AIBU to think that all men are a bit shit?

[Vitallyli]

I love DH, he's intelligent, generous, loves me, our DS, our dog, my family, he's not a cheater, not a gambler, but he also has low self esteem, can get paranoid about me cheating, can get depressed, drinks more than I think is okay, we are in our mid 30s, can shout at me sometimes, doesn't help me around the house much would rather make me a massage. He tells me compliments daily though, boosted my self esteem after birth for which I'll be eternally grateful. I hope I paint a fair picture. AIBU to think that all men are flawed and there is no perfect relationships and women have to put up with one thing or another or is there a beautiful loving, caring and respectful relationships out there?

@YouShouldLeave

Men’s suicide rate isin’t higher. Men are more violent than women, even in suicide. So they are more likely to succeed. We have mental health crisis, both women and men, happening. It is not worse for men and by perpetuating this, women are gonna be forgotten when in comes to helping with mental health.

Men being "more violent" is by no means a sufficient explanation for why their rates are higher. Men may choose more violent methods, sure. But there is a huge culture of discouraging men from talking about their feelings from a young age; which is the opposite of what women experience. Men who show feelings are seen as "weak" societally and among their peers (generally speaking). This is a significant contributory factor to the relatively higher suicide rates among men.

@Qwerty789

Do you have links to research that backs up claims that the attempt rate is similar? I'd be genuinely interested. Thanks

@pleasedonttextmyman

The question isn’t really whether men are shit in themselves, the question is whether a woman actually benefits more than she loses by setting up home with one.

only if she is with the wrong man (and vice-versa).

Many of us decided to "set up home" with their man for their own convenience and preferences, not to be a martyr. In short, makes my life easier, and happier too. 🤷

I'm sure this is true for some people. Obviously you need to find a man who enhances and complements your life rather than one who drains it.

I've always found cohabiting made me feel trapped and drained.

[quote feelingmehtoday]@Qwerty789

Do you have links to research that backs up claims that the attempt rate is similar? I'd be genuinely interested. Thanks [/quote]
I'm wrong...in fact women attempt suicide more than men, but follow through less.

Chang, B; Gitlin, D; Patel, R (September 2011). "The depressed patient and suicidal patient in the emergency department: evidence-based management and treatment strategies". Emergency Medicine Practice. 13 (9): 1–23, quiz 23–4. PMID 22164363.
Stern, Theodore A.; Fava, Maurizio; Wilens, Timothy E.; Rosenbaum, Jerrold F. (2015). Massachusetts General Hospital Comprehensive Clinical Psychiatry (2 ed.). Elsevier Health Sciences. p. 589. ISBN 9780323328999.
Krug, Etienne G. (2002). World Report on Violence and Health. World Health Organization. p. 191. ISBN 9789241545617.

You might want to read your own sources before you question others though, the link you posted states this:
Women also are even more likely than men to attempt suicide. In the US for example, adult women in the US reported a suicide attempt 1.2 times as often as men. But male suicide methods are often more violent, making them more likely to be completed before anyone can intervene

In any case, my point re suicide rates is a slightly diversion from the thread. The original context of my comments was that I take issue with "low self esteem" and "depression" being included in a list of reasons why a person (of any sex) is "shit". In this day and age, with such widespread understanding and acceptance of mental health difficulties, this is really not OK. If a man described his female partner as "shit" for these reasons he'd quite rightly be called out as an insensitive arsehole. It shouldn't be OK the other way around either IMO.

[quote feelingmehtoday]Men’s suicide rate isin’t higher.

I'm afraid it is, and has been for decades. 3x higher than the female suicide rate. Linked to men being discouraged from a young aged from talking about feelings and told to "be strong" etc. I do know what I'm talking about having worked extensively in male mental health services.

Feel free to do your own research.

www.bbc.com/future/article/20190313-why-more-men-kill-themselves-than-women[/quote]
I have, thank you.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_differences_in_suicide

And i already said it in my last post.
Men succeed more in suicide attemps, because they are more violent than women.

Yep,this is why I am done with men now. Had enough of their shit in all its many forms.

@YouShouldLeave

That is one of the reasons why they succeed more. It's not the full picture as to why the attempts are made in the first place. Society conditions men to be "strong" and not show emotion from a young age. It doesn't do the same with women - little girls are comforted when they cry if they are hurt; boys are often told when they fall over "get up, you're ok, don't cry" (I accept this a generalisation and isn't the case for all children). Over time this gives the message to boys and men that it's socially unacceptable to talk about and express feelings.

@Vitallyli

I'm curious what flaws you put up with. Not putting toilet seat down as someone has mentioned (I guess for some this may be important), what else?

Everyone has flaws and it's very individual as to what people are happy with.

If someone leaving the toilet seat up bothers you then you should tell them. A nice person will make an effort to not do it but a selfish person will carry on regardless.

I've explained to my DH why leaving the toilet seat up is annoying ( nobody likes to feel like they're falling down the toilet in the middle of the night!!) So he made an effort to stop. On the odd occasion he forgets I don't get mad because it's an oversight not a pattern of behaviour.

The issue isn't minor flaws it's patterns of behaviour and world views. My ex had very clear ideas about the role of men and women. Nothing I could ever do would change that - therefore living with him wasn't great at times as he felt that housework was women's work and I didn't agree.
My now DH believes in equality which makes for a far more pleasant home life. Does he have annoying traits? Yes, we all do. But that that doesn't make him unpleasant to live with, in fact he's a delight and my life is much richer for having him in it.

I will never understand the toilet seat issue.

I keep badgering my kids to learn to put the lid down before flushing until it's a reflex, it doesn't even matter if it's my sons or my daughters.

@pleasedonttextmyman

I will never understand the toilet seat issue.

I keep badgering my kids to learn to put the lid down before flushing until it's a reflex, it doesn't even matter if it's my sons or my daughters.

I never understand it because why does the woman’s need trump the man’s need.

Do women put it up for men? So why are men expected to put it down for women? Just look at the seat before sitting down and put it down if it’s up, up if it’s down??!?

@YouShouldLeave

I’m not saying you’re wrong, but if you’re engaging in a debate then you lose all credibility when you use Wikipedia as a source.

I think I’m getting confused here, I thought the issue was the seat 🤣 Need to go back to sleep I think

I don't understand the sexist attitude either:
doesn't help me around the house much would rather make me a massage

what do you mean HELP? If he's staying in YOUR house, then yes, as a guest he helps.

If you both living together, he doesn't need to HELP. He's got 50% of the chores! One of the whole point of living together, your chores split in half...

Obviously that works when you both work full-time, when one works less they have more chores, but it's still not HELP. It's living there!

Yours doesn't sound good at all, OP.

@Just10moreminutesplease

As PP have said all people are flawed. My DH is no more flawed than I am.

Are you asking if it’s normal for your partner to be jealous, shout at you, drink too much, and not pull his weight around the house? Whether this is ‘normal’ or not doesn’t really matter... it’s not a healthy way to live and not gambling or cheating doesn’t make up for it.

Yes, this

YABU to say all men are a bit shit. My husband, brothers and dad are all amazing. Of course they all have their flaws, like every HUMAN on this earth, but none of them are a bit shit.

I never understand it because why does the woman’s need trump the man’s need.

It's about not sending sewage particles flying into the air every time you flush. Also, assuming an equal number of men and women use it, most times the toilet is used, the seat needs to be down. Women every time, men when they take a dump. So more often than not.

And all women are perfect.

@Needapoodle

And all women are perfect.

Especially me.

Everyone has flaws, but shouting at you and not doing a share of the housework (i.e. believing he is entitled to more leisure time than you) are big, relationship ending flaws from my perspective. Neither would be acceptable, bit those aren't things you do to someone you love.

Everyone's flawed

I feel genuinely sorry for people that don't realise that. They're in for a hard time

Yabu.
My husband is my best friend. He has his moments, I have mine. But for the most part we're friends, a team, we support each other and we encourage each other. 50/50 housework, 50/50 parenting (although husband is doing majority of that right now as I'm doing my master's dissertation). He struggle with his self-esteem but he takes it out on himself, not anyone else around him. And he's not great at discussing his feelings which drives me mad.
But I can be quick to temper and lack patience 🤷🏼‍♀️
I also have an amazing smart, funny cousin who has been absolutely shat on by women.

All people have flaws, yes.
My DH is amazing and I don't agree that all men are shit.

My DH is no more shit than I. We live with each others corners and that's ok.