. . . to expect a bit more help in children's ward?

[TiredStressedFrustrated]

DD (18 months) was admitted to hospital yesterday (sent to A&E by GP due to fast, shallow breathing and high heart rate, but dehydrated, all as a result of upper respiratory tract infection and not being able to keep any fluids/food/calpol down). Since we've been here, I've been really dismayed at how hands-off everyone is - I've been handed a syringe and told to get eight syringes of water into DD every hour overnight, I was handed a plastic cup and told to get a pee sample (this has proved impossible, the tiny pee that she did I missed and it was absorbed into her nappy, even when she threw up everywhere, housekeeping handed me a pack of wipes and said "are you okay cleaning the floor up with these?" - this is while I was holding a very upset toddler covered in vomit.

Now don't get me wrong - DD is my responsibility and of course I want to look after her, clean up after her etc. It just feels like there's no support from the hospital staff at all - they just hand you the equipment for whatever needs doing and expect you to do it all, whilst they dip in and out and take obs every few hours.

Is this normal? I'm struggling to get DD to take the syringes but they just say "oh dear . . . " I haven't been able to get a urine sample but they tell me really need it so keep trying . . . I don't know. Maybe I'm just tired and stressed but I feel like we're just muddling through ourselves and we may as well be at home

Why aren't they putting her on IV fluids? She's been admitted with dehydration and cannot be hydrated via the route they've asked you to take.

Agree about the absorbent pads in nappy.

And no - you shouldn't be cleaning up vomit.

I know you're overwhelmed but really do try and be assertive. Assertive isn't rude but you will reach a point you break and then who is doing DD care?

@imaginethemdragons

Similar here.

I was given no information. Totally left alone.

Couldn’t leave my little one as there was no one to be with him so ended up not eating or drinking a single thing from Sunday midnight until Wednesday evening when we were allowed home.

I wasn’t aware of an apparent parents area with tea & coffee but no milk, you have to provide your own. No one told me. No one. As I couldn’t leave my child, i wasn’t told anything. I wasn’t offered anything at all when they came round with bits of food for my child.

No sleep as he was crying in pain for 48 hours, then I was so stressed I couldn’t take my eyes off him breathing when he finally got some sleep.

He needed IV fluids & pain relief. There was NO Drs available to prescribe either for 12 hours so he had nothing, no fluids for over 18 hours and I was told I could not give him any of the calpol or ibuprofen that I had in my bag as it had not been prescribed.
So he sobbed in pain and got no fluids. ( Drs we’re all in theatre all night apparently so none available.)

I wrote a long email of complaint because there were numerous failings. I never got an acknowledgment nor any answer.

Specialist children’s hospital too.
Makes me furious thinking about it.

This is shit but WHY didn’t you ASK? I don’t understand why you would go for days with no food and not ask someone??

It's the lack of information that's the worst ,I don't expect a welcome wagon but a general run down of the ward would help massively. I tried to find another parent to talk to but the ward wasn't set up in a way that made that possible but maybe it'll work for you.

I didn’t see anyone!
The play worker came in with crayons, he was nil by mouth in case of surgery, IV fluids ran out so they bustled in ( had been finished for a few hours) took them down gave him a jug of water and that was that. Discharged home that day.
Saw the Dr briefly who said it could be one thing or another, couldn’t ask her for a butty and a brew!
I was a huge bag of nerves!! He was so unwell.

We don't feed parents unless they're breast feeding as a rule but if there are left over meals as in that child that ordered it has gone home and there is no other child waiting for a meal then I'll offer it to a parent if I can

The doctors/nurses are only there to provide medical treatment. There's no capacity for staff to provide parental care. If you were at home with a poorly child you would have to do all sorts to get water into them etc, it's no different if they are in hospital except doctors are on hand if things suddenly get worse.

If you have a baby in NICU or PICU they teach you to do all sorts to provide cares for your baby. Swap their monitor from one foot to the other, aspirate and give feeds via an NG tube, changes nappies around central lines etc.

I know from experience, they won't let it get critical on the dehydration. There are signs a baby desperately needs fluids and the nurses will spot them and give IV fluids if needed. Try not to panic. You can tell when your baby is really really poorly as the medical staff really do spring into action.

Its been my experience that you dont always get helped on a children's ward I had to walk out my sons room because we needed something I carried him with me because I couldn't leave him he hurled like a champ and I stood still so I didnt track it everywhere they tried to pass me floor wipes you ok with these? I said for me? No the floor 🙄 im coated the floor may have to wait till I stop dripping bits they reassessed and called housekeeping who thanked me for not moving i was told off for leaving the room press the button if you need anything we all looked at his room where the light was flashing......the next shift were great

So sorry your little one is poorly.

Its perfectly normal to try to get as much direct care as possible done by the parent because that will be what is best for the wellbeing of the child. They are in an unfamiliar environment which is stressful, especially when feeling rotten. The less they have to put up with adults other than their own parents the better. All observations and measurements should be done by the nursing staff obviously as they are the only ones with the training there. Cleaning should be done by the cleaning staff not by the parent ideally but in reality I suspect that insisting on that would mean waiting around with a pile of sick on the floor until the relevant staff member got around to it. You could test that theory.

Oh and its bollocks you couldnt give calpol. You could, but you need to tell the nurse what you have given and what time so they dont double up.

I had twins in NICU and then SCBU as a mum you were very much expected to take a certain responsibility for your baby(ies) - I changed them, fed them including being trained up in tube feeding them, did some of their observations - temperature every feed, changing the monitor on their foot from one to the other etc. You could almost tell the mums who didn't want to get involved as the nurses were much brusquer with them and didn't make a point to chat with them like they did me And the other hands on mums

nurses now are expected to take a much larger role, I know a nurse of 34 years who always gets cross when modern nurses are compared to older nurses, nurses now take on much of a doctors role which certainly wasn’t the case even not that long ago.

Thats the problem; because often theres no one to do the regular tasks.

Mine was a couple of years back … DD broke her arm at school, and we had to stay in overnight so she could have an operation the next day.
We got no support from the staff on the ward, like others no food, no drinks … not told where to go.
I had nothing with me, and they couldn’t even lend me a towel for a wash.
She was supposed to be in surgery first thing, so I didn’t want to leave her side to go and find a drink until she went down to theatre … she ended up not going down until early afternoon.
There was no information given (what time she was going to theatre) was just left to sat there.
I insisted we were discharged the night of her operation, it ended up being about 10:30pm, as there was a staff changeover so we had to wait for meds.
We couldn’t have done another night, the lady opposite her child had an oxygen mask on, and an alarm went off when it slipped off - mum used to go outside smoking, and the alarm would just beep and beep and nobody came.
It was a horrible, lonely, bordering neglectful experience. There were 2 staff on overnight, to look after a full ward.

That all sounds absolutely normal (in 12 years of many paeds admissions (chronic conditions)) with the exception of cleaning up the vomit. If it's on the floor it's a housekeeping job so it can be cleaned up properly.

8 years ago (ie not COVID related) I drew the line against inserting the feeding tube up my prem baby's nose and then checking the pH to make sure I had it in his stomach not his lung. No way I said to that! They (London hospital) expected parents to do this as part of routine care. We weren't going home with a feeding tube so I insisted on leaving that to the experts!

Maybe they thought your daughter would be more relaxed with you giving the water, taking the pee sample?
The floor thing sounds odd - unless it was just the immediate clean up because domestic staff were busy elsewhere.

@kalejuicer* I drew the line against inserting the feeding tube up my prem baby's nose and then checking the pH to make sure I had it in his stomach not his lung*.

Yup I didn't really want to do the training but felt like it was expected as they asked every day when I was going to do it for my prem twins

@ivfgottwins I was so squeamish about I just couldn't without crying. I still am queasy around them - they put in an NG tube on Grey's Anatomy the other day and I had to shut my eyes. It's strange as I was so stoic about everything else and not much bothers me medically. Hats off to you doing it for twins, I don't think parents who have been through NICU with their babies get nearly enough recognition

I've stayed with my dc many times when he was young, and was expected to do most of care stuff, but never mopping the floor.

Exactly the same experience I had last week apart from the vomiting. That's the NHS for you

I was in recently for 2 nights with similar age child. Little support for me - even though I was alone and in a SR (without a bathroom) and couldn’t reasonably leave child on their own to go to loo, get food or anything really. No introduction to ward, whether drinks could be made, left to give child medication, often no food offered (I didn’t expect it but would have appreciated someone offering to mind child for 10 mins whilst I went to buy something). Also handed bedding to change bed when child wet it (whilst I was trying to get a sample)!! It was a poor experience tbh and left me feeling quite upset (I work in the nhs so ‘get it’ and I’m not easily upset).

@TiredStressedFrustrated

Thanks everyone - I think I was just panicking a bit. I really can't get fluids into her and I know that she won't improve until I do. I'll be a bit more assertive in asking for help/advice from the staff.

Several factors at play, I guess - budget cuts, covid, and maybe bad luck in terms of timing (although they don't seem busy, only three of the six beds in the ward are occupied). Anyway, I'll give myself a shake and regroup! Thank you for all the well-wishes.

I think a lot of staff in hospitals is also out isolating constantly ... 100s at our local hospital are off because of it.

I'm starting to get upset now. We've been here for 36 hours and although we've seen a doctor several times, it's never been the same one twice. Same with nursing staff - tonight's nursing staff are different to last night's, so there's no continuity at all. I have to clockwatch and ask for medications, they don't bring them when they're due - I accidentally dozed off earlier (this is night 3 of minimal sleep, I'm exhausted) which meant DD was half an hour late for her due dose of calpol, which meant her temp had shot up to over 40 and she was trembling.

I'm mentally and physically drained. I don't feel that DD is being looked after very well. We haven't even had a diagnosis yet, just that they think it's an upper respiratory tract infection. But she's not getting better - in fact if anything she's getting worse. And it's so hard because I don't trust them not to miss something or realise in time that DD is deteriorating.

Hi OP I'm in newborn fog sorry but I really suggest you share your views with the nurse in charge tomorrow if not pals. They should be coming to you with meds. Five minutes late is one thing...

No wonder you're drained. You are having a crap experience which is adding to the stress you'd be feeling anyway.

Hand hold for you OP. I had my DD in hospital with bronchiolitis at that age and it was scary and tiring and upsetting. I was in for a week and remember clearly she got worse before she got better, which scared me as I went really expecting it. I too remember the feeling of no one really doing much it seemed. Do you feel you ought to be more assertive? Do you find that hard? Or is that not really the issue? It may be that you need to reassert yourself with every shift change. It's exhausting but you will get through it. Prepare yourself that you may be there for a few more days yet. One step at a time. I remember how shocked I was at the extent we were left to fend for ourselves - like you say no one tells you where the kitchen is or anything! Just keep on asking. Good luck xxx

I’m so sorry, this sounds so stressful. I think I would contact PALS and explain your concerns. Or have a family member / friend do so for you.

YANBU, time to show that anger to the staff. This is unacceptable.