Elderly neighbour becoming too dependent on us!

[JurassicSal]

We moved into our house about three years ago, next door to an elderly single lady (she has just turned 80years old). When we first met her she was very active, going out and doing things with her friends from the church, holidays away, visits to her family etc, but more recently she seems to be coming more and more dependent on myself and my husband. There are so many things it’s hard to list them all, but we’ve done decorating, house cleaning, gardening, multiple trips to the GP and hospital, shopping and numerous DIY jobs - even simple things like changing the batteries in the TV remote! She’s always wanting things changed in her house and it seems like my husband is forever organising quotes and visits from tradesmen to price the work. This all takes a lot of his time, as she wants him to make all the phone calls and organise visits / appointments.

She recently discovered online shopping, but that’s not without its problems as she constantly changes her mind about goods and wants to return them which involves us having to sort out the paperwork and the packaging / courier collection as she can’t work out how to do it herself. We are both very kind and good natured people but my husband is a lot older than me and retired several years ago and wants to enjoy his retirement - he’s also getting very tired with all this (he does all the driving around as I don’t drive). I also work four days a week and have my own house and garden to look after, so I’m getting very tired with all this. Hardly a day goes by without another request for help for something or other. Our neighbour doesn’t have any disability (other than being little bit unsteady when she walks) and she sees and hears perfectly well.She has no children or any family living nearby (they live several hours away) so I think she is becoming dependent on us for all her help. She keeps telling us she’s constantly singing praises to her family about her “wonderful neighbours” and I feel they are happy for things to stay that way as it absolves them from any responsibility!

I think we have been very generous to her in the past and showered her with kindness but feel now that we are paying the price and as I said feel she is now become almost totally dependent on us for all her day-to-day needs.

Should we just say “no” more often, and if so how to do so without causing offence?. She frequently says “I don’t know what I would do without you two” and “I don’t have anyone else to ask” Is this also a sign of manipulative behaviour? Sometimes we feel like we should move house as it’s the only way to get our lives back…..

Any comments or suggestions gratefully accepted!

www.salvationarmy.org.uk/older-people-christmas

Just say no, except when you are happy to help. Set some boundaries

Don't feel guilty. Perhaps you could offer totake her a plate of Xmas dinner round, which sort of makes it clear that she isn't invited to you but doesn't leave her in the lurch if she hasn't shopped.

So sorry her family are leaving you to do all of her care in this way, it would be good to ask to see them, I wonder if they have LPOA. My 84 year old aunt is 350 miles away and has a very good neighbour, but I think she is too reliant on her, she really had her running around a lot during lockdown.

I moved here in March, and had already been acquainted with one of the elderly neighbours. I couldn't believe it when she phoned one night and said she needed a prescription RIGHT NOW as the chemist was closing in half an hour. I did go and collect it, but wondered if this was the start of demands being made on my time. Unfortunately she has been in and out of hospital over the past few months and when she returned home her daughter started coming to help her, and she organised carers for the past few weeks. She has just gone into a home as even buying the food for the carers to cook just became too much for her. I felt guilty for not wanting to get involved and at 64, wonder if my new neighbours are wary of me!

We have had this situation with both FIL and DM at different times. In both cases they were perfectly capable of much, much more and were financially more than secure and could afford to pay for help. They were definitely manipulating the neighbours (for a mixture of reasons) and I had to speak with the neighbours and encourage them to put boundaries in place (which I supported). FIL in particular was extremely cruel to one neighbour when they pulled back.

I'm afraid it has gone too far now to try and dial it back as she is totally reliant on you for everything. You are going to have to make a deliberate and drastic change and inform her of it.

I have been in this exact position with a neighbour (aged 82) and it got to the point where I had no life of my own. It started with picking up the odd item when I was at the shops, changing a fuse etc, graduating to something every single day, then on from that to phone calls about being afraid of lightening in the middle of the night, my TV won't work, I have seen a mouse, I need shopping/travel to appointments, help me with my tax, fix the shower, leaky roof, oven won't work, etc etc. I did it all and more, but I had my own aged parents and a job to do. I neglected other people for the neighbour.

After 4 years of this, she asked my husband, who works long hours at a hard job, to cut her enormous one acre lawn. My husband is no gardener and was concerned about using her very expensive ride on mower, and I resented her very much for asking him and involving him behind my back. I snapped I'm afraid - the only time I have really snapped in my life. I told her I had had enough, she needed to organise outside support for herself, and I could not help again with ANYTHING.

I cannot tell you the relief, after neglecting everything and everyone and never having a moment to relax without dreading the phone ringing or a knock at the door. She soon arranged a cleaner, gardener and people to do shopping and driving. She even has a private carer coming in with her lunch and dinner. I doubt she gives me a second thought.

Age UK can be contacted and they come to the old person's house and can arrange all sorts of things. They are great. That's the way to go - refer her to Age UK and step back.

You must act now.

Honestly if I had not "snapped" I don't know what wold have happened. She took over our lives. She had family way down south but they came twice a year and it was oh - "Annike is wonderful" while her family gave me the snake eye.

Deal with it now or you will be helping her in and out of the bath eventually - and yes, I ended up doing that.

@Chickychickydodah

Give her the number for age uk,they have staff and carers that will help out.

Really? Not around here I’m afraid. Age UK are brilliant for advice, help with claiming benefits etc, befriending (mainly by telephone here), signposting to services, lists for gardeners/decorators etc. They rely largely on wonderful volunteers and definitely don’t provide care services.

My parents (mainly dad) became like this with their neighbours, called them ‘his carers’ despite the three adult children living nearby. The neighbours became very irritated (quite reasonably in my eyes!) especially when my father refused to pay for care ‘because x and y can do it’!
It took some pretty clear talking to make him see how utterly unreasonable he was being as well as apologies to the neighbours and telling them to say NO and contact one of us three.

You need to set clear boundaries so your neighbour knows exactly what you are and are not prepared to do.

I remember this from when you first posted. I’m glad you’ve been firmer.

You and your husband do sound like lovely genuinely kind people. You should both be proud of yourselves ( but also keep up those boundaries!)

Annike I agree you can only take on so much. My mother used to huff and puff if didnt get her own way. (80). Then nothing done in my own house. Jesus its draining. And needs doing NOW

I think you need to reset the boundaries. I'd help out in an emergency but I wouldn't be giving lifts to the dr/hospital nor would I organise her shopping. I'd contact social services and ask them to come out to assess her for support. They can organise her shopping each week, where she gives her list and they shop for her. You could give her details for a reccomended cleaner and gardener. Explain that you can't help with everything, as it's becoming too much for you both. Of course if you don't say anything, she's going to continue asking for help, with everything. It will escalate, the older she becomes. She has the money, so why burn yourselves out?! Just so she leaves more inheritance to her lazy children.

She is probably very lonely but you have already done enough. Contact Age Concern or Adult Care Services who can arrange help for her.

My DH had to go next door to pick up the elderly neighbour after a fall then to help her out of the bath when her son couldn’t do it alone. I’m extremely glad to say her son has practically moved back in, I just couldn’t cope having to look after her!

Annike that is a horrifying tale.

I don't think she's trying to take advantage. She's likely very lonely.

I like the idea of contacting her family and see if they can arrange a companion and gardener for her. That way you can still be friends and help out in an emergency but not be expected to do everything.

Oh sympathies. We have this problem also.

We’ve had to cut right back. It upset me to do it, but I thought we were being taken for fools really.

It went from basic requests which we were more than happy to do-to actual demands like you need to do this immediately. The things became bigger and bigger.

Family live very nearby, but they can’t be contacted because they are “very busy”. This isn’t the case as we found out. The the family got arsey because we were doing too much. So I got the sons telephone number and now ring him when we get a “demand” from NDN. He’s very happy with the arrangement as he can then pop round and sort it out. He wasn’t being told of all the dramas because NDN wanted to be independent!! And not admit how they weren’t coping.

It’s better now. We still help, but to a lesser degree. It’s back on a neighbourly footing. We had actually become free carers. We were picking NDN up off the floor daily, ringing ambulances, plus a whole load of other stuff which was madness

Everyone told us we were being used. We thought we were being good neighbours. Now NDN uses the other neighbours to run errands. We just don’t have time and also have our own elderly parents.

Sometimes you just have to say no. Hard as it is.

Yes, she could easily employ a cleaner and a gardener and use a perfectly good local taxi service as well, but why use any of these when we do it for nothing?!

This is what you need to talk to her about organising, tell her that its getting to much for your dh, and that so she is comfortable you'll help her find a gardener/handyman and a cleaner/housekeeper pa type

that way shell be well cared for

if them she doesn't want that arrangement - it makes it very hard to come back to you with requests

İ think her making all these arrangements with handymen etc is her way of feeling busy and useful in her very limited life. Can you get in touch with age concern for her and see if they will take her out for social meetings and let them know she is struggling with getting her shopping etc. İ would offer to do her shopping for her once a week and tell her to have a list ready for you and that you can only help with other things if it is an emergency.

*Can I put the other side of this?

I was widowed last year and have some long-standing mobility and balance problems, following an accident and a failed hip replacement. So, here I am, living on my own for the first time in my life; and I have just moved to a new-build semi. There are 7 houses in this little development.

Several of my neighbours, including the attached neighbours, have been very kind - they are a young couple in their first home. He mowed my lawn on one occasion - I think he could not bear to watch me struggling! In fact I quite enjoy doing it!

There are lots of things that are now a struggle for me: hanging curtains, some aspects of housework, gardening etc. And I have been used to having a tech-obsessed OH with me - I am by no means a tech virgin as I used it all for work and am pretty competent - but my OH's electronic and other tech kit is very complicated indeed as he did not go in for bog-standard stuff!

Do I bother friends, family, neighbours with these things? Or do I just soldier on without these things being done? I know that if I asked then people would help - but I am loth to do this, as I already ready feel like a spare part in the coupled up world. It is a tough place to be and gets me down greatly. I am still adjusting to being on my own and to the inevitable grief - it is bloody tough - and I do not want to be a nuisance to others.

If you were my neighbour/family member what would you want me to do*

Honestly? It would depend on how good friends we are. Otherwise I don’t think anybody would mind if asked for help a couple of times a year, or in a genuine emergency. A lot would also depend on how you react on occasions when I say no, and how you react when I need help myself. I would do anything to help my elderly neighbour - but we get on like a house on fire, and he takes in so many parcels for me he must feel like the post office sometimes.

@JurassicSal

She booked a 3 day Christmas break in a local seaside hotel (we live on the coast) after we told her we had family staying with us over Christmas. Problem solved we thought, but Omicron had other ideas and she has cancelled. Now we’re back to feeling guilty because she’ll be sitting next door on her own on Christmas Day

There’s a very easy way to avoid that guilt - lay a place at your table for her. It’s what Christmas is supposed to be about, after all.

@Mischance

Can I put the other side of this?

I was widowed last year and have some long-standing mobility and balance problems, following an accident and a failed hip replacement. So, here I am, living on my own for the first time in my life; and I have just moved to a new-build semi. There are 7 houses in this little development.

Several of my neighbours, including the attached neighbours, have been very kind - they are a young couple in their first home. He mowed my lawn on one occasion - I think he could not bear to watch me struggling! In fact I quite enjoy doing it!

There are lots of things that are now a struggle for me: hanging curtains, some aspects of housework, gardening etc. And I have been used to having a tech-obsessed OH with me - I am by no means a tech virgin as I used it all for work and am pretty competent - but my OH's electronic and other tech kit is very complicated indeed as he did not go in for bog-standard stuff!

Do I bother friends, family, neighbours with these things? Or do I just soldier on without these things being done? I know that if I asked then people would help - but I am loth to do this, as I already ready feel like a spare part in the coupled up world. It is a tough place to be and gets me down greatly. I am still adjusting to being on my own and to the inevitable grief - it is bloody tough - and I do not want to be a nuisance to others.

If you were my neighbour/family member what would you want me to do?

'Several of my neighbours, including the attached neighbours, have been very kind'

I think that's the point isn't it? You have 'several' neighbours helping you not just one. If the OP and her husband were part of a larger group providing support they might be asked to do something once or twice a month instead of every single day.

I think it doesn't help that your husband seems to be home during the week OP so it might seem to the neighbour and others that he is bored or lonely and happy to help out with the neighbour. Also if the neighbour is saying to other people 'No I don't need help with that because next door's husband is very happy to help me' then other people might not be stepping in because they are being told they're not needed?

When she comes over to ask for help sending parcels back or gardening jobs or house chores stop answering the door every time if it's not convenient and when you do answer the door start telling her 'I'm sorry I'm really busy right now, can that wait a few weeks? If you need help now maybe phone (insert family's name here)?'

The neighbour is saying she has a high pension and retirement package but if she had to spend money on a gardener, cleaner, handyman, taxi service, food delivery, etc each week then she might find her pension isn't as generous as she thought it was.

If you want to go on helping then designate a day a week or fortnight for shopping. But really if she needs this level of help it should either be from a relative or she needs to pay somebody. I wouldn't get involved in organising tradesmen.

YANBU. But it’s overkill for you to have to move to reset the relationship back to “kind neighbors” ( from the current “surrogate family, forever at the beck and call.” The relationship appears to have slowly devolved from helpful neighbor to dependency, but I suspect social isolation from CoVid has played a role.

Let me suggest that your innate kindness lead you to a kind withdrawal from your constant services to/for her. Maybe initiate it with “I just want to let you know/give you a heads up that our (unspecified) availability/circumstances have changed, and we want to give you a heads up that starting (fill in the day) you’re going to need to have other people prearranged to do the things that you’ve needed us to do for you. We have concerns about you and think that it would be a good idea for you to talk with your family about how much assistance you’ve been needing on a regular basis so that they can plan more time with you and help you sort out plans for things like appointments “. Then act accordingly, let the phone go to voicemail and check it for emergency needs of course. Over time the non-emergent calls will subside.

Be prepared to be asked about your specific change in circumstances as that’s just, at its most innocent, natural curiosity. But there will be a bit of confusion as well, some need for clarification from her (Are you or family ill, going away, etc, is it temporary, can she help). You might just kindly say that you’re not comfortable discussing it, If she asks what she can do , just tell her to relieve your minds from worry about her by letting you know that she’s made solid arrangements for her own needs.

Don’t hide out when home though. She needs to see that just because you’re at home it doesn’t mean that you’re there for her convenience. Be strong and just say no to requests, kindly, without giving a specific reason. Consider phrases like “ We already have plans” ( which include doing nothing) and “That doesn’t work for us” (avoid adding “…this time”) get the same message across a bit more kindly, once you’ve let her know of your relative unavailability.

Setting firmer boundaries is one thing, but leaving her on her own on Christmas Day is another. Can you really not make room for her at your table on Christmas Day?

The way we treat our elderly people in this country is disgraceful sometimes.

@logsonlogsoff

Setting firmer boundaries is one thing, but leaving her on her own on Christmas Day is another. Can you really not make room for her at your table on Christmas Day?

She’s not the poor little match girl, who will die of cold.