To ask wtf is cis privilege and why does it need to be tackled

[KateWinceyette]

Seriously, what is cis privilege? My phone doesn't know because it corrected it to customer privilege!

Please explain to me in simple terms for I am simply a woman who doesn't get it.

It also seems like a fairly crass example because

Loads of women and girls are ambivalent about or dislike their periods

Around the world loads of girls miss out on education because of them

Being banished to a menstrual hut happens in some places:
'The use of menstrual huts continues to be the cause of death, from exposure, dehydration, snake bite, smoke inhalation, and so on.[1] The use of these huts is illegal in some places.'

There is more.

To use an example about periods, in the context of privilege. Seems tone deaf, ignorant, or deliberately goady tbh.

Also why do these sort of things never say men stuff. EG at my work the expression 'balls deep (in work)' is used. That really is grim. Why is it never that sort of thing?

Pedal pushers-

I'd be interested in your view on their choice of an example that is about periods.

I've never heard anyone say all women hate their periods

Plus see my post above.

Do you feel that this was a good choice of example?

@Pedalpushers

This thread is woefully misunderstanding the concept of privilege. If you have any sort of privilege it does NOT mean your life is in no way difficult for any means. Cis privilege does NOT mean being a woman is not hard or that it doesn't come with its own oppression, it literally just means that whatever oppression you experience as a person is not because of being transgender. Same as white privilege - it doesn't mean that every white person has a charmed life, just that their life isn't more difficult on account of being white.

Whether or not 'privilege' should come into universities etc. is a separate discussion, but the concept is VERY simple. There is a word that accounts for the specific hardships of being a woman - it's called male privilege.

Ooh so a Trans Woman has Male Privilege and Trans Privilege.

This report is another brilliant reason to bring back stocks on village greens so all of us can get rid of mouldy veg etc onto the bodies, faces and hands of authors of such dross. Imvho.

It's nonsense.
Just some made-up faux outrage by remarkably privileged people who are really uncomfortable with their privilege, so try to deflect.

I was listening to any questions the other day and the Scottish green leader and the Labour person was so dismissive of all of this stuff on women it made me angry.

Are there cis men too?🤔

In theory...

But strangely the focus on inclusive language etc seems to be entirely directed at women and invariably around our reproductive biology.

The more I think about it the more I boggle at them choosing periods, a well known area for activism and something that causes us problems all over the world. I mean period poverty in the UK has been in the news a lot recently, let alone the other stuff I mentioned.

It's just so utterly crass and offensive.

I'm really interested in what pedal pushers thinks of my comments 0049.

@HermioneWeasley

It’s the equivalent of claiming that atheists have privilege because they don’t suffer from religious discrimination. It’s a concept best ignored

Yes. I was actually trying to think of an analogy but this sums it up perfectly.

Some people identify or need to think of themselves as specific genders or sex, cis as far as I'm aware means you identify as the gender or sex you were born with.
I absolutely despise it as a concept because for many it just doesn't make sense. I'm just me. In my head. I don't identify or pin my flag to anything. I have a functioning body. I accept it as a body. It has parts that are female.
I'm not a cis woman I'm just a woman.

@unwuthering

Anyone who uses the term 'cis' is a cock, regardless of what they mean by it.

It just occurred to me, when I was a kid, we used ‘sis’ (sounds the same as ‘cis’) as a synonym for ‘yuck’ or ‘ewwww’.

I wonder if that has occurred to people who use the phrase ‘cis-woman’? It puts it in a new light!

Why aren't people referred to as Not Trans instead of Cis

Well, simply being referred to as "women" works for me. Women aren't "not" anything but adult human people.

It means you have a privilege to never be discriminated against because of your cis status. It doesn't mean you're privileged in general and have it easy, it means if you come face to face with transphobia it won't affect you because you're not trans.

Like white privilege. It doesn't mean you have it easy because you're white, it means systemic racism doesn't affect you.
Cis people can have a huge range of issues that means they're at a disadvantage, but they're at an advantage if there is transphobia because they are not trans. Literally that's all.
Straight privilege is the same. You're never going to be attacked by homophobes because you're straight.

Who in real life actually identifies as cis? Very few people I imagine. If you identify as trans fair enough, but to cast everyone who doesn't as cis is arrogant and unthinking. My "son" is trans and tried to pull this shit.

No fucking way, just because I don't call myself trans, doesn't mean I fully identify with the whole gender shit. Boils my fucking piss.

Firstly loads of women don't identify as cis. So they don't have cis privilege?

Secondly, gender ID is internal not external. No one can tell by looking at you what the gender in your head is. And people can dress however they want. Does a non binary female who presents as a woman and enjoys a 'femme' look get treated any differently to a female who does not have a trans identity?

Yes trans people who present themselves in non conforming ways will get shit. Especially males. How does this differ from the shit that men who are not trans but she gender non conforming get? Isn't it from the exact same place? But the GNC person has privilege over the trans person, even if they have the same style of presentation?

And it's not just about discrimination. The concept of privilege involves much more involved, widespread, often subtle things. To frame it as simplistically as discrimination loses an awful lot of what the originators of the concept were talking about.

'Straight privilege is the same. You're never going to be attacked by homophobes because you're straight.'

Does a girl born into a society where she will have little to no choice in who she marries or when she has sex have straight privilege if she is straight? Over a girl who is bisexual or lesbian in the same society?

The concepts of privilege, intersectionality were important. Useful. Thought provoking.

Until the terms got adopted by people who morphed it into oppression Olympics and telling people off thereby alienating them and using it as a way to get people to shut up if they didn't like what they were saying etc etc

I'd love to know when my cis privelige starts. Was it when I was cleaning menstrual blood from the toilet after my "son"? Fucking tumblr has a lot to answer for.

Does a girl born into a society where she will have little to no choice in who she marries or when she has sex have straight privilege if she is straight? Over a girl who is bisexual or lesbian in the same society?

In that situation the privilege would likely be more for men who get to marry who they want to.. You're looking at it as a different thing to what it is. It's not saying that being cis means you don't have any disadvantages, it simply means you're advantaged above a trans person when it comes to transphobia.
If a cis person and a trans person go for a job and the person hiring is transphobic, the cis person has the privilege to not be judged in that situation on their gender identity. The same way a sexist boss would hire a man over a woman because they're sexist means the man has male privilege.

It's not an attack on anyone saying they have it easy. Cis people are likely to be disadvantaged somewhere else. Whether it's age, race, class etc we all have different privileges and different disadvantages.

I was once attacked when I was younger with my girlfriend. In that moment it didn't matter that I was bisexual and she was lesbian because we were both attacked. But because I'm bisexual I've had a lot less homophobic attacks in my life than she has. I was still hospitalised because of that attack and it's stayed with me. But I have an advantage that since then I'm "straight appearing" and therefore haven't been attacked again. But I know she's faced homophobia a lot.
Having privilege doesn't take anything from you and doesn't mean you're not oppressed. It means you're privileged in one specific area of life compared to another person.

If only there was a database of information online where someone who genuinely wants to expand their understanding could type their question and immediately receive information.

@DifferentHair erm duckduckgo? Id say Google, but it's shite

Also the reason any kind of privilege needs tackling is so people are not discriminated against in society and we move towards a more equal future.

Just like white privilege or male privilege or straight privilege, cis privilege keeps a disadvantage and inequality against people who are not cis. It's not about raising trans people above cis people or oppressing cis people, it's about removing the discrimination and making cis people and trans people equal.
Say for example we wanted to get rid of rich privilege, it doesn't mean that we take all the money off of rich people to give to the poor, that would just be swapping the discrimination between the people. But by removing the power money holds over certain things in life we would create more equality. So by making things more affordable to everyone, taking away the power of expensive things that affect our reputation and by making education and training more accessible to everyone regardless of money, we remove the privilege of rich people in more parts of society.
That's the same with cis privilege. Its not saying you're not working hard to get where you are or saying you should be oppressed. It's saying that while there is transphobia in society you benefit from being cis in that exact situation because you will never encounter inequality because of transphobia. To remove cis privilege is not to punish cis people but to take away the discrimination against trans people.

Victoria you reiterate that it's not about having no problems at all, and mention discrimination again. And that no one is trying to take anything away from anyone.

Yes I understand the concept of privilege in this context. Why do you assume that the women on this thread just don't understand?

The other points i made though.

Gender ID is in your head and can't be seen. Many people do not identify as cis, or trans. Plenty of people identity as trans but present in a way standard for their sex.

If you have 3 people in a line.

One who identifies as cis, one who identifies as trans, one who identifies as neither. All present in a way usual for their sex. How is the first person privileged?

I suppose because the trans person feels unable to present as they wish.. Although plenty of trans people are comfy presenting in line with their sex. But that's by the by. In what way is a trans person who presents in a way not aligned with their sex worse off than a cis person who presents in a way not aligned with their sex?

In the end is it not the same as GNC people get and rooted in misogyny and homophobia?

I think it's about living in actual reality, rather than some fantasy. People remain the sex that they are born, rich people have a great advantage, men oppress women. Unless you acknowledge reality you cannot change it, trying to change people's perception of shit does nothing.

What advantage do girls and women get through being seen as girls and women? Given the sort of risks and oppression they face around the world?

What do you make of those who switch their presentation, sometimes in order to leverage the privilege one of the presentations confers?

What do you make pieces by transmen saying the way they are treated is very different and much better than before they transitioned?