Year 1 child had accident at school and they had no spare clothes - AIBU?

[ArtemisFlop]

I'd appreciate views about this as I'm turning it over in my mind and feel really uncomfortable (cross!)
DD in year 1 had an accident at school on Thursday, apparently not long before pick up time. This hasn't happened in year 1 before, pretty unusual for DD. In reception we took spare clothes to school but hadn't thought of it when we went back to school after the last lockdown ending in March. After-school nanny called me at work sounding quite worried and said she didn't know what to do as she has been due to take the kids to older child's activity but the TA had handed DD over to her in the playground at pick up time and DD was absolutely soaked. Nanny asked TA if they'd got some spare clothes so she could change her before coming home and TA said they don't have spare clothes and would usually just call a parent and ask them to come in with some but as it had happened so close to pick up they didn't think there'd be time. Nanny ended up bringing both kids straight home so DD could change but we live 30 minutes walk or a 15 minute bus ride from school so DD was wet through all that time plus however long it was before end of the school day that she wet herself. Nanny also told me the conversation about this took place in front of a bunch of DD's classmates and other parents. She said she felt like they just couldn't wait to hand over DD so it was someone else's problem.
I saw the TA in the playground the next day whilst handing over spare clothes for DD which I'll ask them to keep on her leg in case of any further incidents. I told her I was very surprised and disappointed they hadn't been able to offer a change of clothes. T A was apologetic but kept saying 'but I expected to see you shortly' as if the problem had been that nanny picked up and not me. I told her whether it was me or the nanny DD would have the same journey home. But the TA just said they don't have clothes for children and mumbled something about COViD. Have since received an email from the class teacher basically saying the same thing (ie sorry, not sorry).
For info this is a very large primary with a wide catchment and so there'll be many other families who don't live on the doorstep.
AIBU or should primary schools have a change of clothes for the occasional accidents and not leave children in wet clothes until parents arrive?

What is really coming out of this is that (some) schools are not suitable places for young children who may need help with personal care. Especially if children are not allowed to bring bags in/parents can't access the toilets to help their children, it is the school's responsibility to care for these children if their parents aren't there.

@Jamboree01 I do work with children. I’m also a parent to a bunch of them. And if the school don’t have spare clothing then they don’t. It’s that simple. That’s not to say I would say that to the child but it’s the fact of the matter that it’s not the end of the world.

I'd still offer to get then changed and believe that's what this TA should have done. However it may have to wait. Fortunately waiting to change for 15 minutes or so won't damage the child, especially if just wet rather than soiled.

But in this instance there weren't any spare clothes. In my own work place I could have absolutely put the 6 year old in some age 13 pants or joggers while the rest of the class were being dismissed however in this case there was nothing available as per school policy which should be known to parents.

It's the expectation and entitlement that really bothers me.

I'm in no way on the school's side but comments like "schools should source them by whatever means" , "schools should have" , "schools should buy" and the never ending ,self replacing stock.

I have no idea why exactly this happened at OP's school. OP should definitely email/talk to the head and enquire about that and ask for change.

Over the years according to MN schools "should" have spare everything a child might need at some point or another... clothes, books,pens,food, sun cream,hats,warmer clothes, asthma inhalers, shoes, water bottles , toilets and so on. When they don't they're being made to sound like Dickensian orphanages with lazy,cruel,horrible staff that don't give a shit about children.

If a nursery were to run out of nappies, is it acceptable to leave babies until they go home in soiled or wet nappies?

All of that is great in theory. And if I had spare staff hanging around to do these things it would be great.

This is about priorities.

There are circumstances where the wellbeing of the child would be prioritised and someone would find a way to support/supervise them while the others are dismissed. This is a time when that should have happened to protect the child's dignity and well-being.

If you genuinely can't ever do that, you need to raise a safeguarding concern with the SLT.

@Jellybabiesforbreakfast

If a nursery were to run out of nappies, is it acceptable to leave babies until they go home in soiled or wet nappies?

Parents normally provide the nappies and if they don't I assume the cost of them is included in the price of nurseries. Don't pretend like it's some altruistic service.

You can't compare it to nursery, it's a policy that nursery staff will do it whenever needed. The school policy is different. It's stated that their policy is to call parents of dc do not have their own, unfortunately on this occasion it was too late to do so.

@AccidentallyOnPurpose. What does the cost have to do with it? Babies need nappies. Young children who have accidents need a change of clothes. If you're going to be in charge of looking after vulnerable young children, you need to have these things to hand in case they are needed, regardless of who pays for them. Our childminder occasionally ran out of the nappies I supplied for my DS when he was a baby... she changed him using her own supply and asked me to bring more. If she'd left him in a dirty nappy, I would have been reporting her and moving him. Because it's not an acceptable standard of care.

@Loopylobes

All of that is great in theory. And if I had spare staff hanging around to do these things it would be great.

This is about priorities.

There are circumstances where the wellbeing of the child would be prioritised and someone would find a way to support/supervise them while the others are dismissed. This is a time when that should have happened to protect the child's dignity and well-being.

If you genuinely can't ever do that, you need to raise a safeguarding concern with the SLT.

Absolute bollocks.

My only priority is to keep all children in my class safe.

Yes it would be lovely to have private chats with every parent every day.

Yes it would be lovely to have a member of support staff to cover my class while I dealt with an issue.

I agree with a PP (@Abraxan I think) is who explained about leaving the child in the classroom while I dismissed the rest. Sadly this is also risky as you are leaving a child unsupervised and what's to stop them wandering off?

School staff are hugely stretched and doing the best we can.

I would absolutely not have left a child wet and dismissed them wet. I would find a way, but I'm already 'finding a way' for me to nip to the toilet, for me to ring a parent about another concern, for me to support another teacher who is 'trying to find a way' to do a million things as well.

@Blueeyedgirl21

Lots of heads and academy heads on lovely big wages

To quantify, £2,500 more than I was as a teacher. Does that mean I have to buy clothes for the children I lead? Even for the children of parents who earn more than me?

If you mean academy CEO's on over £100,000 each...I agree with you but they won't even be in the school, never mind providing spare clothes.

School should email parents and ask for donations and ask for anything borrowed to be returned. Hardly an expensive thing. It really doesn't need to be a drama in terms of having stuff. Over the years my kids were at primary often had requests for suitable donations.

I would be crossed if mine were sent home wet however I do know that often spare clothes are not returned so maybe they ran out.

@midnightstar66

You can't compare it to nursery, it's a policy that nursery staff will do it whenever needed. The school policy is different. It's stated that their policy is to call parents of dc do not have their own, unfortunately on this occasion it was too late to do so.

Have they made an exception for allowing parents into the school then as at our school we are not allowing anyone in. Hence why we ensure we have spares should they be needed. Seems a great policy if all parents live locally and can get to school at short notice but not so good when covid dictates no-one is allowed in.

Have they made an exception for allowing parents into the school then as at our school we are not allowing anyone in. Hence why we ensure we have spares should they be needed. Seems a great policy if all parents live locally and can get to school at short notice but not so good when covid dictates no-one is allowed in.

I've no idea what exceptions the school of a stranger on mumsnet is making, however I'd assume clothing to be handed over at the school gate or front door? If parents live far away or work then it would be wise to include a change of clothing to save having to do this, if you attend a school with this policy.

Even 20-odd years ago, letters were going out to parents asking if they could donate outgrown clothes for accidents. I wasn't called towards the end of the school day because they knew I was either walking or on a bus if an accident happened at the last minute and they'd run out of spares. Well, that and the previously mentioned not being able to abandon the class to cross the site and get a phone call made.

At risk of derailing, though, can I ask that parents of Secondary children also donate uniform items both during their school years and at the end of key stage?

The things we need most (although we will take anything that's clean, even if it's got a hole or is stained/frayed) are

Shirts in larger sizes. It's not unheard of to have a kid almost bursting out of a blouse or shirt and whilst more 14 year olds will be no more than a 34 chest and we can just give a smaller child who is soaked through in the rain a shirt that's huge on them, there are significant numbers who are 38, 40 and 42, plus a fair number that are 44.

Skirts and trousers. We get a fair few of these, especially from 26 to 30, not so many larger sizes, though.

TIES. We never get ties.

Jumpers, If we don't have a blazer in a near enough size, if we have jumpers, at least they won't get cold whilst their blazer is on a radiator drying off.

SOCKS. Socks get wet and muddy, they get blood on them from blisters, they get caught with particularly heavy periods. We never get socks.

PE BOTTOMS. Shorts help for emergency backup for period leakages (as we don't have underwear, but it makes the girls more comfortable around their legs at least), with trackie bottoms as further backup. And they're equally handy for boys who have split their trousers during a game of football at break.

Shoes and trainers. It really helps, as you get kids trailing blood from blisters or we've Gorilla glued the soles on so many times, they just can't be fixed anymore and they're very self conscious when walking around with soles flapping like ducks. I've not seen a spare pair of size 6 for ages. Quite a few 4s and 5s, though, despite many kids being much larger than that.

If the school insists on particular bags, they are also useful once somebody leaves the school - for drinks leaking (very common) or straps tearing.

It would also be massively helpful if we had access to emergency clean up kits/hypoallergenic wipes for menstrual leakages. The budget for first aid stuff is already spent on millions of ice packs, plasters, bandages, dressings and EpiPens/inhalers/defibs and the free sanitary scheme doesn't have any to order, or we'd have those already.

Seriously @NeverDropYourMoonCup (love your name ) I've literally never been asked because I would have donated gladly.

But I will ask the current school as I have at least one jumper that's never been worn, trousers and tracker bottoms plus a couple of outgrown PE tops and shirts. No ties. I'm hoping I can get away with the two per child I have on rotation at the moment until 6th form

Both DS and DD's school have a rule that children up to year 2 must have a plastic bag on their peg containing spare pants, socks and joggers.

If you are worried about your DS doing this again it may be worth asking if you can do the same - cheap pants and joggers that wont necessarily be missed but could prove very useful.

YANBU though, sending him home soaking wet was inappropriate

We started the year with approximately 30 pairs of pants/knickers, 10 pairs of shorts, and another 7 or 8 pairs of leggings and tracksuit trousers.

The underwear had the school's name written across the back in sharpie. The rest of the clothes were lost property from previous years.

By Christmas every single item had been used, taken home and not returned. One of the parents, who hadn't been returning clothes or providing their own spares, actually complained because their DS had to go home in a pair of grey joggers with a pink stripe. They were all we had left but that wasn't good enough as the pink stripe apparently meant they were girls' clothes.

We have spare nappies and pull-ups for the children who aren't yet toilet-trained, and a big supply of sanitary towels so that the girls who don't have any can have their own supply to take home too.

As a school there just isn't the money to buy enough spare pants and knickers for every class. Even a single pack of knickers and a single pack of pants for each of our 14 classes would cost around £140. Our budget is so tight that we have teachers regularly buying pencils, glue sticks, paints and craft equipment for their class to use.

We absolutely would have phoned home in the OP's situation and have never knowingly sent a child home wet but I can completely understand how another school could have absolutely nothing left for a child to wear.

We had to have a signing in and out book of spare clothes sent home, even with that it had all gone well before Easter!

Our school has run out of spare clothes. All extra were used and not returned and cant take old uniforms from parents like we used to due to covid.

I think nursery/reception I would expect them to have some spares but not Y1. If the child is liable to accidents it’s up to the parents to send clothes in, in my opinion.

@Saltyslug

A text and email from my school to all parents of infant children requesting old uniform meant there was more then enough spares. They trickled in for years after the request.

We've had this too. Plenty of parents are happy to donate outgrown things.

DS (6) and a friend managed to find a muddy puddle one day during break, and came in covered in it - teacher sorted them out with spare clothes (not full uniform, but joggers and a jumper). I would expect that to be the norm, particularly because the younger ones don't have school bags to bring spares in. School have limited space and don't really want 25 bags of spare clothes hanging in the cloakroom.

OP, I would speak directly to the teacher, and if you don't get a satisfactory response, go to the head. If they don't have the resources to buy spare stuff, maybe offer to ask around the parents in the class to get donations? Doesn't have to be uniform (though that would be good), but any outgrown tops or bottoms would likely be a help.

@Fieldoftheclothofgold

I think nursery/reception I would expect them to have some spares but not Y1. If the child is liable to accidents it’s up to the parents to send clothes in, in my opinion.

But any child, of any age, can have an accident that leaves them needing to change - nosebleeds, vomit, someone spilling something on them, even catching a pocket on a door handle and ripping trousers or something really random like that. I would expect there to be some provision for these kinds of events.

But any child, of any age, can have an accident that leaves them needing to change - nosebleeds, vomit, someone spilling something on them, even catching a pocket on a door handle and ripping trousers or something really random like that

I wouldn’t expect schools to provide a full change in some of those cases. The stuff would never come back and they’d be spending a non-existent budget on it.