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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think Joe Biden is an even worse president than Trump?

770 replies

Aspiringmatriarch · 16/08/2021 13:45

I realise Trump was appalling in many ways so this isn't a pro-Trump post really, and I know he was the one who put things in motion for the withdrawal from Afghanistan. But to pull out in such a sudden and shambolic way will without doubt be the direct cause of many deaths and other atrocities in Afghanistan, including the deaths of those who helped the US and other forces. I think it's utterly unforgivable. Can't think of anything Trump did with quite such immediate and devastating consequences. AIBU?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
Lweji · 27/08/2021 08:19

Judge for yourself.
This is Biden offering a question to and answering the "most interesting" reporter in the room.

Clearly some people prefer Presidents who throw words at them without any real meaning, rather than those who think carefully before they open their mouths.

knittingaddict · 27/08/2021 08:20

@FOJN

He has a stammer. He sounds the way he does because he is trying to control a severe speech impediment. I admit it is hard to listen to sometimes, but lets not put someone down because of a disability of sorts.

I see this claim made quite a lot but I've also seen interview footage of Biden himself denying he has a stammer. Video footage of him earlier in his career shows a man speaking clearly without hesitation, he has, until recently, been able to have unscripted engagement with the press and public. His public speaking performance is variable, sometimes better than others, which leads me to think it may be reliant on drug dosing and schedule. I watched him during the election campaign and thought his problems may be due to Parkinson's disease.

He has said many times that he has a stutter and he certainly sounds like he has. Can you post the video evidence where he says he hasn't?
Lweji · 27/08/2021 08:22

look at the difference between Biden and Obama

You can't compare Presidents to Obama. Grin
Just because Biden isn't as good or as young as Obama, it doesn't mean he is unfit or has dementia.

BTW, even if Biden had Parkinson's it wouldn't mean he was mentally or psychologically unfit.
Or did you mean Alzheimers?
I hope you're not confused.

Lweji · 27/08/2021 08:23

[quote Lweji][/quote]
This was Biden speaking about his stutter, btw.

Teamfemale · 27/08/2021 08:24

@Lweji

look at the difference between Biden and Obama

You can't compare Presidents to Obama. Grin
Just because Biden isn't as good or as young as Obama, it doesn't mean he is unfit or has dementia.

BTW, even if Biden had Parkinson's it wouldn't mean he was mentally or psychologically unfit.
Or did you mean Alzheimers?
I hope you're not confused.

Too early to be so unpleasant @Lweji - why don't you have a morning off.
Lweji · 27/08/2021 08:25

Ah... attack the tone, not the argument tactic. Grin
I'm very much in good spirits, thank you.

Rainbowqueeen · 27/08/2021 08:26

Biden has said he was not going to extend the time in Afghanistan and therefore leave it for the next president to deal with. I respect that. I also think it means he fully intends to be a one term president.
Do I think he’s the best president ever? No. But I do think he is willing to do the hard work and make the tough decisions.

And I’m happy to listen when he talks. I couldn’t bear to listen to Trump’s jibberish

Teamfemale · 27/08/2021 08:30

@Lweji

Ah... attack the tone, not the argument tactic. Grin I'm very much in good spirits, thank you.
No tactics just aware you're spoiling for a fight at 8.30am.

This is a discussion thread. People are discussing their views. No need for the personal attacks and passive aggressive smiley faces.

Lweji · 27/08/2021 08:31

So, discuss.

Teamfemale · 27/08/2021 08:32

I couldn’t bear to listen to Trump’s jibberish

Same here

FOJN · 27/08/2021 08:34

He has said many times that he has a stutter and he certainly sounds like he has. Can you post the video evidence where he says he hasn't?

I've just been trying to find it but can't remember what the interview was about. It was from much earlier in his career and he didn't consider himself to have a stutter. He said he had a speech impediment in childhood but it had corrected as he got older. If you look back at him speaking in the Senate he was clear and lucid, often injecting a good deal of passionate into his speech, it's a far cry from the slow, stumbling speeches he gives today.

FOJN · 27/08/2021 08:39

BTW, even if Biden had Parkinson's it wouldn't mean he was mentally or psychologically unfit.

No I meant Parkinson's, I am fully aware the two are different. He had a few moments caught on camera. where his movements looked very parkinsonian.

SwimmingUnderwater · 27/08/2021 08:39

So relieved to see the end of Trump. I thought he was a very dangerous man. Biden however seems utterly useless. His actions over Afghanistan have been appalling. He should have withdrawn on a longer timescale and ensured as many people could leave beforehand as was manageable.

Teamfemale · 27/08/2021 08:40

@FOJN

He has said many times that he has a stutter and he certainly sounds like he has. Can you post the video evidence where he says he hasn't?

I've just been trying to find it but can't remember what the interview was about. It was from much earlier in his career and he didn't consider himself to have a stutter. He said he had a speech impediment in childhood but it had corrected as he got older. If you look back at him speaking in the Senate he was clear and lucid, often injecting a good deal of passionate into his speech, it's a far cry from the slow, stumbling speeches he gives today.

I think reading from the autocue is doing him no favours at all. Its seems like he is concentrating too hard to see the words and read them (seems like he is straining to see sometimes) so his emotions just seem devoid. I've no doubt behind the scenes he must be going out of his mind trying to fix this but he is not coming off well on the speeches. He is just reading from a script, not delivering a statement.
HarrietsChariot · 27/08/2021 08:42

At least Biden means Trump's 2024 re-election wouldn't be such a travesty as it otherwise might have been. It's not like we'd be replacing a great (or adequate) president with an incompetent one.

The mistake in my view was the idea people were convinced by ahead of the last election, that Trump was unfit and anyone would be better. Biden shows that there's some truth in the phrase "better the devil you know." Trump was outrageously incompetent, but in comparison with Biden he seemed to at least have an idea of how he would like the country to look. Leaving aside whether his vision was right or even realistic, he had the belief that he could make it happen.

With Biden he seems to have no plan, no long term or short term goals. His presidency is based on "I'm not Trump" and nothing more. There's a similar thing in the UK with Labour and Kier Starmer (in opposition, not government). To be in power you can't just be anti "the other guys" - you have to have a long term vision, and short term goals to achieve it.

Original poster
Aspiringmatriarch · 27/08/2021 08:42

FWIW I don't think I should have framed the thread as Trump vs. Biden really. I was just shocked, and still am, by how the withdrawal from Afghanistan has been handled. Trump may or may not have done things differently in practice but he did make the original agreement. However the way Biden has executed it is going to define his presidency. Maybe he's the fall guy and they're getting ready for him to resign and bring in Harris but the whole situation is just bizarre and doesn't make sense on the face of it, which is perhaps why some are questioning his mental fitness for office.

OP posts:
Anon778833 · 27/08/2021 08:43

You can't be a worse president than Trump - he was impeached twice Hmm

Refreshpage · 27/08/2021 08:50

@Panickingpavlova

Any American president would have withdrawn from Afghanistan. Republican and democrat.

What is soley Bidens responsibility is the massive miscalculated way this has been done.

Putting many lives at risk where a worse case scenario planning could have forseen this and put measures in place. It didn't have to be this way and it's hideous and that's on Biden and his administration.

This. It's not the eventual withdrawal it's the rushed incompetent way it was done. US soldiers died due to this too. Total shambles that has cost lives and will continue to cost lives.
FOJN · 27/08/2021 08:56

However the way Biden has executed it is going to define his presidency. Maybe he's the fall guy and they're getting ready for him to resign and bring in Harris but the whole situation is just bizarre and doesn't make sense on the face of it, which is perhaps why some are questioning his mental fitness for office.

I agree with this, none of it makes any sense. I have no idea what the agenda is but strategically and tactically the withdrawal has been a disaster.

Lweji · 27/08/2021 09:07

@Aspiringmatriarch

FWIW I don't think I should have framed the thread as Trump vs. Biden really. I was just shocked, and still am, by how the withdrawal from Afghanistan has been handled. Trump may or may not have done things differently in practice but he did make the original agreement. However the way Biden has executed it is going to define his presidency. Maybe he's the fall guy and they're getting ready for him to resign and bring in Harris but the whole situation is just bizarre and doesn't make sense on the face of it, which is perhaps why some are questioning his mental fitness for office.
Fair enough.

But, and you may not have noticed, but there were lots of people questioning his fitness from the start. All GOP pundits and certain, let's say, "internet influencers". It's not new.

Personally, I was never a fan. Much preferred other Dem candidates, including Kamala. But nothing so far has suggested to me that he is unfit in any true sense.
This shit show was put in place by the previous administration, who did take many troops out, and released Taliban prisoners. And refused, basically, to cooperate in the transition of power!
Maybe it could have been handled better. But most people who think so aren't saying exactly what should have been done in these circumstances and how.

derxa · 27/08/2021 09:09

I wish people would stop using the awful term 'speech impediment'. It's straight out of the Ark.

knittingaddict · 27/08/2021 09:24

@derxa

I wish people would stop using the awful term 'speech impediment'. It's straight out of the Ark.
Is it? Who says?
derxa · 27/08/2021 09:44

Is it? Who says? Me. I used to be a Speech and Language Therapist.

knittingaddict · 27/08/2021 09:53

What would you prefer?

derxa · 27/08/2021 10:03

@knittingaddict

What would you prefer?
Joe Biden has a stutter and in the UK it's called a stammer. There are many different types of speech production difficulties with many different causes. connect.uclahealth.org/2020/10/19/joe-bidens-history-of-stuttering-sheds-light-on-the-condition/