To refuse to sell this lady a puppy?

[ensete]

I have a litter of working golden retrievers, i collated a waiting list before I had our bitch mated and I spent a long time speaking to interested parties to find the best homes I could do - this is how I have dealt with previous litters.
Both parents are working gundogs and I stated that whilst I didn't need working homes I would only consider active homes with the space to accommodate a large working breed.
One of the families who is on my list contacted me today just to say "hi, my husband and I have decided to split up, I will still be wanting the puppy but my address will now by Flat4a XYZ Town"
I messaged back to enquire what sort of set up it was and she confirmed it's a flat on the top floor with no garden or outside space. I've confirmed with her that I'm not happy to sell a puppy to a home without any outside space and I will refund her deposit immediately and advertise the puppy. She's refusing to give me her bank details and says she wants the pup and will take legal action if required. My argument is that the home I vetted is no longer the home she's offering and therefore I'm not willing to sell her the puppy. To me, changing the home on offer isn't dissimilar to her changing the amount of money she is willing to pay for the pup. The homes I find for puppies are very important to me, I'm not a big breeder, I've just had a litter for my own purposes to keep the next generation and I need to know my puppies are going to the right sort of home.

She sounds demented. A large working dog in a poky top floor flat. Madness. You are so right to.thimk of puppy welfare. If you give deposit back she won't have a case against you. Advertise dog again to more suitable family.

I rehome for a rescue and there is no way I would give a puppy to a person who lived in a flat with no garden.Also likely that she will be out a lot if on her own, which is also dire news for a puppy.
If she won't give you her bank details, you won't be able to refund her deposit.Its her problem. Make sure you put it in writing that you are offering to do so if she will give you the bank details.Or send a cheque to their present address
Don't let her bully you

YANBU

There is a strong chance she wouldn't be allowed a puppy/dog in a flat. Especially if it has communal entrance and gardens.

Hi OP,

Good on you for putting your puppy’s welfare before cash. She can’t have the puppy.

I am sure people manage but it’s bloody hard to look after a big dog with no outdoor space. If she doesn’t realise that then it’s very likely she isn’t going to be a responsible pet parent. I am thinking of the potty training, the vomits, runny tummy, all those nice things our pets save up for us! Getting outdoors and quickly, is a necessity especially with a large breed. Safety and weather wise too - it’s best to have private green space rather than having to take the dog out at 10pm for last wee of the day before bed time in the cold/rain/snow/darkness.

Send a cheque.

Ignore the knob heads saying your being unreasonable. You sound like your very clued up on dogs. Just be wary she may get someone else to buy puppy if you readvertise

The tenant next door has a dog that never gets walked, gets left on its own for hours... I don't people should have a dog if they don't have the outside space, don't walk it and leave it on its own for hours on end. I'd love to have a dog but never know where I'll be working next and it would be cruel to leave it for hours on end/in kennels for long periods. I've overheard the tenant say that they never realised how easy it is to own a dog! Huh, poor little thing, I feel sorry for it, it has a crap life.

@LolaSmiles

YANBU The fact she's still pushing the issue suggests she isn't going to be a responsible owner either as a responsible owner would understand a breeder wanting to safeguard the dog's welfare as best as possible.

This 🔼 If she was indeed going to be a responsible owner, she wouldn't want a large breed working dog in a top floor flat. Lucky the puppies weren't available sooner. I'm not sure any puppy would have a good home with this person. She seems irresponsible or delided to me.

We have tried to find a retriever puppy recently and have had several conversations about our set up, on waiting lists etc. We live near the forest and sea, have a massive garden, have 2 dogs so I’m very experienced with larger breeds and I’m at home all day and breeders have still been picky with us! You are the breeder, you totally get to choose who your puppies go with. I could not imagine having a large breed dog without constant access to the garden. I wouldn’t let one of those gorgeous bundles go either, you know you are right and you have final decision. The deposit works both ways.

You’re doing the right thing, OP.
Just see her try. What a joke she is.

Thank you so much for being a caring person. It would be misery for an energetic breed to be kept in an upstairs flat, it's so heartening to hear you putting the needs of the dog first. Dogs are not a commodity. I expect she would like to have it, possible bone of contention with the ex? Wrong reasons.

Gorgeous puppies and you are absolutely right to not complete the sale.
Send a cheque recorded mail to her... but I have to say it, I can't believe no-one has yet...

(Don't...)

CANCEL THE CHEQUE!!!

I would say, you need to come out and check the new property. Do you know another breeder who could go with you for back up.
Then say sorry, but it's not a good home for a large working breed, explain that the dog would needs lots of exercise, how often is she going to walk the dog. But take a cheque with you, then say sorry its not a good environment.

You are 100% right. Let her huff and puff all she wants but you've decided it's not a good match for the puppy and rightly so.
She hasn't a leg to stand on

I wonder if @ honeybee88 is the potential owner?

Either way, its not her puppy it’s the OP’s puppy.

And for those who are saying the woman could take the OP to court, given the immense backlog in the courts at the moment the reality is that it just wouldn’t happen in time. This isn’t an urgent case, and no court is going to order a puppy be given to someone who has been financially reimbursed for the deposit she paid for it.

@honeybee88

Get off your high horse! Wtf. Its a dog. She is going to walk it! If I was her I wouldn't want a dog off you...you seem like a right bitch. She has just broken up with her husband and now you are taking her puppy away. Jeez....if I ever wanted a dog...at least now I know to lie and say I live in a biiig house with a biig garden....

I think I've seen it all now, wow, somebody is having a bad day.. clearly

@THEDEACON

We were farmers now retired to penthouse flat no garden We homeboard all sorts of breeds for a franchise the owner reckons we exercise and give the dogs far better experience than many who have a garden and only toilet and exercise the dogs in garden Your puppy your choice but ......

And that's great but being that there are 2 of you, both retired, means you have plenty more time to take care of your temporary homeboards. The 2 sets of circumstances are totally different.

My son is a law student and he tells me you made “the contract” under the belief she lived in a house with garden and able to meet the dog’s needs - she’s had however changed the game so the contract is void. Send her money back by signed for recorded delivery. She hadn’t a leg to stand on.

@twistered
OP? Dont know what that means? My sister lives in a flat with a big dog. She walks it ywice a day and it cones to work with her most days. When it doesn't she goes home at lunchtime to walk it. What is the problem with a flat? I personally wouldnt have a dog unless I lived on a farm as I would not be walking it. Not a dog lover really. But if I wanted one I sure as hell would get one and wouldnt put up with someone telling me I couldnt have one because I lived in a flat!

So @honeybee88 is saying she would lie, in order to buy a dog to live in unsuitable circumstances. That shows a worrying disregard for the well being of the animal, but is a good example of “I want so I must have” entitlement.

Send a cheque with a formal letter explaining why she in breach of the agreement.

If she then wants to take you to court you have something showing you explained why you felt obliged to no longer sell her a puppy

I think you’re absolutely doing the right thing. And legally I suspect she wouldn’t have a leg to stand on.

She hasn’t paid for the pup yet, therefore it isn’t her property yet, she’s only paid a deposit and they are refundable, which you’ve offered to do. So she can threaten all she likes, because I doubt she’ll get anywhere.

Do as others have suggested and send a cheque (recorded) to her new address. Alternatively, if she transferred the money via bank transfer to you, it may be worth speaking to the bank to see if they can reverse the payment. Keep all communications you have of where you’ve discussed the return of the deposit, unsuitability of the new property etc, just so you have them to fall back on as evidence should you need them (doubt you will, but never hurts to err on the side of caution).

The selfishness of some people always astounds me. I’ve wanted a dog for years. Couldn’t have one as a kiddy because my mom was/is allergic to fur.
I’ve got a real love for Yorkie Terriers and would love one, but I live in a first floor flat and although I have good outdoor space (country park/fields) on my doorstep and the flat is large enough for a small dog, I still wouldn’t feel right about keeping one in a flat. Not just that but I have to be practical about who can look after the dog etc when I’m not at home. The dogs welfare outweighs my wants, every time.

Of course you are not being unreasonable, and thank you for being a responsible breeder xx

We have a medium, energetic breed in a flat and it’s worked out great. No issues toilet training, regular set times to take him out to toilet and we are spoiled for choice in terms of long interesting walks and runs around us. We do spend a lot of time outdoors though and someone is always with him as he barks if left alone and there is the extra consideration of neighbours in a flat. Plus we’re ground floor, I imagine it’s tricky getting them downstairs and put quickly as pups.
I don’t think it’s always a welfare issue, depending on the persons lifestyle and other factors.

However, as the pups are yours, I definitely don’t think YABU to refuse sale for any reason that makes you uncomfortable. I’d worry too that someone going through a fresh separation might be biting off more than they can chew with the extra pressure of a puppy.