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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not want an awake child around at 11pm when I'm on holiday

999 replies

FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop · 25/08/2021 23:42

NC'd for this.

On holiday in a cottage with a friend and we each have 2 kids - mine are 5 & 9 and hers are 5 & 8. I haven't seen this friend in ages as I moved away from my town a few years ago, then COVID happened so this was a great chance to catch up and ours kids are all get on very well. We said loads beforehand that we couldn't wait to talk about what's going in our lives - her with a new job and home, me in a new relationship etc. We stocked up on wine for the holiday as we said we would put the kids to bed and wile away the hours on our balcony (we've been away before and this is something of a tradition). We also wanted to catch up on the same TV show we are watching and watch new episodes together as we don't know anyone else who watches this show.

When we got here we decided 8.30 was a reasonable bedtime for the kids, and my 2 and her youngest have gone down no problem every night after busy days. But We've been here 4 nights and every single night her 8yo refuses to sleep so she brings her downstairs to spend the night with us. Meaning the dynamic COMPLETELY changes, rather than playing poker like we usually do, we have to play Dobble. And instead of watching our TV show (which wouldn't be appropriate with an 8yo around), my friend puts Horrid Henry on.

The talk is PG - no catching up the way we wanted has been done - and, at the risk of sounding nasty, her 8yo has turned into quite an obnoxious little thing. I've spent the last 4 evenings hearing from the 8yo herself about how amazing she is in school, better than all the other kids and she is 'top of the class' (I am a teacher, there is no such thing), how Isabella is rubbish at swimming and she could swim better than her when she was only 4, how she drew a better picture today than my DD, how everyone wants to be her friends and she only picks the most popular girls to be friends with and not the others etc. She also says pretty rude things like "Why do you eat your toast whole, that's a stupid way to eat it, you should cut it up". I do tell her not to be so rude and comment on what people eat.

My friend just gazes at her starry eyed, says nothing when she's rude and makes an extremely feeble effort to put her to bed. It usually starts with her tucking her in at8.30, then at about 9 her DD comes down saying she can't sleep then she takes her back upstairs, before coming back down saying like "oh dear, Alyssa wants to stay up with us, I said that's fine for a few minutes". Then at 11pm they both go up together.

AIBU to be annoyed that I'm spending my holidays nights playing a children's game, the conversation centring around how amazing a rude 8yo is and watching cartoons. It's 11.30pm now, I'm alone downstairs nursing the rest of the wine and feeling a bit sorry for myself!

To make matters worse, my friend said tonight in front of her DD "Alyssa says everyone woke her up this morning making noise so in the morning if she's still asleep everyone will have to be extra quiet". Alyssa was still in bed today at 9.30am!! My kids, us adults and my friend's youngest, are up at 7am. I'm not tiptoeing around just because she can't put her DD to bed on time! I did say well if you went to bed when your mummy told you you would be up at the same time as everyone else.

OP posts:
Summerbreeze4 · 27/08/2021 23:32

@Daisy1245

You said yourself your friend doesn't know about Mumsnet. So how can she post for advice. Just picture it from her point of view too is all I was trying to convey. You are her friend. She thinks you are having a lovely time on holiday with her. What you slag her of on Mumsnet. How hurt would she be if she knew that and had no idea that's how you felt. You don't need to criticize anything to help. "Oh some children are a nightmare at bedtime do you know what worked for a colleague of mine" that is how a friend helps. I do completely see your side of a single parents holiday and I'm sure as a teacher you work very hard. But you could of gone to your room and enjoyed your wine in peace without all the judgement if you were a good friend. That's all I found sad the judgement from you constantly in every post.
Why on earth should she be thinking of her friends feelings when clearly her friend isn’t thinking of hers.

No one would think it ok to get a friend to play games late into the evening with their child when friend has managed to get her children asleep. No one at all would think this acceptable especially when they had planned Netflix and catch up chats. You’re bonkers.

MsTSwift · 27/08/2021 23:36

Daisy is such a dappy name and so it proves once again.

I would replace Jane Austen’s classic line about single men with this “it is a truth universally acknowledged that No normal adult woman on holiday wants to interact with any one else’s kids whilst her own are in a bed”.

MaggieFS · 27/08/2021 23:37

[quote FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop]@Daisy1245 but my friend isn't posting on MN for support. This is about my life, my holiday which I paid a small fortune for on a single parent teachers' wage, that is now being partly spoiled by my friend's inability to put boundaries in place. Forgive me if I actually try and grab some enjoyment out of it rather than counsel my friend in how to parent her child.

Re criticising parents - you just don't go there with 99% of parents least of all parents who think the sun shines out of their kids' arse[/quote]

Well I think you've just written out your own answer to use when she asks why you don't want to do it again next year!

BuckarooWithBruceGrobelaar · 27/08/2021 23:38

But you could of gone to your room and enjoyed your wine in peace without all the judgement if you were a good friend

Why should OP have to retreat to her room every night on holiday Confused just because her 'friend' won't parent her child and make her go to bed? If she was going to go off and enjoy her wine alone, she could have done that in the comfort of her own home without paying a fortune for the privilege

Its interesting that you mention 'true friends' on a PP. From my experience, true friends actually make time for each other, not inflict their spoilt and overindulged brat offspring on the other when it's supposed to be adult time

BuckarooWithBruceGrobelaar · 27/08/2021 23:39

@MsTSwift

Daisy is such a dappy name and so it proves once again.

I would replace Jane Austen’s classic line about single men with this “it is a truth universally acknowledged that No normal adult woman on holiday wants to interact with any one else’s kids whilst her own are in a bed”.

Nailed it Grin
sadperson16 · 27/08/2021 23:41

Go to bed drippy, needy kid , bye bye

DoWhatYouWantToAndShh · 27/08/2021 23:44

@BillyIsMyBunny

My closest sibling (1 year difference) and I always had a different bedtime from our younger siblings (3 & 4 year difference). The younger two would go to bed and then we would be able to watch TV shows like Friends which were on later and suitable for 9/10 yos but not my littler siblings. It would also give us some time with our parents without the little ones demanding their attention. Children of different ages have different needs so it’s not completely crazy to treat them differently. Obviously each family should do what works for them but surely it’s not hard to understand why a family might find reasons to let an older child stay up later than a much younger one.

As for all the snidey comments around gentle parenting, there is nothing wrong with gentle parenting in itself and many of the ‘examples’ given here aren’t a true reflection of gentle parenting but are an extreme end of it where posters citing the use of gentle parenting when what they’re doing is far from it. This would be akin to giving examples of parents screaming in their children’s faces or smacking etc as examples of ‘do as you’re told’ parenting and saying how awful it is as a form of parenting when of course extreme levels of ‘discipline’ aren’t what posters here are condoning. It’s easy to laugh and judge the parenting of others but truth is most parents are trying their best and no parent will get everything, be it bedtime or behaviour or food or homework etc, 100% right.

OP, no doubt your friend has seen things in your parenting that she disagrees with but hopefully she hasn’t been so disrespectful as to post about it for quick laughs on another forum. Your initial reason for starting the thread was reasonable but the continued unpicking of her children’s behaviour and her responses have started to come across as mean considering this is presumably a close friend of yours.

Exactly. It's gone from being annoyed that she's missing out on adults conversation to every single thing her friend does is shit. Oh and how she just has to use a raised voice at her friends 5year old and it does what it's told... Which makes no sense as to why she didn't just use the magic teacher voice to say to 8 year old to go yo bed. But she didn't. She posted on here to get the masses of perfect parents to cheerleader a mean girls campaign against an 8 year old. A brat, bury her under the patio, smack her bottom, I'd never tolerate this etc etc.

It's ok to be irritated. This just makes you look odd because you claim you can be magic but can't just say to your friend ...get her in bed early or... can I help you? Etc.

mommybear1 · 27/08/2021 23:45

Just came on to say second thread please 😬

Daisy1245 · 27/08/2021 23:51

DoWhatYouWantToAndShh thanks for your post I was starting to think I'd got my view wrong. That is what I meant also. Not that the child should be up. But there is no need for all the judgement of her friend.

Daisy1245 · 27/08/2021 23:54

I also never said the op should go to bed on her holiday. That is what the op has chose to do rather than confront the issue with her friend, whilst bad mouthing her on mumsnet. So the op has had a shit holiday, her friend is in la la land thinking the op has had a nice holiday and the child still thinks her behaviour is okay.

Daisy1245 · 28/08/2021 00:00

And if I'm a twit for apparently thinking the op should stay up with the child playing games for the two pp that have put that. Which I never said anyway. What is she, as she was the one that actually done that on her holiday. Rather than just say something 😂

a1poshpaws · 28/08/2021 00:00

Good Grief! Alyssa's mum's certainly setting her daughter up to have a very hard life as an adult if she's letting her get away with this much shit now. Dear little Alyssa's going to be a pretty lonely, bitter adult when she finds herself friendless because she's such an arrogant, rude, unpleasant little princess.

Bakewellisntjustacake · 28/08/2021 00:03

@FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop please start thread 2.0

1AngelicFruitCake · 28/08/2021 00:05

@Daisy1245

You said yourself your friend doesn't know about Mumsnet. So how can she post for advice. Just picture it from her point of view too is all I was trying to convey. You are her friend. She thinks you are having a lovely time on holiday with her. What you slag her of on Mumsnet. How hurt would she be if she knew that and had no idea that's how you felt. You don't need to criticize anything to help. "Oh some children are a nightmare at bedtime do you know what worked for a colleague of mine" that is how a friend helps. I do completely see your side of a single parents holiday and I'm sure as a teacher you work very hard. But you could of gone to your room and enjoyed your wine in peace without all the judgement if you were a good friend. That's all I found sad the judgement from you constantly in every post.
Can you give an example of how you have kindly helped a friend with their child’s behaviour?
1AngelicFruitCake · 28/08/2021 00:08

DoWhatYouWantToAndShh
You’re back! 😄

DoWhatYouWantToAndShh · 28/08/2021 00:09

[quote FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop]@Daisy1245 ah well, I can handle it if you're sad about it, but why should I tolerate this shit on my holiday? She's a grown woman and it's not my place to help[/quote]
What a great attitude

NumberTheory · 28/08/2021 00:13

@RandomMess

It's quite clear the DD exists on a 10pm - 9am schedule whilst the other DC are on a more typical 8pm-7am one. Quite simply I'd be getting her up even earlier and ensuring she was exhausted to bring forward her bedtime. I cannot imagine what their mornings are like term time with her not wanting to be woken up 😳
I have kids with a late schedule. If they had their way it would be a midnight - 10 am one, but we can't accommodate that, so they are up at 7:55 to get to school on time. Getting them up early doesn't get them to sleep significantly earlier, and certainly wouldn't over the course of a week long holiday.

But it really isn't relevant. Because my kid knows that adults want their own time and they've developed the resources to entertain themselves in the evening by reading, writing, building, etc. One of their friends is a 7 pm - 5 am kind of kid and they have developed the resources to entertain themselves in the morning without disturbing a household (even with a mum who is very much of the gentle parenting school, which I am not) so we regularly have sleep overs because the mix of needs isn't insurmountable when both kids understand they have to adapt for the other.

I don't think it's about what the kid is like or even the particular parenting approach you take other than that it needs to be one which has an appreciation that all people have needs and desires and therefore we all have to wait sometimes or compromise to have ours met.

LAgeDeRaisin · 28/08/2021 00:14

@Daisy1245 you're complefelg deluded if you think there is any way for the OP to comment on or assist her friend's crap parenting in a positive way. The friend sees no issue with her daughter and that is the issue.

All she can do is have a good cathartic bitch on MN, see it as a sunk cost, and not book a holiday with this friend again.

Stop having a go at her for doing the only thing she can, which is getting some moral support from a majority of like-minded parents on a parenting forum.

LAgeDeRaisin · 28/08/2021 00:14

completely

DoWhatYouWantToAndShh · 28/08/2021 00:15

@1AngelicFruitCake

DoWhatYouWantToAndShh You’re back! 😄
Just getting my feet painted
Daisy1245 · 28/08/2021 00:23

I don't need to give examples of how I have helped my friends for the poster that has requested that. I don't disclose my friends personal issues on an online forum. If the op can't raise an issue with her friend I think the child going to bed on-time is the least of the problems in their friendship. Anyway nothing to be gained from posting further everyone can enjoy having their snidey remarks about a woman and a child they have never met. Like I said in my first post I'm just glad I have true friends. In turn being a true friend. This sounds much more like the dynamic of an acquaintance.

1AngelicFruitCake · 28/08/2021 00:25

I knew you’d be back, wanting to give OP a kick. You and Daisy need to set up a perfect parents group. You’ve got just the right mix of witty comments 🤔 and smugness.

Daisy1245 · 28/08/2021 00:38

I haven't judged anyone's parenting. Not once. Funnily enough that is what the whole thread is about though. The op judging her friends parenting ability. Just because you say it doesn't make it true. I also have not commented to give the op a kick as you put it. But again that is funnily enough what the thread is about actually her giving her friend one just not to her face. Maybe go bk and read the thread again.

FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop · 28/08/2021 00:42

Second thread! Will reply to comments while I have the space here

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amiibeingunreasonable/4334301-to-not-want-an-awake-child-around-at-11pm-when-i-m-on-holiday-part-deux

OP posts:
Dixiechickonhols · 28/08/2021 00:42

Why should OP sit in bed in evening. She’s paid for a cottage with a lounge and tv. With hindsight if she’d just cracked on day 1 and watched an 18+ Tv show or film it probably would have nipped Alyssa being allowed downstairs in bud but OP was polite.

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