If you are a MIL who overstepped boundaries

[crikey456]

I've seen so many posts on Mumsnet about MIL's upsetting their DIL's. A lot of the posts are about MIL's overstepping the boundaries with newborns. I am trying to find MIL's who realise maybe years later that they did overstep boundaries and maybe the reasons why.

When I had my first baby my MIL suddenly had no respect for me. She turned up unannounced on a daily basis, often with friends. We would be mid dinner and she would apologise but make no attempt to leave. She would criticise me parenting. She would book us in to go and see her family members of a weekend to essentially show off the baby. It was almost like she was trying to be in control of our lives. She bought a xmas outfit for my Daughter and told me that's what she should wear for Xmas day. When around family members, she would just grab my baby off me and act as if she was hers. She ignored anything I asked her to do e.g milk at certain times and she would make a point of telling me she had done it differently. I once recall her telling me I was very good to let her look after her as I don't know the way she does things. Anyway, with my 2nd child, she was the absolute opposite. She is an absolutely lovely woman and would go to the ends of the earth to help anyone, so I just couldn't work it out.

If you are a MIL who realises now that you overstepped certain boundaries when your DIL first had a baby, what do you think the reasons were looking back?

I think often it's just personalities - my MIL is a lovely person and therefore we don't clash at all. She was interested in my health as well as seeing DD when born, we invited her to the hospital on day 2 as we were in for a few days and she checked we didn't mind and said she'd wait until we were home if we wanted. She buys a lot of stuff for DD which can get a bit much but it's one of the ways she shows love so we've talked about it and tried to compromise on what/how much comes to the house. I think when actions come from a good place it's better to remember that. She's bought a big item for DD's birthday which we really don't have space for so we'll need to have a conversation about it but I really don't want to hurt her feelings! (DH usually has these conversations to be fair).

She's always been respectful of our boundaries and I love how much she loves DD. At the same time she's genuinely interested in me too. She has two boys and has been welcoming to me as soon as DH introduced us. I would have been surprised if she had been any different once DD was born. I did feel a bit territorial when DD was a newborn in a way that I didn't feel at all with my own DM. I'm pretty sure it was a hormonal thing and I did my best not to show it (really hope I didn't!) and it passed after a few weeks.

See i have to say that my MIL was FAR better than my own DM. She drives DH up the wall by constantly checking how I am, how much he is doing for me (never enough in her eyes) and sending her love to me. When I had DD, she arrived at hospital (at our request) before my parents, waited for several hours without even telling us she was there and then refused to come up to see me until my parents had arrived first. My DM arrived with arms outstretched to take the baby and was like bloody Gollum. I had to practically prise DD off her yo give MIL a turn and DM was anything but gracious. MiL was a great help when visiting at home too, getting on with housework and making sure I was adequately fed and watered, but keeping very much out of my way. DM was more interested in the baby, despite staying with us on the basis of looking after me post-CS. I'm pregnant again, and once again MIL and my DF remain very concerned about my health and wellbeing, and DM continues to scoff at the effects of my tokophobic (not as bad as last time - I think with hindsight and some stern talking to from DF, she realises how cruel she was to me whilst I was suffering from pretty nasty pre-natal depression and anxiety, which seemed to come from her annoyance that I was not able to bolster and support her excitement at becoming a GM). So it seems the grandmother madness is not restricted just to mothers of sons!

I agree it's a difficult relationship to manage on both sides. Now I have my own DC I do 'get' MIL more than I used to, but I'll never forgive her for how she treated me and made me feel in those early days of motherhood.

It was all about her becoming an a GM, me being a new young Mum who went through a difficult birth completely passed her by.

She would literally snatch my baby out of my arms and not give her back when I asked. She'd just talk to DD and ignore me and I could feel her arms tensing as I tried to take her.

She hated that I wanted to parent in my own way, rather do what I was told.

She just wanted me to give her my baby and go away and 'rest' somewhere, anywhere...
If she was there, then I wasn't needed was her mind set.

In reality she just wanted a bond with her GC. She didn't want my mother to be closer than her, so she decided that bulldozing through and stamping all over my feelings was the best way to achieve it.

I'm not sure how she thought behaving that way would get her more time with DD. Surely it's obvious that I would avoid someone who made me feel like shit.

She's otherwise a very normal and nice woman, so I'm not sure what having a GC via a son does to make a person behave so awfully. At a guess it's trying to make up for the distance, but pushing your DIL away is never going to achieve that.

I’m pregnant with my first… and very worried about the in-laws.

It’s technically not their first grandchild, because FIL has other children, but he has no contact with them and so has never met their children.

I don’t have parents either, which I think has made things worse, because my in-laws then want to play both roles. MIL was quite put out that she didn’t get to do both the mother of the bride and mother of the groom parts of the wedding, despite us not really doing any of the “traditional” roles…

They’re already quite forceful with their views. Don’t breastfeed, it’s selfish and means no-one else can feed the baby. Use physical discipline early. They keep telling me that they hope it’s a girl.

There have also been lovely moments - they fired on DH and MIL very excitedly showed me his christening outfits and his hospital wristband and all his tiny first shoes and things… and ironically, there’s only one photo of DH with MILs mum, none with FILs mum as they found her too hard work.

But she does seem to see the baby as her baby, just being carried by me. And since she knew I was pregnant; she’s started doing things she wouldn’t have done before… turning up randomly and saying she didn’t ask as she knew we’d say we were working, touching my stomach all the time although you can’t feel anything and it’s clear that it makes me uncomfortable, sending me weight loss links. It’s like the past five years of friendship are gone, and I am now a vessel for the child.

I am pleased they will love DC, and that DC will have grandparents who they’ll love - I didn’t. But they are going to be disappointed at some of it… not because I’m prioritising my own parents, but because there doesn’t seem to be a way for them not to be.

Not sure why alltheemptyfields is getting such a hard time. It’s so obvious what she meant by a vague neighbour - treat your DIL with respect and kindness and by respecting boundaries, as you would a neighbour! I think a lot of people are projecting and I dread what sort of MIL they are!!

It really is very simple...my relationship with my mum is so much different to my MIL. So naturally, her involvement with DS and our lives is different to my MIL. I have made a deliberate and conscious decision to not interfere too much when MIL has DS, to not put her out because she is lovely, but she still doesn’t understand there are some things that are a no go for me, yet she still does it (ie crying it out). My own mum respects my wishes and doesn’t do it. I can be more assertive with my mum, but it’s different with my MIL because she gets offended and cue the drama!

@TakeYourFinalPosition, I’m so sorry - it sounds as if you’re in for a rough ride. Physical discipline would be a complete deal breaker for me, I really wouldn’t want someone like that anywhere near my child.

I had a wonderful MIL who at the time (15 years ago) I honestly thought was too much.

She wasn't. She was being helpful and I had horrible PND.

She's now ex mil and we get on fine. She has a great relationship with the children but I cringe at how upset I'd get about her input.

@MsHedgehog

Not sure why alltheemptyfields is getting such a hard time. It’s so obvious what she meant by a vague neighbour - treat your DIL with respect and kindness and by respecting boundaries, as you would a neighbour! I think a lot of people are projecting and I dread what sort of MIL they are!!

It really is very simple...my relationship with my mum is so much different to my MIL. So naturally, her involvement with DS and our lives is different to my MIL. I have made a deliberate and conscious decision to not interfere too much when MIL has DS, to not put her out because she is lovely, but she still doesn’t understand there are some things that are a no go for me, yet she still does it (ie crying it out). My own mum respects my wishes and doesn’t do it. I can be more assertive with my mum, but it’s different with my MIL because she gets offended and cue the drama!

But I think the point that a lot of PP were making is that their relationship with their MIL/DIL is so much deeper, richer and more loving than any relationship with a neighbour, especially a ‘vague’ one (whatever that actually is).

I treat my DIL and SIL with respect and kindness BECAUSE they are family, and I try never to cross their boundaries because I know what they are, I want to make them comfortable around me, and I want them to love me back.

None of the above is true of my neighbours 😂. I have no idea what their boundaries are, and the only reason I’ve not trampled all over them is because I never spend any time with them. In fact, there could possibly be a post about me right now ‘my neighbour tramples all over my boundaries’ and I’d have NO idea 😂😂

@alltheemptyfields

You think a MIL has no right to cuddle their grandchild. Their sons child?

I think a woman who just had a baby has rights to be left alone to recover and to choose when she is ready to see visitors. It might be 2 hours post birth, it might be 3 days.

MIL who believe they have a right to anything to the baby without any respect for the mother need to learn some manners and common sense.

I agree with you. I have seen plenty of MiL's (with good intentions) invade the space of the new family and the mum having to suck it up (whilst bleeding, milk coming in, feeling like a car crash, weepy). The mother has a "right" to recover more than the MiL has a "right" to a cuddle.

I saw it recently with a cousin. She was due a midwife visit, part of which was examining a 2nd degree tear. MiL said she wanted to match the other Grandma visit for visit and wouldn't be pushed out so also insisted on visiting that day.

@alltheemptyfields

Let me get this straight you think the woman's mother has rights to the baby that a MIL doesn't?!

you cannot compare the relationship between a mother and her daughter, and a MIL. So don't expect the same.

And the mistake many MIL make, is expecting to have rights over the baby, while bypassing completely the baby's mother...

Best way to start resentment and a very cold relationship.

Ultimately, it's the MIL who will moan they don't hear from the family, don't see them at Christmas, they don't get invited for holidays, don't see much of the baby... It's a choice.

I agree with what you are saying, but I hate my MIL so I suspect my judgment is probably clouded.

I wouldn't also be interested to hear from actual MIL's about why they behaved to badly. If, indeed, they can see it, with hindsight.

My MIL threw tantrums after each of my children's births. Demanding to visit asap for what were essentially just photo opportunities. Came to stay a few days after my first was born - we had tried to put her off for a few weeks but she cried and wailed and dragged other family members into it and said we were "keeping her from her granddaughter" So she turned up and just made an absolute nuisance of herself for 3 days.

Posting on Facebook "On behalf of (granddaughters name) and myself...." which really got my back up for some reason.

It's one of my biggest regrets that we didn't stand up to her at that point. And she did it again with my other DC's births! One of them I was in recovery from a C section so couldn't really do much about it but I'll probably never forgive DH for allowing it to happen again.

Anyway, she shows zero interest in them at all, but will occasionally kick off about wanting certain things, demands that we visit her etc.

So, so incredibly strange.

I'm the DIL, not MIL but to answer the original question - MIL definitely overstepped quite a few boundaries in the beginning but has dialled it back since then.

To be fair, nothing like the crazy you hear on here but things like her always telling me DS wasn't hungry and to let him cry, or the time she had a massive row with DH because we were annoyed she'd invited SIL over without telling us (we didn't mind SIL coming over, and didn't need her to ask permission, but it was supper time, I didn't have enough food for SIL, DS had only just gone down and I had PND - no warning nearly broke me).

That kind of thing just wouldn't happen today. I think in her case, she had her first grandchildren when she was living v close to her other son and she was much younger (dnephew is 15 years older than ds) and so were BIL and SIL (early 20s). She practically became a nanny/housekeeper to BIL and SIL. I have no idea how SIL felt (they are divorced but due to BIL's behaviour, that much I do know) and I think she just assumed it would be the same with us.

But it was different with us. For one, she was older and less able to physically step up at our house (from childcare to cooking to cleaning - she didn't do it). And I was older with a more established way of doing things.

TO her credit however, she figured it out and stepped back and is a wonderful grandmother and these days we get on fine. She's very respectful of me and, importantly, I try to be the same - eg she sees the kids rarely as she lives far away so she does tend to treat them. She knows I don't really approve of lots of treats but I know that it's the odd time and really, the kids love it so it's fine. When she's here, we always get on well and will happily spend a day together or enjoy a meal and a glass of wine, with or without the rest of the family.

I have my issues with her but I really really respect her ability to adapt to what DH and I needed and wanted and I always hope that she feels I've tried to do the same for her.

I will never forgive my mil for how she behaved when I had dd1. She waltzed around my house like it was hers, acted as if I didn't exist and kept referring to herself as 'the mother', amongst other things. Fucking bizarre. Our relationship has never recovered and she barely knows either of our daughters.

I honestly think she was just jealous. This big, wonderful thing had happened in her family that for the first time she wasn't at the centre of.

I think I'll be a good MIL. Because I don't consider that I owe my DS, let alone the children he and his partner will have. I envisage myself to have regular contact so to build a close bond with my grand children, but at their parents convenience. I will happily and respectfully follow their requirements, even if they are different to what I consider best. It's their children.

At the same time, I will not be at their beck and call to babysit, help, assist when it suits them. I am looking forward to my retirement and the freedom that comes with it. I am unlikely to offer regular childcare, unless they can accept that I might not be available at times, maybe at short notice. If that doesn't work for them, I won't do childminding. If they have an issue with that, consider it my role to do, then yes, there could possibly be some conflict.

Reggae, I can't get past what my Mil did either although I tried over the years.

Esp now my own dc are older I can't imagine doing to my own dd what she did to me, talking to me in that way, piling on what she did at that time...

Op can't in a million years imagined doing what she did, at the very least because it puts the baby at risk as well... New mothers need support, kindness, help...
And I think more should be made of this, ie more information on this and to pre warn partners.. Please support your babies mum, your wife etc, you are the gate keeper, shore her up and do what she wants.

@ActonSquirrel

How many thread of MIL demanding to see the baby, demanding the "cuddle" many MIL seem to think they are entitled to

You think a MIL has no right to cuddle their grandchild. Their sons child?

The woman's mother does though?

Wow.

I would hate to have you as my MIL! So after I had serious invasive surgery, and I’m bleeding, in pain, leaking from my breasts and an emotional mess, because I wanted my mum around, which meant she met DS first, I should have also had my MIL seeing me at my very worst?

It’s the woman who goes through pregnancy and childbirth, and deals with the afterbirth, not the man. So yes, the woman’s needs take priority over your son’s.

Your poor poor daughter in law.

I have also just remembered that my MIL retired on the basis that I have having her first grandchild. She told us all, including everyone at her retirement party in a stand up with a microphone speech a few months before my child arrived that she was retiring because I was growing her grandchild and she wanted to be around to visit daily, and take child to babysit regularly- as in take her for the whole day several times a week.

She only worked 15 hours a week anyway, and I planned to be a stay at home mother!

She was most put out when I didn't want her to visit daily and certainly didn't want anyone to take my baby for any babysitting for the first 6-8 months!

But as I said earlier, she dialled it back hugely and now years on behaves like a normal reasonable person again. She found other things to do with her retirement and now visits or I take the children to her and FIL probably twice a week which suits us all (well it might not suit her but I suspect it does).

It's so easy to see how people take others for granted. AT the end of the the day we are all held by a thin breakable thread, all of us to each other. Respect. Kindness. Empathy.

I'm so sick of reading about women who have just gone through labour, physically wounded, in pain, shock, wonderment, tired, and a new life depending on them, and on top of of that they are expected to manage the moods and demands of an out of control demanding, selfish egotistical Mil.

I just find it all so odd. As I said previously, I hate my MIL, so I thought a lot of this stuff was just her. It's so jarring to hear stories of previously sane, lovely women behaving in this way.

There must be some deep-rooted, primal reason for it. They all seem to be behaving in very similar manners, regardless of their previous/ usual personalities.

It’s only just occurred to me that most women now becoming grandmas had their kids when mothers and mils had NO boundaries, none at all. They were the matriarch and what they said went. That was the norm for today’s new grandmas and I think some of it might be that they don’t understand things have changed.

My mum - who was the most amazing mum and granny you can imagine - did all sorts of stuff that I never gave a second thought but would be completely unacceptable now.

New mothers need support, kindness, help...

Absolutely panicking and when my SIL had her first I tried so hard to be loving, kind, tell her constantly what a good job she was doing and how proud we all were of her and DN, etc. Mil did the absolute opposite, it was almost like a switch flipped and suddenly she couldn't do anything right. SIL put up with it because she felt she had to. I didn't!

When was the era of no boundaries Blossomtoes? I don’t remember it from when I had DC in 1990 and if you mean the 70s that was mainly a myth…

I feel like I don’t recognise any of these women from RL, don’t know any matriarch types who think they’ve been displaced or people who demand to visit within hours of the birth… many people live so far away it’s not possible - 5 hours in our case. We were invited after about a week to meet DPs first GC. I was honoured to be called grandma & hadn’t expected it 😊 I only shared some of my experiences (in conversation) after the birth and we didn’t suggest anything at all re baby care except reassurance (having had quite a lot of children between us!). I can see how eg midwife advice has changed quite a lot in the last 30 years…

I have generally been dismayed about the rage towards MILs and SMs on Mumsnet which has made me a bit uneasy, being both… I can see some poor relationships between DILs and MILs described here predate any GCs. Some DILs have recognised that they have some part in it due to how they were feeling in the period after the birth and go on the have great relationships with ILs and great GP/GC interactions.

When your children marry or partner-up things do change and everyone becomes accustomed to the new family setup over time. I had never had a DIL before and was anxious to not do the wrong thing in uncharted territory. DIL is definitely family and we have become closer over time 😊

if you mean the 70s that was mainly a myth ...

I do mean the 70s and it wasn’t myth. I had mine in 1975 and that was definitely the way it was.

I feel sorry for my mil because she could have all the cuddles she wanted if only she could learn to keep her critical comments to herself.
The most important thing does not seem to be the grandchild but instead how much weight I put on. A meeting can't go by without her criticism about my figure or clothes. I'm not even that fat - just a normal shape.
Keeping up appearances is more important than bonding with her gc. She buys impractical clothes that I would have to iron. I'm not ironing for a newborn so they don't get worn. She moans. She is embarrassed by breastfeeding in public.

She could be a hoggy grandparent I wouldn't mind it. She could have hours of cuddles while I slept. But she can't keep her nasty tongue inside her mouth and so we hardly ever see her.

It only became a problem after I had babies. So what changed? Why did me having grandchildren give her the right to constantly put me down? It's not even about the child. It makes no sense but yet here we are.

Pongo, I used to feel sorry for mine as well, it's crazy I took on her issues, felt bad when she cried etc.
Then I became to realise how she felt or what she did wasn't my problem and she like yours could choose to say nice things and be kind. She chose to be an utter bitch and lives with the consequences.

My mother-in-law passed a few years ago but when my first was about six months old, we flew to the UK (we were living in the states at the time) and while my husband was out doing something sporty with his old friends, MIL and I went out together to a village fete with all her friends in attendance. She introduced us to the first set of her friends who cooed over the baby and MIL said "oh and you can already tell she's going to be fair and have lovely soft hair, no one will even know she's coloured" (I'm mixed race but fairly dark-skinned, most people just see me as Black). I said excuse me and quietly took myself and my daughter back to the hotel where we were staying (MIL's house was too filthy and full of her hoard for us to stay). My husband was the one who had it out with her, she apparently called me a n-word bitch and that was that, neither I nor my child ever saw her again, and we didn't move back to the UK until after she passed away.

So yeah not many of your MILs can live up to that, I imagine 😹