To wonder why MN is so unpleasant about SAHMs?

[crinklyfoil]

While I know there are cases when women aren’t married and don’t own property and are in a vulnerable position, I’m not talking about posters who are concerned about women.

I’m talking about posters who believe that SAHMs have no say in finances, should ‘get a job’ and are somehow lazy.

A FT childcare place costs around £800 a month. If you have more than one child, realistically for many women, ‘getting a job’ will mean working at a loss. Not to mention problems with shift work at the lower paid end of the spectrum (retail work and care work.)

Is it really so awful that having a SAHM might just work really well for some families? That some women might thoroughly enjoy it and that it’s part of a mutually beneficial relationship in the context of the whole family?

Or should everyone just get a job, regardless of how miserable and poor it makes the whole family?!

You'll always find a handful of MN opinions that labels SAHM lazy or working mum as materialistic. Nobody really cares IRL.

Depending where you live, city or more rural, one or the other is rare and seen as as a curious choice.

Advice on financial independence is well-intentioned and based on people's own experience, may be biased to the bitter ones...

Claiming benefits is a different subject matter

@sst1234
It’s comments like that that piss SAHM off…

I wrote this on a post yesterday, but it makes a huge difference whether you're talking about someone who's clocked out of working indefinitely, or whether you're talking about someone taking a finite career break while they still have preschool children home full time.

Looking after your own children full time is most certainly an equal contribution to a family unit. And I feel SAHMs are very diplomatic in never actually mentioning whether or not it might actually be beneficial to the children (Fwiw my personal view is that there are pros and cons for both the working parent, the SAHP and also the children)

In my RL circle, the working mums are sensitive to the fact that the SAHMs can feel a little embarrassed / inadequate that they don’t currently have a career and the SAHMs are sensitive to the fact that some of the working mums feel they are missing out on spending more time with their children. Our way of empowering each other is to basically complain about how terrible our own lives are ... even though I think we are all fairy happy with the choices we have made

Haven't t read the whole thread, so apologies if this has already been said, but just look at the thread about the woman whose husband have his sister 10k for IVF. She is a sahm, and so many people have said it's her husband's money etc. There is definitely a negative attitude towards sahms from a lot of posters.

I don't understand why it winds so many people up. My husband earns shitloads more than me because he is in tech. It's not a career I would ever consider, nor hanker after. He loves it.
If I did earn more then he'd be happy to stay home. As it is, he pulls his weight with the kids too, but I look after them day to day (activities etc). They are 2.5 and 1. As far as I am concerned, it works for us, we have one joint account and both have equal access and we don't t claim anything from the State or get any help from others at all. I don't see why anyone would possibly have grounds to criticize.

I was a sahm for 7 years. We planned it that way and only took on a mortgage that could be afforded on a single wage. I have no regrets, went back to part time when youngest started nursery at 3 and eventually full time/ term time . It’s worked really well for the whole family in so many ways.

@sst1234

There are fewer comments against SAHMs than defensive threads like these. For what it’s worth, it is ridiculous when people try and equate being a SAHM with working parents. Being a SAHP is nothing like as demanding as being a working parent.

What a ridiculous and simply untrue thing to say. Different people find different kinds or work demanding or harder. For me personally I feel much more exhausted and in need of a break when I spend the whole day at home with my little one. It is much more demanding for me. I have said to my DP before, multiple times "I can't wait for work tomorrow to get a break." For other people, they would find their jobs more stressful than being with baby all day. It depends on your personality and the type of job you have. Both have their challenges and are equally as hard.

I've been on MN for over a decade and have never seen this attitude. Quite the opposite

Also, why does it even matter what age the kids are?
Some people on here sound very Victorian.
If the family unit is happy, and the working partner loves their job and is happy to be the earner, what does it matter?

If people want to be " lazy", why shouldn't they?
It sounds like pure jealousy.

Whatever your view on this, the financial independence element cannot be ignored. Starting a family before being financially independent and choosing not to go back to worm will always leave a woman vulnerable. The whole ‘family money’ and ‘we’re a partnership’ argument only lasts as long as a marriage does. And divorce stats are well known. Being a SAHP is the biggest financial risk a woman will ever take.

[quote Snookie00]@Flossing. It’s not disdain. It’s a different choice. Some women want more from life than being a wife and mother. Some don’t. I would absolutely hate not being independent- other women seem happy with that as they value staying at home with kids more. They probably think I’m neglecting my kids by using childcare/working - I don’t really care what they think. Why would their opinion matter to me?

Why would anyone assume that it’s jealousy? I can say that it’s a positive choice to work and that I love my career. I acknowledge that I’m one of these typical middle class mums with a career rather than a job but I work bloody hard and am good at what I do. I probably work with some of the husbands of these SAHMs who do “important” jobs.

It always seems to be SAHMs who are so defensive. Why do they care if other anonymous women don’t rate/ value their choice?[/quote]
The thing is my comment agreed with you the jealousy comment wasn't necessary. You say SAHMs are defensive. But it's actually you who have put little digs in. I'm asking why you feel the need to put down other people's choices?

It's also really simplistic to assume sahms are a static entity. Lots of women take a few years out then return to work.

Why do they need anybody's approval. But never a week goes by with one coming on. Its a mad idea relying financially on another person' earnings for any length of time. Especially with the record divorce rate. It's family money?? Until he walks out the door. Honestly some propld do need a big wake up call. I wouldn't leech off another adult so it wouldn't be for me.

@sst1234
If the SAHM is willing to take that “risk” then what’s the issue?

It doesn’t always leave SAHM vulnerable. If DH and I split them I know I would be fine financially.

Everyone assumes people’s circumstances are similar to their own when they can actually be vastly different. People make judgements and criticisms based on their own lives and circumstances, not taking into the account those of the individual.

@Bodgers

In my RL circle, the working mums are sensitive to the fact that the SAHMs can feel a little embarrassed / inadequate that they don’t currently have a career and the SAHMs are sensitive to the fact that some of the working mums feel they are missing out on spending more time with their children. Our way of empowering each other is to basically complain about how terrible our own lives are ... even though I think we are all fairy happy with the choices we have made

Yes, absolutely this!

Its really not difficult to know you are not jealous of sahms, without having a dig at them.

Its also possible to know you are happy with the decision to be a sahm, without having digs at working parents and claiming its jealousy.

But it appears many people on both sides, prefer to to just out others down. Butvit is both sides.

I've never noticed this

Opting out of financial responsibility is your own choice but don't be surprised if other women who have fought for equality and fair treatment have a different view. Similarly women who have been left with full responsibility for their children after some unexpected turn of events and then wish they had thought more carefully about it earlier. You don't need to be defensive about it - you do you - but accept that yours is not the only logic.

@Viviennemary
It’s not leaching…shall I start sending DH a bill for childcare at the end of each month?!

It’s comments like this that I think OP was probably referring to. What a judgmental thing to say….even if DH and I were both working full time, we couldn’t afford the childcare for twins. Stop judging us for making the decision for me to be a SAHM.

I work hard for my family just like DH works hard for his boss…

@SAHMavectwinnies

Forgot to say that DH and I salary difference isn’t due to gender, etc. DH is a lot older than me so he’s had chance to establish his career more whereas I wanted to start a family when I was still young.

As long as the SAHM is happy, who cares 🤷🏻‍♀️

The WOHP has to be happy too.

@OnlyFoolsnMothers

No issue with whether a woman works or doesn’t but two things that piss me off:

1- “my partner works because he earns more”....always men who earn more

2- childcare will take all my wage- nope it’s a joint expense

Just say, I want to be a SAHM, that’s the truth and that’s ok.

I don't quite understand your issue? Men earn more, it's a fact in most couples. If childcare absorbs the equivalent of her wage then the family are no better off financially if she works.

FWIW I worked from DC being 6 months. My DH earned double what I did. This was 25 years ago and my earnings were equal to the cost of childcare - there were no subsidies then. In hindsight I think my DC would have benefitted far more from me staying at home.

I’d say it was fairly evenly split. Neither can win.

It’s not leaching…shall I start sending DH a bill for childcare at the end of each month?!

Only if you want him to send you a bill for rent bills, food, clothes etc. Whose bill would be higher?

I have never seen any unpleasantness aimed a sahm if staying home works for them.

I have seen lots of great advice, such as sahm being told to get a job so they could get out of an abusive relationship where a lack of cash made them a prisoner in their own home.

I wish I could have been a full time sahm when our children were little, instead I concentrated on a career, paid all my wages out on childcare for the ‘formative years’ .

Telling a sahm that is asking for help because she is skint, massively in debt and needs help to get out of her financial mess to get a job isnt hate towards sahm’s

@Liverbird77

Also, why does it even matter what age the kids are? Some people on here sound very Victorian. If the family unit is happy, and the working partner loves their job and is happy to be the earner, what does it matter?

If people want to be " lazy", why shouldn't they?
It sounds like pure jealousy.

Obviously it’s up to each family but the children’s ages are a relevant factor.

Younger children need proper focussed childcare, teenagers need care etc that may be mentally more taxing but isn’t the all day role of toddler care. They are able to feed themselves, clean themselves etc. It does make a difference to what is possible.

I don't quite understand your issue?
Men earn more, it's a fact in most couples.
If childcare absorbs the equivalent of her wage then the family are no better off financially if she works studies have show that nowadays men and women roughly earn the same until they have children! I think it’s a bit disingenuous that it “makes sense” for it always to be women to give up their jobs. Let’s me honest and own our choices “ I wanted to be a sahm”_ valid enoufh