To say that your if daughter tells you she feels the same as Elliot Page

[Notagain20]

... To please explore all the reasons why she might feel intensely uncomfortable with her growing female body, and not just assume she's transgender?

There's such an epidemic of sexual assault, harassment and sexualised bullying towards girls of all ages. Kids are exposed to violent porn from the moment they can use a phone. Eating disorders are exploding, further evidence that hatred of bodies is rife among young people. Adolescence has always been a storm of hormones and emotions, girls have always discovered that their bodies are treated as public property but that is so much worse now.

If your daughter hates her female body please don't assume she's transgender. She might be, but it's far more likely that she is having a normal response to a really sexist society. She needs your help to discover how women throughout time have helped each other navigate this experience, looked after each other, and organised together to change things.

‘Being trans’ is an expression of distress (or a sexual fetish)

Try listening.

The two most read articles in the graun yesterday were a man having multiple allegations of sexual harassment against women made against him, and a woman who now identifies as a man proselytising about how great it is getting her breasts chopped off. Why are people not joining the dots here? How much more obvious does it need to be made what the problem is?

@BanginChoons

No-one is born in the wrong body. ‘Being trans’ is an expression of distress (or a sexual fetish).

There was a time when being gay was considered a mental illness.

Since when did being gay mean making irreversible changes to your body? Absolutely no relevence to being gay and being trans.

People used to be oppressed for being gay, therefore if you feel youd be happier as an amputee or have dysmorphia and think you look hideous and need to starve yourself etc then that is valid? This is what that sounds like to me

My eldest son is gay. He simply is, in the same way he has brown eyes and dark hair. In the 50s and 60s gay people were often diagnosed as ill with electric shock treatment and hormones being prescribed. If your child believes they may be gay or transgender I would encourage you to listen carefully. There may indeed be other things going on in their lives that are impacting the way they feel about their body. I agree this is a difficult time to be a girl or a woman. Equally there may not be. Our children are entitled to be who they are. These needs a lot of thought and consideration, but that is what we should be doing. Helping, supporting, and in no way judging.

@BanginChoons

If someone tells you who they are, maybe you should believe them.

At what age? Do we believe our 4 year old who insists they are a dinosaur? It’s not a case of not believing them, they just don’t know what they are at that age Maybe they are trans and we should let them and help them explore that safely but we shouldn’t exclude other possibilities

By view would be, keep an open mind, but avoid doing anything radical.

I believe that some people are genuinely trans. Equally I believe that there are many other reasons why the changing female body during puberty could make teens uncomfortable.

The teenage years are a confusing period at the best of times. Unpacking the reasons for discomfort could take a while, it’s very important here not to jump to conclusions and to go slow.

Hair starts growing in odd places

And they are bombarded with messages about how that hair is disgusting and they must remove it.

In the 90s I had an account which I was going to use for a mastectomy - had £3000 in it by the time I was 18 as I put every penny I had into it. I wore baggy clothes and had short hair, rejected anything even slightly feminine, insisted on the male version of my name. Hated the attention my large boobs got from creepy men and boys (including my lecherous uncle). Hated having periods, hated the changes in my body, swore never to have children ever. Dreamed of a male body and living as a man. Desisted at university when I discovered radical feminism and decided to fight society rather than my own body.

I think a lot of the problem is people assuming that their body needs to be making a statement about who they are. Maybe this doesn’t make sense, but it seems like a lot of people lately view their body as something separate from them, so I’m not surprised they feel disconnected from it.

I think if young girls have body issues, while body positivity can be kindly meant, it’s sometimes more helpful just to view your body as you. Focus on the things it can do for you rather than it making any kind of statement.

This is coming from someone who struggled with gender confusion in my early 20s (though I never really spoke to anyone about it until after I had sorted through it by myself). While transitioning can be helpful for adults, I think more focus should be on the fact that your body and mind don’t need to match, because they are the same.
Maybe I’m just talking out of my arse though.

Indeed Branleuse. An anorexic child may sincerely believe that they're fat. This isn't a lie for them, it's true, and they're happier when they lose weight.

However we'd bloody judge their doctors and parents who agreed and enabled them.

@Thatisnotwhatisaid

My 9 year old often says she wishes she was a boy. It stems mostly from boys not having to have periods or breasts and the fact boys don’t seem to have silly arguments and fall out with each other constantly like girls do. She sadly does seem to have a lot of negativity towards her own sex despite me raising her with a feminist approach. We have plenty of books about amazing women, we talk about how great women are and she has a strong girls club T-shirt too but she sadly currently feels life would be easier as a boy. Tbh she’s probably right, men do have it easier in many ways...

Anyway, I would never jump straight into the ‘oh you must be transgender’ approach with a child. Children experiment with all manners of different identities over the years.

I think it is important to recognise and explore her feelings. Yes, it can be tough being a woman in our patriarchal world. Only ever showing women as strong etc can set up for her an image of an ideal woman that seems as unachievable as Barbie.

Agree op. Some things are actually a ‘phase’.

@BanginChoons

If someone tells you who they are, maybe you should believe them.

It is not possible to be the opposite sex. If a child tells you this they are either confused, distressed or experimenting. Without exploring these things you cannot support your child fully.

[quote Ponoka7]@BanginChoons

"If someone tells you who they are, maybe you should believe them."

Adults yes, but children/teens, particularly girls, do go through phases of self loathing, or wanting to be boys. So their feelings need to be explored and they need help to work out how they really feel and why.[/quote]
And very specifically - young lesbians.

In years to come we will look back on this time with shame.

@JellySlice. Sorry but I do not agree. Gender dysmorphia is a well diagnosed condition. There will be some girls and boys who will wish to transition and will need support in doing so. I agree there may be other things that are contributing to a desire to be different and careful consideration is required, but some people genuinely need to transition.

There is a big difference between -
1.I feel like a boy
and

1. I want to be a boy because they don't have periods/breasts and sexual harassment to deal with.

The latter is how I suspect most girls feel going through puberty - I for one did not enjoy having the boys stood at the end of the sand pit when I did the long jump watching my boobs going up and down as their heads bobbed up and down in unison. I would not be exploring transition for my DDs if they expressed this. I would help them to understand it and appreciate it is a temporary, shitty part of growing up.

Adults yes, but children/teens, particularly girls, do go through phases of self loathing, or wanting to be boys. So their feelings need to be explored and they need help to work out how they really feel and why.

Yes I absolutely agree. However the lack of services make it near impossible to access support for a non gender conforming child or teen.

Contrary to popular opinion, blockers and testosterone gel are not distributed to under 18s with gay abandon. In fact the waiting list to access even an initial appointment or counselling to wade through the minefield that is gender dysphoria is 3-4 years long, and growing.

Obviously in real life if its your own child rather than discussing with strangers on an anonymous internet board, there is a fine balance and listening and discussing how they feel and why is hugely important.
Hopefully people arent going to immediately dismiss their childs feelings , but also it would be a bit weird to immediately just validate it all and believe everything they think with no discussion.
Teenagers often have a hard time with bodies changing. Conflicting feelings about their identity and working out who they are in the world. Its complicated. A lot of gender critical people have kids who are gender non conforming and thats whats led them to investigate and educate themselves on the topic of gender and they are well aware theres a balance to be had between being supportive, yet realistic. Such a huge issue

Oh I don't know. I came out as a trans man when I was 15. It was right for me at the time and being validated by my mum did help a whole lot in at least giving me the space to explore that posibility.

I'm not a trans man now, several years later. I'm non binary but identify more with womanhood in a political sense than I do with manhood, and don't (and never have) taken blockers or T. But I do also think I would still be quite miserable today if I wasn't given the option to explore being a trans man. It helped me understand my gender identity and sexuality on a level that I wouldn't have been able to do, otherwise.

*They look very ill and uncomfortable despite being “their best self”

I agree.
I wanted so much to put my arms around Elliot watching that interview.

@puppychaos

I’m glad you had support from your mum

@Mumoblue

I think a lot of the problem is people assuming that their body needs to be making a statement about who they are. Maybe this doesn’t make sense, but it seems like a lot of people lately view their body as something separate from them, so I’m not surprised they feel disconnected from it.

I think if young girls have body issues, while body positivity can be kindly meant, it’s sometimes more helpful just to view your body as you. Focus on the things it can do for you rather than it making any kind of statement.

This is coming from someone who struggled with gender confusion in my early 20s (though I never really spoke to anyone about it until after I had sorted through it by myself). While transitioning can be helpful for adults, I think more focus should be on the fact that your body and mind don’t need to match, because they are the same.
Maybe I’m just talking out of my arse though.

I agree with this and don't think you're talking out of your arse. I see it with our teen DC and their friends. There is a disconnect and there's also a degree of using their bodies to make statements (which is understandable in a world saturated with social media and porn). Bodies become currency and agency - but also become about an external audience rather than internal connection. As someone who strongly resisted labels, I find it fascinating that the teens we know are all so keen to stick labels on themselves and each other. We've had lots of conversations with our teen about this - about how they might see a label as liberating just now or as necessary to 'fit' in but actually that label can be restrictive if they decide it doesn't apply any more. I think Elliot Page has looked unhappy and uncomfortable for a long time. I hope they find happiness but am sadly aware that elective surgery hasn't been proven to change outcomes for depression or MH issues relating to dysphoria. I also think high profile campaigns and interviews aren't necessarily a kindness to someone undergoing big changes. I wish Oprah was more interested in duty of care to her interviewees rather than catching headlines.

YANBU, OP.

Children and young people need proper support, not unquestioning 'affirmation'.

No ideology that requires extensive and sometimes dangerous medical treatments on a healthy body sounds like something that children and young people should be encouraged to align with.

There is no such thing as the 'wrong body'.