations all the time, quick smart no problems at all when other men are doing the expecting. They only seem to apparently have problems with this when it’s women’s expectations that are at issue - funny that. Hmm

It’s porn, it’s a culture of bad manners and narcissism and self-aggrandisement - look at Brexit etc., any old opinion is valid as long as some man is holding it no matter how daft or wrong it is. It’s the resurgence of male anger against women - fuelled by porn.

You only have to look at the front page of Pornhub and you’ll get instant links to endless slapping, choking, gang bangs, violent and degrading videos of women being sexually abused just out there for mass consumption.

I don’t think we’ve yet even begun to process the mass change this is making in society. It’s never happened before in human history and it’s happening right now.

BrozTito · 05/09/2021 11:32

And yes anti vaxxing. Somebody who daily injects speedballs into their groin and hands daily got very angry telling me not to get the jab the other day.

irresistibleoverwhelm · 05/09/2021 11:32

*male dominated environment that should say!

BrozTito · 05/09/2021 11:32

Too many dailys there

Lessthanaballpark · 05/09/2021 11:34

I see men adapting to new roles and expectations all the time, quick smart no problems at all when other men are doing the expecting. They only seem to apparently have problems with this when it’s women’s expectations that are at issue - funny that.

So true.