AIBU to be surprised that Laurel Hubbard didn't register a lift in the Olympics?

[Gladiolixoxo]

I wonder if all the controversy around Laurel's participation led to her losing her nerve?

I suspect it was planned all along. Too much sunlight if their lifts had been registered. This way the path is paved for reasonably competent biological male lifters in the future to compete in women's competitions under the same guidelines.

Or maybe Hubbard just isn't very good?

Still deprived women athletes of a chance to compete though..

Roviel Detenamo lost a place for a male athlete, twenty years older than his opponents, with an injury that would have been career ending for either a man or woman in the correct catagory.

A woman lost out because of policies like this.
If you go along with the narrative that Hubbard had any right to be there then you're complicit in future women worldwide missing out and the death of women's sports.

Fucking hell. Engage your critical thinking skills please.

Aaah so provided the woman alternative is a bit shittier than a slightly better man that's ok?

RIP women's sport. My heart breaks for our daughters. I'm so fucking angry about this.

@ChainJane

The thing I take from this is that actually there isn't anything to worry about. Transwoman trounced by non-transwomen which suggests that maybe the guidelines are alright and the rules that are in place have bought Hubbard down to not just to par female level, but actually sub-female level.

I don't get the fuss about Hubbard taking a born-female woman's place - presumably the woman she replaced was even shitter than Hubbard?

And when a 20 year old male athlete at their peak is in next time that will be ok will it. And that's ignoring the fact they very possibly threw it. On purpose. So the hard of thinking go, 'why does it matter'. it matters to Roviel Detenamo. You don't get to decide that her opportunities are limited because a male stole her place.

still the sex you were born no matter how much surgery you have you can't change biological dna. get over it.
Lauren should have not been on the womens team.
Flame away i don't care.

@ChainJane

The thing I take from this is that actually there isn't anything to worry about. Transwoman trounced by non-transwomen which suggests that maybe the guidelines are alright and the rules that are in place have bought Hubbard down to not just to par female level, but actually sub-female level.

I don't get the fuss about Hubbard taking a born-female woman's place - presumably the woman she replaced was even shitter than Hubbard?

And what about the Paris Olympics. When 10 much younger trans women weight lifters, all of whom are mediocre by male standards but out-lift all the females and claim 'well we're in the same position as LH was three years ago so what's changed'?

Is that ok?

I don’t care why Hubbard didn’t manage to lift anything , I’m just pleased , should never have been competing in the first place .

Seriously @ChainJane use your head. Once a precedent has been set it's been set.

How about I left my front door wide open all last week and nothing happened. Do you think my insurance company would cough up if I left it open every day for the next year snd I got burgled.

@ChainJane - explain it to me like I'm a 5 year old. What is a 'non- trans woman' please?

I wonder whether the answer is to have women only events (for women who are biological women and have not taken male hormones), and open events for everyone else. Trans men and women would, of course, be welcome to compete against men in the open events.

And maybe those classifications could also apply to loos, to refuges, to rape crisis centres, prisons, hospital wards and more.

trounced by non-transwomen
I think you'll find the word "women" is a far neater and accurate description

"Non-trans woman." I've heard it all, now!

The day we have to tie ourselves in linguistic knots to talk about a woman or women, things have Gone. Too. Far.

She is schroedinger’s trans woman. Had she done well, she would have been held up as an example of why trans women shouldn’t be allowed to compete in sports. But by not doing well, she has shown herself up as a stool pigeon, infiltrating sport and bottling to prove it’s ok for trans women to compete.

Just so long as it isn’t concluded that trans women can compete and may or may not do well, like any athlete. That couldn’t possibly be.

I don't understand the sport well enough, honestly.

Maybe LH's strategy was 'high risk, high reward' - went for a better shot at a medal, risking crashing and burning, which is what happened of course.

Maybe LH was carrying an injury.

Maybe at 43 yrs old LH is no longer quite as good as was even the case a few years ago, notwithstanding her very long hiatus in the sport.

Who knows.

The key thing, though, is that there's obviously no place for trans women in olympic weightlifting.

Allowing trans women in olympic track is bad enough - women's track world records are consistently about 10% worse than the male equivalent (see zigapskraba.com/2016/09/15/womens-world-records-compared-against-mens-world-records-in-track-field/).

But for superheavyweight [or whatever you call the top class] weightlifting the difference is nudging towards 50% or thereabouts, it's really night and day, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_Olympic_weightlifting#Men

apologies, i of course meant "no place for trans women in olympic women's weightlifting"

Had problems with her snatch apparently.

@ChainJane

The thing I take from this is that actually there isn't anything to worry about. Transwoman trounced by non-transwomen which suggests that maybe the guidelines are alright and the rules that are in place have bought Hubbard down to not just to par female level, but actually sub-female level.

I don't get the fuss about Hubbard taking a born-female woman's place - presumably the woman she replaced was even shitter than Hubbard?

Non-transwomen. This is where we are.

As for not getting the fuss about Hubbard taking a female athlete's place - really? If Usain Bolt transitioned and came back to compete in the women's events, would that mean the world class athletes displaced and pushed out of medal positions were 'shit'?

I think LH took one for Team transgender. It paves the way for younger stronger men to compete as women and the TRA's get to say told you so. Hateful Bigots.

Maybe it would have been better to let LH compete under the radar and when she/he took gold, (which I believe she would) the facts should come out.

A BBC newsreader announced that Hubbard completed their transition in 2017(18? Can't remember)
What does that mean exactly? Have they had full surgery? Any surgery? Hormones? Or have they done the bare minimum to bring their testosterone down to accepted levels for the sport, and nothing else?

I think it was planned because of all the drama around it there was no reason to send Hubbard apart from the fact that they are trans

They are injured
Older
Statisticly less capable than all the women there

Why send Hubbard? To make the point women can beat transwomen? Make it less of a threat to womens sports?

@IonaLeg

She is schroedinger’s trans woman. Had she done well, she would have been held up as an example of why trans women shouldn’t be allowed to compete in sports. But by not doing well, she has shown herself up as a stool pigeon, infiltrating sport and bottling to prove it’s ok for trans women to compete.

Just so long as it isn’t concluded that trans women can compete and may or may not do well, like any athlete. That couldn’t possibly be.

Of course they can compete - in the male events, which is where they belong.

Hubbard must have known they were way off form.

Given the woman who lost her place was added as a reserve last minute after ioc said take a reserve. Why didn't LH withdraw and let the reserve for the country compete?

@pickingdaisies

A BBC newsreader announced that Hubbard completed their transition in 2017(18? Can't remember) What does that mean exactly? Have they had full surgery? Any surgery? Hormones? Or have they done the bare minimum to bring their testosterone down to accepted levels for the sport, and nothing else?

No surgery that we know of testosterone levels bought down to acceptable levels which is still higher than womens levels