To not lend her my stuff?

[TentTalk]

TLDR: DH and I are avid campers and bought a new (expensive) tent in the 2019 black Friday sales, we've used it twice and now friend who has never camped before wants to borrow it. We said no and 'friend' has called us selfish and says we've ruined her and her kids holiday. AIBU?

As above, DH and I are keen campers and have camped for many years, back packing in the UK and across Europe. With the arrival of DC2 we bought a new large family tent for more comfort. It's great but it was really expensive, but we feel its an investment and we will treat it well. We bought it in November 2019, ready for the 202 season (hah!) we managed to use it twice last year and have 3 trips booked this year (all UK). A friend recently said she would like to try camping, I suggested she book one of the times we are going, so we could share some o the equipment like the stove and stuff, rather than her forking out for all new kit when she may not like it, or that she goes to one of the 'glamping' sites where it is all set up for you. She then said she had already booked a week and had hoped to borrow all our stuff. She was quite shocked when I refused and became quite nasty saying we were ruining her holiday and that we were selfish. I said I don't mind lending her the kids sims and sleeping bags and the camp stove but the other stuff, especially the tent is just too much.

My concerns are that it will get damaged, either by wind or misuse (fire too close, kids not being careful, someone getting drunk and stumbling over it etc). We do have insurance, but it is only valid when we use it, not if we loan it out. The other issue is that the time they are going away is the week before we do, so if it does get damaged I won't have time to test it all out or erect the tent, or replace the stuff if it is damaged. Friend is not always the most considerate person.

AIBU?

If it's relevant, we have over £2k of camping equipment and the tent was about £750.

It’s okay for her to ask, and it’s okay for you to say no.

It’s not okay for her to have presumed she can have it and be mean to you when you say no!

YANBU x

DH just heard from the mate who hired the motorhome. The deposit alone was £1000. There's also a cleaning/sanitisation fee. It's funny how people return such things in good nick when they know they'll get charged or sued for it.

@osbertthesyrianhamster

DH just heard from the mate who hired the motorhome. The deposit alone was £1000. There's also a cleaning/sanitisation fee. It's funny how people return such things in good nick when they know they'll get charged or sued for it.

Absolutely.

Self interest always informs behaviour.

You are not being unreasonable at all. It’s hard to refuse when friends ask to borrow something and we don’t want to lend it, but why should we just lend our hard paid for stuff or hard earned money. Stick by your guns.

Tell her to get a 4-man tent from Tesco for £30. I'm an avid camper and that is the best cheap tent I've ever owned.

@sbhydrogen

Tell her to get a 4-man tent from Tesco for £30. I'm an avid camper and that is the best cheap tent I've ever owned.

DD's used a £30 Tesco one for Scouts and DoE just fine. She has a brilliant sleeping bag that I scored used.

Camping pitches are expensive this year - if she can afford to book the pitch and travel there, then she can spend £50-£100 on a beginners four person tent.

The brazen cheeky fuckery of her would make me ditch her as a friend full stop. Nobody needs ‘friends’ like this. No matter how much fun they can be.

YANBU!!!

Fuckwit for booking a holiday without confirming the vital elements beforehand. She sounds awful and at £750 you are DNBU.

Why are there always people like that. I lent friends things that came back with missing parts or never came back. So called friends want to borrow things all the time, such as children's fancy dresses, books, kitchen gadgets, tools in the garage, even though they are millionaires and totally can afford it.

Hi OP, I have a friend v. like yours. But, unlike you I learnt early on not to lend 'her' stuff, that said there have been some very sticky moments where I've had to say that I needed her kids to be reigned in. She believes us to be 'v. rich' whilst she is 'v. poor' yet.... She lives in the same size of house, but with a better postcode. She's divorced and struggles to get her ex to pay CM, but equally her kids have ALL the latest things where mine either do without or get them for birthdays/have to save up. I suspect we're slightly better off than she is, but she see's herself as v. poor and the gap between us is not so significant iyswim. My frustration is that she keeps following us wherever we go on holiday. She sees my kids as 'babysitters' of her kids and believes our stuff to be free to use. Given that her kids get things far more often than mine her kids have v. little regard to my kids stuff and more often than not break stuff. Between us we have 7 kids and I don't have eyes in the back of head and more often than not any claim by my kids that 'xxx' has broken something is often turned around in my kids disfavour and with absolute proof has led to some difficult conversations. I'm proud that 2 years ago, prior to going on holiday - knowing once again that she'd worked out where we going and booked herself alongside us - I had a very difficult, but equally empowering (for me) conversation where I explained that all items borrowed by her kids would need a request to either myself or DH first. She was v. taken aback and for a few months things were 'difficult'. But at the end of the day she gets more from our friendship than I. AND after a very long post, this is what I'm trying to say. You can walk away, head held high and from all the posts on here I'd say you would win, but if you do want to maintain the 'friendship' then you need to change the dynamics. You need, politely, to be honest. Its a horrible conversation, but if the friendship survives then it will only be the better for it! You need to say, in terms that only you would get, that she shouldn't have assumed. That you will forgive her this time, but that she hasn't understood the costs involved etc. That should she wish to borrow your tent/equipment you'd need to see proof that she's taken out her own individual insurance that would guarantee a replacement. If it helps we've recently invested in an old diplipidated motorhome and became aware that a very dear friend, not the one I've been talking about, has always dreamed of taking her kids on a road trip around Scotland. Having learnt to be upfront/honest I had no issue with saying that as long as we weren't using it and as long as 'SHE GOT IT FULLY INSURED FOR THE DURATION OF HER USAGE' along with returning it in EXACTLY the same state as she found it - with pictures included, I had no issue with her borrowing it. Its freed me up to be a kind friend without the fear of being a walk over. Its incredibly refreshing. HTH

If she asks on freecycle she might find something? We have an ancient old-fashioned but perfectly functional tent (separate double bedroom, large living area) that would do the job if someone wanted it. Obviously really hard work to put up etc compared to nowadays, but does the job. There must be loads of those in people's garages up and down the country.....

But yes - entitled cow.....

@Wills

Hi OP, I have a friend v. like yours. But, unlike you I learnt early on not to lend 'her' stuff, that said there have been some very sticky moments where I've had to say that I needed her kids to be reigned in. She believes us to be 'v. rich' whilst she is 'v. poor' yet.... She lives in the same size of house, but with a better postcode. She's divorced and struggles to get her ex to pay CM, but equally her kids have ALL the latest things where mine either do without or get them for birthdays/have to save up. I suspect we're slightly better off than she is, but she see's herself as v. poor and the gap between us is not so significant iyswim. My frustration is that she keeps following us wherever we go on holiday. She sees my kids as 'babysitters' of her kids and believes our stuff to be free to use. Given that her kids get things far more often than mine her kids have v. little regard to my kids stuff and more often than not break stuff. Between us we have 7 kids and I don't have eyes in the back of head and more often than not any claim by my kids that 'xxx' has broken something is often turned around in my kids disfavour and with absolute proof has led to some difficult conversations. I'm proud that 2 years ago, prior to going on holiday - knowing once again that she'd worked out where we going and booked herself alongside us - I had a very difficult, but equally empowering (for me) conversation where I explained that all items borrowed by her kids would need a request to either myself or DH first. She was v. taken aback and for a few months things were 'difficult'. But at the end of the day she gets more from our friendship than I. AND after a very long post, this is what I'm trying to say. You can walk away, head held high and from all the posts on here I'd say you would win, but if you do want to maintain the 'friendship' then you need to change the dynamics. You need, politely, to be honest. Its a horrible conversation, but if the friendship survives then it will only be the better for it! You need to say, in terms that only you would get, that she shouldn't have assumed. That you will forgive her this time, but that she hasn't understood the costs involved etc. That should she wish to borrow your tent/equipment you'd need to see proof that she's taken out her own individual insurance that would guarantee a replacement. If it helps we've recently invested in an old diplipidated motorhome and became aware that a very dear friend, not the one I've been talking about, has always dreamed of taking her kids on a road trip around Scotland. Having learnt to be upfront/honest I had no issue with saying that as long as we weren't using it and as long as 'SHE GOT IT FULLY INSURED FOR THE DURATION OF HER USAGE' along with returning it in EXACTLY the same state as she found it - with pictures included, I had no issue with her borrowing it. Its freed me up to be a kind friend without the fear of being a walk over. Its incredibly refreshing. HTH

Why for the love of Joesph, Mary and the wee fucking donkey are you still friends with a person that is stalking you family holidays and whose kids break your children's stuff?

Being proud of putting in a boundary that her children ask to borrow your children's things feels like a very low bar indeed.

I wish I had cheeky friends like this, I would have a field day with them😈

@Wills

Hi OP, I have a friend v. like yours. But, unlike you I learnt early on not to lend 'her' stuff, that said there have been some very sticky moments where I've had to say that I needed her kids to be reigned in. She believes us to be 'v. rich' whilst she is 'v. poor' yet.... She lives in the same size of house, but with a better postcode. She's divorced and struggles to get her ex to pay CM, but equally her kids have ALL the latest things where mine either do without or get them for birthdays/have to save up. I suspect we're slightly better off than she is, but she see's herself as v. poor and the gap between us is not so significant iyswim. My frustration is that she keeps following us wherever we go on holiday. She sees my kids as 'babysitters' of her kids and believes our stuff to be free to use. Given that her kids get things far more often than mine her kids have v. little regard to my kids stuff and more often than not break stuff. Between us we have 7 kids and I don't have eyes in the back of head and more often than not any claim by my kids that 'xxx' has broken something is often turned around in my kids disfavour and with absolute proof has led to some difficult conversations. I'm proud that 2 years ago, prior to going on holiday - knowing once again that she'd worked out where we going and booked herself alongside us - I had a very difficult, but equally empowering (for me) conversation where I explained that all items borrowed by her kids would need a request to either myself or DH first. She was v. taken aback and for a few months things were 'difficult'. But at the end of the day she gets more from our friendship than I. AND after a very long post, this is what I'm trying to say. You can walk away, head held high and from all the posts on here I'd say you would win, but if you do want to maintain the 'friendship' then you need to change the dynamics. You need, politely, to be honest. Its a horrible conversation, but if the friendship survives then it will only be the better for it! You need to say, in terms that only you would get, that she shouldn't have assumed. That you will forgive her this time, but that she hasn't understood the costs involved etc. That should she wish to borrow your tent/equipment you'd need to see proof that she's taken out her own individual insurance that would guarantee a replacement. If it helps we've recently invested in an old diplipidated motorhome and became aware that a very dear friend, not the one I've been talking about, has always dreamed of taking her kids on a road trip around Scotland. Having learnt to be upfront/honest I had no issue with saying that as long as we weren't using it and as long as 'SHE GOT IT FULLY INSURED FOR THE DURATION OF HER USAGE' along with returning it in EXACTLY the same state as she found it - with pictures included, I had no issue with her borrowing it. Its freed me up to be a kind friend without the fear of being a walk over. Its incredibly refreshing. HTH

She sounds like a user. Why would you want someone who uses you and upsets your children around.

Sounds awful to me.

Stalks your holidays???
How do the rest of yòur family think about ye never having a holiday on your own.

More boundaries required big time I'm afraid.

@Random63638

Is it a Mexican tent? Keep an eye on it if so...

No, she sounds rude. How dare she say you've ruined their holiday. Outrageous behaviour

my father used to say "Neither a lender or a borrower be"

She’s not your friend.

She’s a user. And rude. Sorry

It's good to read that so many people have learned the same lesson in life, about lending and borrowing. I used to lend things out, or rather grant people's requests to borrow my stuff, but as so many others found, I often had to chase around asking for it back. Now I dont. And more, I ask why people need to borrow my stuff and my conclusion is that they cant get their shit together. I've been burnt by this issue.

My problem, slightly related to this post, is that I hate standing up for myself.

@Wills

Well done but you'd be better to ditch her altogether. Sounds like a right nut case and must be suffocating.

Camping gear is not cheap. I don't think much of people who just 'assume' they can borrow xyz. I do not lend anything out, and that is down to people borrowing items from me and I either never get them back or get them back damaged. On being fed up being taken for a mug, I now lend nothing. I also don't like people putting you in the position by asking to borrow x. If your camping gear is expensive, do not lend it out. You won't be popular, but your gear will remain intact and you won't be needing to pester people for it back for your own holidays. Im really surprised here at the sense of entitlement to other people's things.

YANBU I bought a tent for over £1400 used it once lent it to a friend never to be seen again. (I know you’ve had loads of responses but this is helping me with my anger 😂)

I once let my ex borrow my expensive family tent so he could take ds away. He assured me it had been looked after and thoroughly dried and cleaned before putting away. I took ds away camping 2 weeks or so after and the tent was muddy and mouldy with food wrappers in the pockets

Good escape there OP, you can guarantee it'll come back with issues with tent, equipment or both
You'd have to prove all was immaculate a d she'd likely break friends after anyway if anything broke as she's so flouncy anyway; dodged a bullet there!!